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Point #1 happens TODAY. No health plan allows unlimited treatment. It cracks me up that earlier there was a post claiming that astrophysicist Stephen Hawking would have been allowed to die under the British UHC system because of rationing of treatment - when in fact Hawking was TREATED under the British UHC - and is alive BECAUSE of his treatment under that plan.
Point #2 is true TODAY with EVERY health insurance provider in the US. Such life and death decision are made virtually every day.
Point #3 is not backed by ANY evidence whatsoever other than your personal paranoia.
Ken
There seems to be an almost blind intoxication with anything "free market" in this country as if business can do no wrong and government can do no good. I keep seeing people post these "horror" stories about instances of failed health care in Britain or Canada, yet they never seem to point out the numerous MORE times that private insurance companies fail people here (mainly those who can't afford the good plans).
Insurance companies, like any for-profit business, make money by bringing in payments and putting out as little as possible in terms of expenses. The less they treat people, the more profit they make.
We have a death-care system. The movie Sicko did a good job of telling some of these stories (albeit with an agenda, but the stories are real).
unlicenced treatments are not given by imsurance companies either. The Insurance company wouldn't even have given her "pastoral" care. This story is not what it seems. Patients die in private clinics and Hospitals every day because of refusal to administer certain drugs due to the advanced cancer or the drug regime being expensive.
The whole story about the woman in Oregon is sad. If I could wave a wand I would cure her. If we could spend $10 million for a 90% chance, even a 50% chance, of saving her life I would say go for it but from what I have read her chances are near zero.
And people are right, the nation simply can not afford 100% effort in every case. Just not possible.
Life and death decisions will be made on treatment. Scarey to think about because non of us want to face our own mortality.
But I can tell you this in the strongest terms possible. I do not want some government buracracy to be the one to set limits. I am afraid these people would end up like the California DMV and you know how that is. I would rather have limits set by insurance carriers because those people I can fight.
I would love to see your reaction when you realize the people pushing this propaganda have LIED to you.
~ButterBrownBiscuit~
Quote:
Originally Posted by mossomo
My point Ken & who etcs was:
#1 - UHC will be rationed health care.
#2 - There will be a panel or doctrine deciding who dies, the death panel is not a myth, in some form or shape it will exist and they will decide if you live, die and if death then you are given an option to choose on your own recognizance gov't funded assisted suicide.
#3 - Choice. I'm not convinced that UHC will allow for a private sector. And if no private sector, #1 and #2 get much more worrisome.
It is not paranoia to listen to the statements on record of many Dem politicians who support the elimination of the private sector involvement in health care.
But it is doctors/health care providers that really want that. The politicians you speak of, have not put that on the agenda, however. So, get your details right, and blame the proper group for not sticking to your ideology... and that will be health care providers.
The whole story about the woman in Oregon is sad. If I could wave a wand I would cure her. If we could spend $10 million for a 90% chance, even a 50% chance, of saving her life I would say go for it but from what I have read her chances are near zero.
And people are right, the nation simply can not afford 100% effort in every case. Just not possible.
Life and death decisions will be made on treatment. Scarey to think about because non of us want to face our own mortality.
But I can tell you this in the strongest terms possible. I do not want some government buracracy to be the one to set limits. I am afraid these people would end up like the California DMV and you know how that is. I would rather have limits set by insurance carriers because those people I can fight.
What a crock.
You would much rather that a CEO gets his employees to scrutanise your health claim for ANY reason that they can find to deny your treatment or medicines(this happens everyday in America) than have a medical authority consisting of Doctors and health professionals decide your treatment. A UHC is FUNDED by the Govt. and Administered by the health authority. This scare mongering about the Govt controlling your treatments , this imaginary Govt. Death board for example is complete rubbish. I know because i use a UHC everyday and so do billions all over the World. You don't see Countries with a UHC having this hate filled debate on healthcare...No because they are more than happy with how a UHC works.
[quote=nicet4;10255654]The whole story about the woman in Oregon is sad. If I could wave a wand I would cure her. If we could spend $10 million for a 90% chance, even a 50% chance, of saving her life I would say go for it but from what I have read her chances are near zero.
And people are right, the nation simply can not afford 100% effort in every case. Just not possible.
Life and death decisions will be made on treatment. Scarey to think about because non of us want to face our own mortality.
But I can tell you this in the strongest terms possible. I do not want some government buracracy to be the one to set limits. I am afraid these people would end up like the California DMV and you know how that is. I would rather have limits set by insurance carriers because those people I can fight.[/QUOTE]
You are joking?....aren't you....please say you are?
I would rather have limits set by insurance carriers because those people I can fight.
Do remember to call a few charities to pick up your pieces after the fight.
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