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Old 10-27-2010, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Earth
17,440 posts, read 28,602,920 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
After all, when is the last time we had a president who didn't go to an Ivy League school?
Reagan
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Old 10-27-2010, 03:59 PM
 
13,005 posts, read 18,908,288 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyGem View Post
The American Caste system is based on wealth first, and political influence second.

Period.
Wealth and political influence go together; the poor and lower classes don't make campaign contributions, some don't even vote. But what is this assumption that white skin immunizes one from poverty? Never heard the tern "White trash," "redneck," or even "hillbilly?"
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Old 10-27-2010, 04:02 PM
 
Location: The D-M-V area
13,691 posts, read 18,454,215 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pvande55 View Post
Wealth and political influence go together; the poor and lower classes don't make campaign contributions, some don't even vote. But what is this assumption that white skin immunizes one from poverty? Never heard the tern "White trash," "redneck," or even "hillbilly?"
I didn't make any statement about skin color with regard to a caste system.

My position is that the caste system is based on money and power. Period.

You either have it or you don't, and it doesn't matter what your skin color is black brown white orange.
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Old 10-27-2010, 04:10 PM
 
Location: .....
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Wow, that lady's words are painfully honest, where can I find more of these? Good find OP!
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Old 10-27-2010, 04:25 PM
 
7,006 posts, read 6,994,198 times
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Instead of predictably blaming white America for the number of black men behind bars why doesn't the black community fight back against the glamorizing of the thug life? Seems to me that young black males consider it a badge of honor to have been arrested and jailed, to have stood up to "the Man", whereas such behavior is unheard of and/or looked down upon in virtually every other culture.

Stop the progressive 'learned helplessness', self-victimization, and crab-bucket mentality. Funny how blacks didn't have these problems before the Civil Rights movement.

Last edited by renault; 10-27-2010 at 04:49 PM..
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Old 10-27-2010, 04:28 PM
 
Location: Earth
17,440 posts, read 28,602,920 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pvande55 View Post
Wealth and political influence go together; the poor and lower classes don't make campaign contributions, some don't even vote. But what is this assumption that white skin immunizes one from poverty? Never heard the tern "White trash," "redneck," or even "hillbilly?"
Not to mention that even before the economic crisis hit, the social ills often labelled as the "culture of poverty" had hit rural and suburban America, and meth had devastated poor and working class white areas just as crack had devastated poor and working class black areas in the '80s.

White skin definitely does NOT immunize one from poverty, and not just in rural or suburban areas. Remember that the US had white urban ghettos until the '90s when white flight or gentrification transformed them. And even in some of those areas there are still remnants of the old white inner city poverty and similar social ills.
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Old 10-27-2010, 04:41 PM
 
10,854 posts, read 9,301,747 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heaveno View Post
Found this to be an excellent interview that does provide accurate information which would answer this question has being an astounding "YES" that we do have an underclass caste system here in America.

Black Mass Incarceration: The Big Payback, a BAR Interview with Michelle Alexander

http://cdn1.libsyn.com/blackagendare..._1.mp3?nvb=201
I just know this if you don't have an education in this day and age YOU ARE SCREWED in terms of employment and chances to advance yourself unless you are extraordinarily gifted in other ways i.e. artistically or athletically.

Everybody has a choice. For as many Black American men that at some point in their life make a choice to go down the path a criminality there are two or more that don't. Anybody who winds up in the criminal justice system due to willful criminal behavior needs to take a look at the value system they chooe to follow that path. If you follow a set of values that glorifies criminal behavior and makes it acceptable to be involved in criminal activity for economic gain. Don’t be surprised if you wind up in jail.

The issue starts with parenting. There are many people that are going up in this country that due to poor parenting will never have an opportunity to better themselves unless they come across another adult that has an honest interest in showing them they can improve their lives if they are willing to work for it.

The second issue is the individuals themselves. Many people KNOW they are going down a path that is self destructive but lack the personal strength and self-esteem to resist the peer pressure that often makes one go down that path.

The point is this at the core of any achievement is the personal choice to want to be successful and then that needs to be combined with a work ethic, and value system to succeed. The thing that I've noticed about people that REALLY want to be successful is that opportunities will present themselves you just have to be ready to take advantage of them.
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Old 10-27-2010, 04:48 PM
 
10,854 posts, read 9,301,747 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by padcrasher View Post
This is one of the big right wing myths still spead today.

If you work hard in America you can advance up the line!

That may have been true in the 1970's and earlier but not today.

30 years of right wing assault on unions, progressive tax rates, sufficient funding if the IRS and SEC, workers rights have killed that dream.

I'll post a link to a study of countries that rank far above the USA in the ability of a person to advance economically in society.

Graphic: How Class Works - New York Times
Even if you have the opportunities if you don't have a value system that allows you to be successful you are not going to succeed. One of the biggest changes I've seen in America in the last 40 years is that in many cases poor people have a value system that actually embraces their current situation in life and does NOT allow them to succeed. That did NOT used to be the case.
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Old 10-27-2010, 04:56 PM
 
Location: Earth
17,440 posts, read 28,602,920 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JazzyTallGuy View Post
Even if you have the opportunities if you don't have a value system that allows you to be successful you are not going to succeed. One of the biggest changes I've seen in America in the last 40 years is that in many cases poor people have a value system that actually embraces their current situation in life and does NOT allow them to succeed. That did NOT used to be the case.
Because there weren't as many schools that were essentially "prep schools for prison" in the past, and also more educational opportunities in the past. The schools condition kids to embrace those values. The media also plays a role as do too many parents having kids for the wrong reasons. Make that too many kids in general.

Given that birth rates in 2007 reached an all time high for the US, the future isn't pleasant. OTOH 2009 and 2010 have seen the lowest birthrates in US history, even lower than the mid-1970s (when US birthrates were lower than virtually all Euro nations), so there is some hope for the future in this regard. Was there ever any other time in US history with such extremes in birth rates over a short period? The Depression caused a drop in birth rates but the decline started the year before the Depression, in 1928 ; did 1927 see an all time high in birth rates?
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Old 10-27-2010, 04:56 PM
 
10,854 posts, read 9,301,747 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
I haven't read/watched your link yet - but I just wanted to note that of course there has been and always will be a caste system in our society, as there is in all societies. Luckily our caste system is surmountable - difficult to do, but doable all the same.
I think that there is definately a racist element but also a 'club' element as well. Let me preface this by making clear that I in no way endorse Sarah Palin or agree with her views or think that she would have made a good vpotus. However, the way the elite judged her wanting due to the schools she went to was very telling in my opinion. After all, when is the last time we had a president who didn't go to an Ivy League school? What is the percentage of journalists/anchors who went to the Ivy League? I am of the opinion an intelligent - hell, a gifted politician can come out of a state university......but to many it is all about what school you went to and what your ties were there. The Ivy League has become the Brahams, the rest of us? Very little chance in hell of reaching any real political power.

Education has become "the gateway" to success in America. That is why many people literally mortgage a significant portion of their lives to get a college education. They literally have no other choice if they want any chance to better their lives. It's not only going to college it's which college you get into.

The late 1970's marked the end of somebody with a high school education joining the work force with any chance of getting a middle class lifestyle. This recession probably marks the end of anybody without a college degree of getting a middle class lifestyle unless they are extraordinarily skilled at the trades, or crafts or, are they are artistically or athletically gifted.
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