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Old 12-20-2009, 03:45 PM
 
246 posts, read 422,157 times
Reputation: 643

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Recently there have been a number of proposals to widen the 405 freeway in Southern California. Two counties, Orange and LA, one right, one left. A simple drive through both on the 405 or 5 shows stark differences and how ideology expresses itself in the real world. OC will widen the freeway, while adding a mix of rail infrastructure, LAC will not widen a critical freeway at all and only use rail in order to "punish into submission" anyone who disagrees with them, a common leftist tactic.

Let's be fair and honest about why there is such a divergence of opinion on rail vs freeway. While rail is a suitable alternative, all travel is dictated by pure government fiat, their time, their schedule. Rail without roads can not exist in isolation without a yielding of freedom. Left leaning communities welcome totalitarian control by government in every aspect of their lives. They prefer having controls dictated to them and others in a sort of a strongman dominance and forced conformance. Since totalitarian regimes most closely align with their particular world view, they welcome and embrace gov't control because they can force everyone around them to be just like them. This is why leftists love totalitarian regimes like Cuba, Venezuela, Zimbabwe, the former Soviet Union, etc. State control of their lives makes them feel secure.

Personal vehicles are a profound expression of individuality and freedom. It allows people to go where they want, when they want. A rail system can be shut down quite easily by government order, a strike, disaster, various systematic controls or failures. It is much harder to stop millions of people in millions of individual private conveyances on hundreds of thousands of roads both paved and unpaved. This lies at the heart of leftist hate against the automobile and why there is a religious devotion to mass transit, rail, etc as the "ONLY" solution. Eliminate the car, a symbol of freedom, replace with government control of movement, mass transit, and totalitarian control is achieved.

Case in point, Orange county will widen roads, improve infrastructure, in the goal of improving quality of life, while LA County will follow the usual leftist axiom of punish and force submission through suffering (no roads, sit in gridlock and suffer until you give up your car).

A mix of freeway and rail and other would be fine, but I've seen too much dogma from the "don't build infrastructure and reduce quality of life to punish people into submission" crowd to have much confidence that that the total opposition to freeway improvement is only symptomatic of their hate of freedom. A liberal mind is a mind filled with "limits", a colorless world where suffering must be spread around and there is a constant grind down in quality of life.

One only has to look at the cleanliness, infrastructure, and overall quality of life of most OC residents to see that its way of doing business surpasses much of the cesspool that is LA county. LA is fine if you are a wealthy liberal on the west side with plenty of money to insulate you, but compare the lives of the working class in LA vs OC to see the real measure of a community. Oh and yes, OCTA (Orange County Transit Agency - which runs the most of the mass transit services in OC) was rated as one of the nations best. Why, because OC has a healthy mix and appreciates freedom while left leaning LA county loves punishing people so they will "learn the error of their ways."

Last edited by Calix; 12-20-2009 at 03:57 PM..
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Old 12-20-2009, 04:17 PM
 
19,226 posts, read 15,328,875 times
Reputation: 2337
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calix View Post
Recently there have been a number of proposals to widen the 405 freeway in Southern California. Two counties, Orange and LA, one right, one left. A simple drive through both on the 405 or 5 shows stark differences and how ideology expresses itself in the real world. OC will widen the freeway, while adding a mix of rail infrastructure, LAC will not widen a critical freeway at all and only use rail in order to "punish into submission" anyone who disagrees with them, a common leftist tactic.

Let's be fair and honest about why there is such a divergence of opinion on rail vs freeway. While rail is a suitable alternative, all travel is dictated by pure government fiat, their time, their schedule. Rail without roads can not exist in isolation without a yielding of freedom. Left leaning communities welcome totalitarian control by government in every aspect of their lives. They prefer having controls dictated to them and others in a sort of a strongman dominance and forced conformance. Since totalitarian regimes most closely align with their particular world view, they welcome and embrace gov't control because they can force everyone around them to be just like them. This is why leftists love totalitarian regimes like Cuba, Venezuela, Zimbabwe, the former Soviet Union, etc. State control of their lives makes them feel secure.

Personal vehicles are a profound expression of individuality and freedom. It allows people to go where they want, when they want. A rail system can be shut down quite easily by government order, a strike, disaster, various systematic controls or failures. It is much harder to stop millions of people in millions of individual private conveyances on hundreds of thousands of roads both paved and unpaved. This lies at the heart of leftist hate against the automobile and why there is a religious devotion to mass transit, rail, etc as the "ONLY" solution. Eliminate the car, a symbol of freedom, replace with government control of movement, mass transit, and totalitarian control is achieved.

Case in point, Orange county will widen roads, improve infrastructure, in the goal of improving quality of life, while LA County will follow the usual leftist axiom of punish and force submission through suffering (no roads, sit in gridlock and suffer until you give up your car).

A mix of freeway and rail and other would be fine, but I've seen too much dogma from the "don't build infrastructure and reduce quality of life to punish people into submission" crowd to have much confidence that that the total opposition to freeway improvement is only symptomatic of their hate of freedom. A liberal mind is a mind filled with "limits", a colorless world where suffering must be spread around and there is a constant grind down in quality of life.

One only has to look at the cleanliness, infrastructure, and overall quality of life of most OC residents to see that its way of doing business surpasses much of the cesspool that is LA county. LA is fine if you are a wealthy liberal on the west side with plenty of money to insulate you, but compare the lives of the working class in LA vs OC to see the real measure of a community. Oh and yes, OCTA (Orange County Transit Agency - which runs the most of the mass transit services in OC) was rated as one of the nations best. Why, because OC has a healthy mix and appreciates freedom while left leaning LA county loves punishing people so they will "learn the error of their ways."
Then Orange County has a public option?

Wait - An individual option!
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Old 12-20-2009, 04:30 PM
 
Location: Austin
1,476 posts, read 1,777,162 times
Reputation: 435
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calix View Post
Recently there have been a number of proposals to widen the 405 freeway in Southern California. Two counties, Orange and LA, one right, one left. A simple drive through both on the 405 or 5 shows stark differences and how ideology expresses itself in the real world. OC will widen the freeway, while adding a mix of rail infrastructure, LAC will not widen a critical freeway at all and only use rail in order to "punish into submission" anyone who disagrees with them, a common leftist tactic.

Let's be fair and honest about why there is such a divergence of opinion on rail vs freeway. While rail is a suitable alternative, all travel is dictated by pure government fiat, their time, their schedule. Rail without roads can not exist in isolation without a yielding of freedom. Left leaning communities welcome totalitarian control by government in every aspect of their lives. They prefer having controls dictated to them and others in a sort of a strongman dominance and forced conformance. Since totalitarian regimes most closely align with their particular world view, they welcome and embrace gov't control because they can force everyone around them to be just like them. This is why leftists love totalitarian regimes like Cuba, Venezuela, Zimbabwe, the former Soviet Union, etc. State control of their lives makes them feel secure.

Personal vehicles are a profound expression of individuality and freedom. It allows people to go where they want, when they want. A rail system can be shut down quite easily by government order, a strike, disaster, various systematic controls or failures. It is much harder to stop millions of people in millions of individual private conveyances on hundreds of thousands of roads both paved and unpaved. This lies at the heart of leftist hate against the automobile and why there is a religious devotion to mass transit, rail, etc as the "ONLY" solution. Eliminate the car, a symbol of freedom, replace with government control of movement, mass transit, and totalitarian control is achieved.

Case in point, Orange county will widen roads, improve infrastructure, in the goal of improving quality of life, while LA County will follow the usual leftist axiom of punish and force submission through suffering (no roads, sit in gridlock and suffer until you give up your car).

A mix of freeway and rail and other would be fine, but I've seen too much dogma from the "don't build infrastructure and reduce quality of life to punish people into submission" crowd to have much confidence that that the total opposition to freeway improvement is only symptomatic of their hate of freedom. A liberal mind is a mind filled with "limits", a colorless world where suffering must be spread around and there is a constant grind down in quality of life.

One only has to look at the cleanliness, infrastructure, and overall quality of life of most OC residents to see that its way of doing business surpasses much of the cesspool that is LA county. LA is fine if you are a wealthy liberal on the west side with plenty of money to insulate you, but compare the lives of the working class in LA vs OC to see the real measure of a community. Oh and yes, OCTA (Orange County Transit Agency - which runs the most of the mass transit services in OC) was rated as one of the nations best. Why, because OC has a healthy mix and appreciates freedom while left leaning LA county loves punishing people so they will "learn the error of their ways."
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Old 12-20-2009, 05:01 PM
 
Location: Here
11,578 posts, read 13,953,952 times
Reputation: 7009
joejitsu: Any chance you can come up with some new pictures. Perhaps some that were not played out in 2007. Thanks.
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Old 12-20-2009, 05:01 PM
 
9,763 posts, read 10,531,049 times
Reputation: 2052
You had my attention until "punish into submission." A little objectivity would go a long way.

I can play, too:

Those damn communist fascist socialist totalitarian OC leaders want to steal MY MONEY to spend on freeway expansion and rail service. Let the lazy bums walk!
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Old 12-20-2009, 05:04 PM
 
Location: Austin
1,476 posts, read 1,777,162 times
Reputation: 435
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
You had my attention until "punish into submission." A little objectivity would go a long way.

I can play, too:

Those damn communist fascist socialist totalitarian OC leaders want to steal MY MONEY to spend on freeway expansion and rail service. Let the lazy bums walk!
Yeah, what gives government the right to build roads with taxpayer money. Its very communist how they want to build a highway in the OC for everyone to share. They should build individual highways for each individual in the OC. Everyone gets to design where there highway goes too. Now thats freedom. Why should government dictate where a highway goes?
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Old 12-20-2009, 05:05 PM
 
9,763 posts, read 10,531,049 times
Reputation: 2052
Quote:
Originally Posted by joejitsu View Post
Yeah, what gives government the right to build roads with taxpayer money. Its very communist how they want to build a highway in the OC for everyone to share. They should build individual highways for each individual in the OC. They get to design where it goes too. Now thats freedom.
Damn socialists! Why should I be punished? That's MY MONEY! MINE! Hear me, you lazy bum communists? MINE. All mine. Hahahaha.......................
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Old 12-20-2009, 05:09 PM
 
246 posts, read 422,157 times
Reputation: 643
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
Damn socialists! Why should I be punished? That's MY MONEY! MINE! Hear me, you lazy bum communists? MINE. All mine. Hahahaha.......................
I'll help you, roads allow individuals to travel when they want. Rail forces you on their schedule at their times and is very easy to control. It is much harder to control millions of people in millions of cars on millions of roads.

The road network is simply far more advanced and flexible than the rail network.

Rail isn't bad, but as an only option, it seriously limits freedom, surely you can see that concept.

Sort of if broadband internet was only available at few select locations rather than in every home.

Hope this helps.
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Old 12-20-2009, 05:13 PM
 
Location: Chicago Suburbs
3,199 posts, read 4,318,633 times
Reputation: 1176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calix View Post
I'll help you, roads allow individuals to travel when they want. Rail forces you on their schedule at their times and is very easy to control. It is much harder to control millions of people in millions of cars on millions of roads.

The road network is simply far more advanced and flexible than the rail network.

Rail isn't bad, but as an only option, it seriously limits freedom, surely you can see that concept.

Sort of if broadband internet was only available at few select locations rather than in every home.

Hope this helps.
It's all part of the liberals plan to create an America in the image of their European utopia.
Practicality and expense be damned.
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Old 12-20-2009, 05:16 PM
 
Location: Austin
1,476 posts, read 1,777,162 times
Reputation: 435
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calix View Post

Sort of if broadband internet was only available at few select locations rather than in every home.

Hope this helps.
You are aware that states pass subsidies to provide broadband in rural areas? If the market had its way it would only be available in big cities and their suburbs. Pure bolshevism!
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