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View Poll Results: are we in an economic recovery?
yes, things are getting better 13 24.07%
no, things are not getting better 41 75.93%
Voters: 54. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-06-2009, 04:24 PM
 
Location: Great Falls, Montana
4,002 posts, read 3,905,319 times
Reputation: 1398

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Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
I have some buddies that got laid off and considered starting their own IT consulting business. They looked into the local and state contract work and the bidding for contracts and how that worked. Seems minority owned business are top of the list. Since they are a bunch of middle class non-minority guys they'd probably never get in the door.

They tried and the contracts are there but some of them sit waiting for the politically correct bid to be submitted.
The small business stimulus was a ruse anyhow ... our accountant was ask to look into it, and she did, and I'm not surprised by the outcome of it all.

I really know better than to flirt with the government on things of this nature anyway, and besides, we've made it through how many administrations and their B.S.? I've lost count ...

The bottom line here is that we'll make it, even in spite of the odds that are seemingly stacked so highly against us.

If I can keep our guys working through all of this economic mess, then I've scored a bigger victory as an American, than any politician that has ever been voted into office ... at least, that's the way I see it.
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Old 09-06-2009, 04:32 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,419 posts, read 20,306,967 times
Reputation: 8958
Quote:
Originally Posted by plannine View Post
Some think the recession has only been the last 6 month.........everything was fine before that.
For me, the recession really started the last year of the Bush administration. Prior to that, we had been doing reasonably well, though after the 9/11 attack (about six/eight months later, actually) when we went to war, and people started to worry about the future, our business slowed down a bit. Prior to that, we were often booked six weeks out. After that time, it was beginning to be a little bit of a struggle, but work would seem to come in just in time to avoid a serious shortfall.

This last year has been positively awful. My last job in 2008 was right before the election. I finished it a few days after. We had nothing from then until February 2009. Ask me if I was worried.
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Old 09-06-2009, 04:42 PM
 
Location: Great Falls, Montana
4,002 posts, read 3,905,319 times
Reputation: 1398
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
For me, the recession really started the last year of the Bush administration. Prior to that, we had been doing reasonably well, though after the 9/11 attack (about six/eight months later, actually) when we went to war, and people started to worry about the future, our business slowed down a bit. Prior to that, we were often booked six weeks out. After that time, it was beginning to be a little bit of a struggle, but work would seem to come in just in time to avoid a serious shortfall.

This last year has been positively awful. My last job in 2008 was right before the election. I finished it a few days after. We had nothing from then until February 2009. Ask me if I was worried.
We were preparing for all of this as far back as 2006 as I recall ... something having to do with "the writing being on the wall".

Since 2006, we've expanded into Washington state, Wyoming, and Texas ... If we would have waited until late 2007 to expand, it would have been too late and bankruptcy would have come knockin' on our door. (financing would have been impossible to get)

As it is now, operations are minimal in 3 states. We're working, allbeit in a razor thin sort of way. We'll make it, as it is hoped that you do too.
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Old 09-06-2009, 04:49 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,419 posts, read 20,306,967 times
Reputation: 8958
Quote:
Originally Posted by delusianne View Post
It's only been seven months, good Lord. Global catastrophes dont tie up when your attention span runs short. This is not a movie.
Obama could have turned this around in two or three months with the right moves if he had wanted to. He could have eliminated the Capital Gains tax (the highest of any country in the world). Instead he raised it! He could have promised to keep the Bush tax cuts in place. Instead he continues to say they will let them expire. He has threatened/promised higher taxes on business. This isn't good news for anyone, especially those who are the job creators. No one is expanding. Instead, they are downsizing and laying people off, expecting the worst.

Throwing money around everywhere, and not having any idea where it is going isn't helping either. People are extremely nervous about the ever expanding debt and deficit. Forget George Bush. He's gone, and his spending pales in comparison. This is all Obama's creation.

Stimulus? Where? When? Banks still aren't loaning money, and again, no one knows what they did with the money they were given.

Cash for Clunkers? Flop. Car dealers still haven't been paid, and some are really in trouble because of it. One buyer complained on the radio that he couldn't even drive the care he bought under the plan, because until the dealer gets paid, he can't get title. No title, no tags. It's sitting in his garage. And secondary to all this, a lot of good cars were destroyed, creating as shortage in the used car market. Short supply means higher prices. A lot of people who would be buying those cars now can't get one because, 1. They aren't available 2. Those that are available cost more. So this program hurts those with less income who usually buy used cars.

Murphy's law of unitended consequences.

Oh, and I almost forgot: Federal Revenue is way down. Funniest thing. It always happens when you increase taxes and regulation. But when taxes and regulation go down, revenue to the Fed goes up. There is a historical record of this (JFK, RWR, GWB). This isn't even disputable.
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Old 09-06-2009, 05:07 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,419 posts, read 20,306,967 times
Reputation: 8958
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLIGHTSIMMER View Post
There is no recovery until real jobs are created.
Short and sweet, and you did it in one short sentence! Congratulations.

You are 100% correct. And no jobs will be created until the government stops taxing and spending. That is the number one job killer. Leave people the hell alone, business will thrive, the economy will expand and people will be working and improving their lives, and their income.

Stifle business with burdensome taxes and regulation, growth slows, jobs shrink, and along with it the economy (the economy really is jobs, because without jobs, people do not spend).
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Old 09-06-2009, 05:14 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,419 posts, read 20,306,967 times
Reputation: 8958
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
True. Even when the economy seemed good, it was based on very easy credit, subprime loans and the housing bubble so it was not really a good economy.

We need jobs brought back into the USA and some kind of control over the border so that millions of dirt cheap workers aren't brought in to bring wages way down and welfare programs way up.
Well, those things are true too; but, we need jobs. In my opinion, jobs are King. They have to be. Without them, there is no money in circulation to spend.

Yes, "sub-prime" problem and "housing bubble" not good. But that was also caused by government meddling. If the government had not been forcing banks to make risky loans, that wouldn't have happened. Some have blamed "house flippers" also. I think that is such a small segment that it really had no effect (my non-expert opinion only) How many people do you know who have "flipped" a house and made a huge profit? TV makes it seem like it's going on everywhere.

There are two reasons for jobs going "offshore" that I can think of.
  1. High taxes. We have the highest Capital Gains rate in the world.
  2. High labor costs. This is a tricky one. But it sure doesn't surprise me that when unions demand ever increasing wages and benefits, beyond what is reasonable for a given job, manufacturers will look elsewhere (I'm not an expert on labor, but some things seem obvious, and I know people in unions and know what they get paid. They aren't hurting at all. They have a lot more money than I do and less responsiblity than I ever had working in the corporate world — in my former life! LOL).
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Old 09-06-2009, 05:17 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,481,831 times
Reputation: 27720
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
Well, those things are true too; but, we need jobs. In my opinion, jobs are King. They have to be. Without them, there is no money in circulation to spend.

Yes, "sub-prime" problem and "housing bubble" not good. But that was also caused by government meddling. If the government had not been forcing banks to make risky loans, that wouldn't have happened. Some have blamed "house flippers" also. I think that is such a small segment that it really had no effect (my non-expert opinion only) How many people do you know who have "flipped" a house and made a huge profit? TV makes it seem like it's going on everywhere.
And I would go back further and assert that if salaries kept up with true inflation there would not have been the great need for cheap credit (aka debt). If you take away the cheap credit...the economy would have become stagnant with no growth as people would not have extra money to spend. It was all an "illusion of wealth".
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Old 09-06-2009, 05:31 PM
 
Location: Missouri
4,272 posts, read 3,787,918 times
Reputation: 1937
Yes, things are better for me now than they were at the beginning of the year. My portfolio has recovered more than 50% of its value from where it was in February.
I believe that being debt free except for a mortgage (which I will pay off in a couple of years) and having a cash reserve on hand for emergencies took away a lot of the stress and anxiety of last year's crisis.
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Old 09-06-2009, 06:32 PM
 
35,016 posts, read 39,154,953 times
Reputation: 6195
Sept. 1

U.S. Economy Gets Lift From Stimulus - WSJ.com
Government efforts to funnel hundreds of billions of dollars into the U.S. economy appear to be helping the U.S. climb out of the worst recession in decades.
***
Much of the stimulus spending is just beginning to trickle through the economy, with spending expected to peak sometime later this year or in early 2010. The government has funneled about $60 billion of the $288 billion in promised tax cuts to U.S. households, while about $84 billion of the $499 billion in spending has been paid. About $200 billion has been promised to certain projects, such as infrastructure and energy projects.
***
For the third quarter, economists at Goldman Sachs & Co. predict the U.S. economy will grow by 3.3%. "Without that extra stimulus, we would be somewhere around zero," said Jan Hatzius, chief U.S. economist for Goldman.
***
One big question: Will the boost evaporate once the programs end?

Stuart Hoffman, chief U.S. economist for PNC Financial Services Group, said the stimulus package "caused this bit of a concentrated burst [that] probably will exaggerate the pace of economic growth," since some areas, such as auto sales, could fall back to low levels.
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