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Old 10-07-2009, 09:39 AM
 
3,857 posts, read 4,224,354 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimMe View Post
I don't know how it works where you live but here in Maine the insurance companies have to get any rate hike approved by the Bureau of Insurance. They don't "share" information. They are required to disclose it.
So how does that system provide any real competition amongst the companies? If they disclose prices there is no competition. Does the Bureau of Insurance in Maine set prices for insurance company products? How about insurance companies sharing information about claims and what each one considers a pre-existing condition, do insurance companies in Maine have to disclose that information to the Bureau of Insurance?

Do you support immunity from the federal anti-trust laws for the insurance industry?

http://www.mydd.com/story/2009/8/17/21730/8042 (broken link)
"Under the McCarran-Ferguson Act, Big Insurance is allowed to collect and SHARE data with each other about claims. With this information, Big Insurance can fix prices, set coverage requirements, outline conditions for coverage denials (like pre-existing conditions), and many, many more. "
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Old 10-07-2009, 10:11 AM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,533,418 times
Reputation: 4014
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
No. That is a Blue Cross Federal policy, which is the best coverage that you can get. Essentially no co-pays and most everything is approved. It is too expensive and cannot be purchased by non-federal employees.
Although it is the largest plan within the FEHBP, Blue Cross Federal is not necessarily the best plan for anyone. It depends on one's needs and income. The plan includes both co-pays and deductibles, and while it is among the more expensive options available, it is not so expensive as you seem to be implying. If you wanted meaningful dental or vision coverage, however, you might want to look elsewhere.
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Old 10-07-2009, 10:29 AM
 
68 posts, read 88,307 times
Reputation: 28
Universal health care is a human right and should not be a matter of profit. I, like thousands of others, support universal, single payer health care.
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Old 10-07-2009, 11:14 AM
 
Location: The ends DO NOT justify the means!!!
4,783 posts, read 3,751,667 times
Reputation: 1336
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Morgandy View Post
Universal health care is a human right and should not be a matter of profit. I, like thousands of others, support universal, single payer health care.
Universal Health Care is no more a "human right" than is Universal Anything. Anything applied "universally" is an aggressive act against the free will of humans. Anything enforced that is not meant to protect individual freedom is a direct assault on everyone's freedom.

The ends do not justify the means. Initiating aggression towards any group for the benefit of others is still just an aggressive and immoral act. As with any government "program", it is simply a "justified" aggression. Helping "victims" by creating more "victims" is insanity. In the end, they only serve to consolidate even more power in the creator of real victims. That creator of real victims is a government that is capable of destroying freedoms of the individual.

Aggression, by government or any group of people, is never justifiable when it commited against others who have committed no crime. When people advocate initiating aggression against others, they are not "kind", "fair", or "just", but rather they are placing themselves as superior to others. They are simply wielding immoral force to oppress others who may disagree with them.

One needs to realize the insanity of supporting government power to institute special interest legislation. On the one hand we are told that everyone is equal and so should have equal outcomes in life. At the same time we are told that some people deserve preferential treatment and others deserve punishment to produce the equal outcomes. There is no rational consistency in such thinking.

You can have either equality of outcome or equality of freedom. You cannot have both as they are polar opposites of each other. Equal freedom results in varied outcomes, both "good" and "bad", that respects the rights of every person. Equal outcomes results in loss of freedom that respects the rights of only those deemed "deserving" by an oppressive authority. Such thinking, by the "left" or "right", can only be entertained by the arrogant, evil, and immoral amongst us. Rather than being "enlightened" or "progressive" these people are the most evil of all by envisioning themselves as omniscient dictators over others.
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Old 10-07-2009, 11:21 AM
 
68 posts, read 88,307 times
Reputation: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by irspow View Post
Universal Health Care is no more a "human right" than is Universal Anything. Anything applied "universally" is an aggressive act against the free will of humans. Anything enforced that is not meant to protect individual freedom is a direct assault on everyone's freedom.

The ends do not justify the means. Initiating aggression towards any group for the benefit of others is still just an aggressive and immoral act. As with any government "program", it is simply a "justified" aggression. Helping "victims" by creating more "victims" is insanity. In the end, they only serve to consolidate even more power in the creator of real victims. That creator of real victims is a government that is capable of destroying freedoms of the individual.

Aggression, by government or any group of people, is never justifiable when it commited against others who have committed no crime. When people advocate initiating aggression against others, they are not "kind", "fair", or "just", but rather they are placing themselves as superior to others. They are simply wielding immoral force to oppress others who may disagree with them.

One needs to realize the insanity of supporting government power to institute special interest legislation. On the one hand we are told that everyone is equal and so should have equal outcomes in life. At the same time we are told that some people deserve preferential treatment and others deserve punishment to produce the equal outcomes. There is no rational consistency in such thinking.

You can have either equality of outcome or equality of freedom. You cannot have both as they are polar opposites of each other. Equal freedom results in varied outcomes, both "good" and "bad", that respects the rights of every person. Equal outcomes results in loss of freedom that respects the rights of only those deemed "deserving" by an oppressive authority. Such thinking, by the "left" or "right", can only be entertained by the arrogant, evil, and immoral amongst us. Rather than being "enlightened" or "progressive" these people are the most evil of all by envisioning themselves as omniscient dictators over others.
This is the most ridiculous thing I have heard, more of the Glenn Beck nonsensical ramblings....

There is nothing aggressive about taking care of sick people and giving everyone adequate health care, that is nonsense.

And you seem to want to impose your own aggression towards everyone else. You want universal rights to own guns but not to save lives? Hypocritical at best.

People who scream these hysterical rants about dictators and try to fire people for being socailist are the REAL tyrants! Again, how ironic. And you make all Americans look like bafoons to the rest of the world.

Fortunately, you do NOT speak for the majority of Americans who want the very changes you are trying to stop. How can you cry about democracy then deny the will of the people?
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Old 10-07-2009, 11:46 AM
 
Location: The ends DO NOT justify the means!!!
4,783 posts, read 3,751,667 times
Reputation: 1336
This is the most ridiculous thing I have heard, more of the Glenn Beck nonsensical ramblings....

Individual freedom is ridiculous now? I don't know what I said to raise your ire, but if you are such a worshipper of centralized power then why are you trying to secede?

There is nothing aggressive about taking care of sick people and giving everyone adequate health care, that is nonsense.

Using government force to redistibute wealth for a government approved "cause" is an aggressive act against people who have committed no crime. It is nothing short of legitimized theft. If people choose to help each other out that is completely different than an oppressive government demanding "charity".

And you seem to want to impose your own aggression towards everyone else. You want universal rights to own guns but not to save lives? Hypocritical at best.

I am a libertarian and I do not advocate government force to be used against anyone. Government should exist only to protect individual freedom and nothing more. Once it acts against one group to benefit another it becomes immoral and evil in my humble opinion.

People who scream these hysterical rants about dictators and try to fire people for being socailist are the REAL tyrants! Again, how ironic. And you make all Americans look like bafoons to the rest of the world.

What tyrants are your people trying to escape? Your group wants to secede from the same government that you now seem to support. That is ironic. Tyrants are those who enforce their vision upon everyone else. I don't wish to enforce other to comply with what I believe. However, the collectivists design their entire systems upon aggressive acts towards anyone who does not comply with their ideas.

Fortunately, you do NOT speak for the majority of Americans who want the very changes you are trying to stop. How can you cry about democracy then deny the will of the people?

Unfortunately, for human freedom, I do not speak for the majority of humans either. I however realize this fact and do not wish to force others to comply with my beliefs.

What did I say about democracy? I don't even support democracy in its true definition. The tyranny of the majority is no better to the individual than any barbaric government system of the past. A majority can be as oppressive to individual rights as any megalomaniac leader or centralized government.

Again, sorry to have somehow offended you. I still support your exercise of freedom with your community even though I disagree with your socialist beliefs. I can do that because I consistently stand for all people's freedoms instead of just those that I personally approve of.
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Old 10-07-2009, 11:54 AM
 
68 posts, read 88,307 times
Reputation: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by irspow View Post

What tyrants are your people trying to escape? Your group wants to secede from the same government that you now seem to support. of.
No, our goal is to escape the right wing nut jobs that have ruined the nation and to get away from the failed capitalist system that is destroying lives and the rest of the planet along with it and to return to a society with morals and communal values that does not worship the almighty dollar.

No man can be free with the oppression of capitalism....and whether you use a gun, a jail cell, or a dollar to oppress people and create classes of people who die and suffer to support you it is still being a tyrant.

Big business it the real evil and tyrant and those who support it.
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Old 10-07-2009, 12:04 PM
 
Location: The ends DO NOT justify the means!!!
4,783 posts, read 3,751,667 times
Reputation: 1336
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Morgandy View Post
No, our goal is to escape the right wing nut jobs that have ruined the nation and to get away from the failed capitalist system that is destroying lives and the rest of the planet along with it and to return to a society with morals and communal values that does not worship the almighty dollar.

No man can be free with the oppression of capitalism....and whether you use a gun, a jail cell, or a dollar to oppress people and create classes of people who die and suffer to support you it is still being a tyrant.

Big business it the real evil and tyrant and those who support it.
Oh, I get it now. I thought you people just wanted freedom. As long as the dictators are those you agree with it is okay to oppress your fellow human beings. As long as your ideas are used to oppress others it is justifiable aggression. Fine. You are entitled to your totalitarian beliefs. You are not, however, "just" when trying to force others to comply with those beliefs through government force.
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Old 10-07-2009, 12:12 PM
obo
 
916 posts, read 988,221 times
Reputation: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Morgandy View Post
This is the most ridiculous thing I have heard, more of the Glenn Beck nonsensical ramblings....

There is nothing aggressive about taking care of sick people and giving everyone adequate health care, that is nonsense.

And you seem to want to impose your own aggression towards everyone else. You want universal rights to own guns but not to save lives? Hypocritical at best.

People who scream these hysterical rants about dictators and try to fire people for being socailist are the REAL tyrants! Again, how ironic. And you make all Americans look like bafoons to the rest of the world.

Fortunately, you do NOT speak for the majority of Americans who want the very changes you are trying to stop. How can you cry about democracy then deny the will of the people?
And.....Another non believer in the Constitution. Atleast they don't understand it if they do believe in it.
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Old 10-07-2009, 12:14 PM
obo
 
916 posts, read 988,221 times
Reputation: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Morgandy View Post
No, our goal is to escape the right wing nut jobs that have ruined the nation and to get away from the failed capitalist system that is destroying lives and the rest of the planet along with it and to return to a society with morals and communal values that does not worship the almighty dollar.

No man can be free with the oppression of capitalism....and whether you use a gun, a jail cell, or a dollar to oppress people and create classes of people who die and suffer to support you it is still being a tyrant.

Big business it the real evil and tyrant and those who support it.
your man BO does more than support big business, HE SLEEPS WITH THEM!
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