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I know law..and don't pretend like you've read it..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moth
We have been prospering for quite a long time without it. While there are certainly merits to universal healthcare, claiming something that is clearly and historically not true is not one of them.
Anyway, I answered your question and as I suspected, it was merely a pretext for you to begin preaching. And as your kind inevitably does, the preaching, annoying in its own right, quickly turns into rudeness which is a sophmoric variant of changing the subject.
The new law is that you can't be turned down for ins., even if sick. Most would obviously pay a simple cheap fine to the irs and then later get healthcare with Nobama's backroom plan if they do get sick. Are you slugs too retarded to see that?
Your link listed CENSUS data which is not accurate, by Obamas own admission.. DID YOU READ MY LINK?
What figure exactly do you disagree with? There is a difference between those who CANT get insurance, and those who CAN but dont wish to..
All right man. I think the discussion is not going anywhere. Do you know what Census is?
And yes I went and read your link. And you should too. But read it please. I mean read in terms of comprehension. Here is what Obama said (from your link):
But on August 10, at a town hall meeting, Obama referred to the "46, 47 million people without health insurance in our country…"
Yes. He is not getting his numbers from anywhere but the official Census data that our government collects. As I showed you, as official, extremely reliable, perhaps the most reliable data source on the face of the world, suggests there are 46 million uninsured people in US.
So once again, slowly, there are 46 million uninsured people in US. Now if you read my previous post once again. Carefully though. You will see that 34 million out of that 46 million are natives, as in born and raised in the United States. So they are not illegal immigrants. They can't be by definition (as they are natives). You get what I am saying?
Now let's go to the part that 30 million mentioned in your link:
It seems likely Obama was trying to combine these various concerns and came up with the rounded number of 30 million "American citizens who cannot get coverage."[LEFT]
[/LEFT]
Now the 30 million number is not from his speech (as it is not in quotation marks), so I don't even know whether he said that, but here for you the operative word is American citizens. Repeat: American citizens. As in not illegal immigrants.
So I don't get your fuzzy math of calling half of those illegal immigrants.
I know very well what the census is, do you understand that the census data is WRONG which is why Obama didnt even use it?
Where? When? How? What grade level are you?
Your link. Your citation:
46 million uninsured in the US.
30+ million uninsured AMERICAN CITIZENS in the US.
Do you know the difference?
Can you send me the list of school districts that you have ever attended in your lifetime so that I make sure I stay away for my children's sake? Thanks in advance.
The new law is that you can't be turned down for ins., even if sick. Most would obviously pay a simple cheap fine to the irs and then later get healthcare with Nobama's backroom plan if they do get sick. Are you slugs too retarded to see that?
Gah. Penny wise and pound foolish. It's almost painful to read posts like this.
Your link. Your citation:
46 million uninsured in the US.
30+ million uninsured AMERICAN CITIZENS in the US.
Do you know the difference?
Can you send me the list of school districts that you have ever attended in your lifetime so that I make sure I stay away for my children's sake? Thanks in advance.
...According to the US Census Bureau, 17 million of those without health insurance live in households having over $50,000 in annual income. That's 38% of the uninsured in America.(2) In fact, 9 million - 20% of the uninsured - reside in households pulling down more than $75K a year. (3) ...And then there are the young invincibles. Over 18 million of the uninsured are people between the ages of 18 and 34. (4) They spend more than four times as much on alcohol, tobacco, entertainment and dining out as they do for out-of-pocket spending on health care.(5) They represent 40% of the uninsured in America. ...14 million people without health insurance are eligible for government health care programs like Medicaid and S-CHIP but choose not to enroll. (7) They represent %31 - nearly one third - of the uninsured in America. ...The U.S. has 12 million illegal immigrants who don't buy health insurance but still get health care. ...So, how many are truly uninsured? Around eight million. Just 18% of the 45 million that we hear about so often."
Thats 8 MILLION, and how many of them are BY CHOICE..the purpose of the thread, and the number of individuals who the healthcare bill was intended to FORCE into buying a plan. Just 2% of the public, and many of them BY CHOICE!!
...According to the US Census Bureau, 17 million of those without health insurance live in households having over $50,000 in annual income. That's 38% of the uninsured in America.(2) In fact, 9 million - 20% of the uninsured - reside in households pulling down more than $75K a year. (3) ...And then there are the young invincibles. Over 18 million of the uninsured are people between the ages of 18 and 34. (4) They spend more than four times as much on alcohol, tobacco, entertainment and dining out as they do for out-of-pocket spending on health care.(5) They represent 40% of the uninsured in America. ...14 million people without health insurance are eligible for government health care programs like Medicaid and S-CHIP but choose not to enroll. (7) They represent %31 - nearly one third - of the uninsured in America. ...The U.S. has 12 million illegal immigrants who don't buy health insurance but still get health care. ...So, how many are truly uninsured? Around eight million. Just 18% of the 45 million that we hear about so often."
Thats 8 MILLION, and how many of them are BY CHOICE..the purpose of the thread, and the number of individuals who the healthcare bill was intended to FORCE into buying a plan. Just 2% of the public, and many of them BY CHOICE!!
You did not miskey anything. You gave me the link. The 30 million American Citizens are from the link you sent. That number is the number I gave you. The exact number is 34 million.
And now you are attaching me the citation of the numbers that I have already mentioned. Again read the links you posted. These are Census numbers. For future reference: Census is the single most important data we have in this country.
Now back to the 8 million. Do not hand your brain to some political talk head just because they are conservative. Try to do your own math. I know it may be tough. And it is obvious public education has failed you big time, but you can do better.
Even in the link that you provided there is a disclaimer. Again your link:
"As you can see, there's a little bit of overlap in those groups"
A little bit? A little bit? Are you kidding me? How about a lot?
We need a health insurance reform because there are 46 million uninsured people in this country out of which 34 million are AMERICAN NATIVES.
How many people know of someone that doesn't have health insurance and doesn't want any heath insurance? I personally don't know anybody and don't know anybody that knows anybody that falls into that category. I will venture to say that the percentage of people that fall into this category are extremely small.
This is what the radical right's opposition boils down to. They tried the fake abortion thing but that didn't stick so they went back to the health insurance mandate. The fact of the matter is, the vast majority of the people out complaining about the mandate already have healthcare and the others want/need healthcare. In essence they're arguing against what wont effect them or what will provide them the insurance they need. Just silly.
Well now you do. Me. Nice to meet you.
Though I do think you are correct in saying that this is probably quite rare .. most people without healthcare insurance don't have it because they can't afford it or are unemployed and lost it. But not everyone.
As for myself, I don't have it, and I don't want it, and I surely don't want to be forced to buy what I don't want.
At 52 years old, I'm on NO MEDICATIONS, unlike the average which may be taking several, regularly ... from high blood pressure .. to high cholesterol .. to anti-depressants, we have become the world's leading pill poppers.
More people die each year from prescription medications taken as directed by their doctor than all illegal drugs by a large margin. Furthermore, it is estimated (and documented in the book Death by Medicine) that around 750,000 people die each year because of medical errors ... not unsuccessful treatments ... but plain old mistakes.
Over the past 30 years, I've been to the doctor approximately 3-4 times for things such as a strep throat infection or bronchitis requiring antibiotics. I've spent way less than $1,000 dollars in 30 years! Had I been "forced" to pay for health insurance as the new reform demands ... and at the rates estimated and adjusted, I would have paid approximately $105,000 over that 30 year period. Where would that $104,000 have gone? To insurance company executives ... to hospitals charging $25 for an aspirin .. and to cover those not covered ... from illegals using the emergency room as a doctor's office for their 4 kids .. to gang members being treated for gunshot wounds .. to 350 lb diabetics who've decided to eat themselves to death .. to drug addicts requiring emergency care.
NO! It's not your money or your heath ... both are mine. It's my choice to use holistic healthcare (not covered by traditional healthcare insurance plans) instead of allopathic ... It's my choice to maintain my health through natural medicine and supplements, herbs, and healthy diet, avoiding the processed foods that contain hundreds of chemicals. Of course, that costs more money to eat healthy, and take a proactive approach to remaining healthy. So that is my choice. I don't need pills to get an erection, go to sleep, wake up, manage my mood, blood pressure and cholesterol ...and nobody has the right to force me to submit to this "sick care" system of disease promotion, management and treatment instead of prevention and cure.
You want real healthcare reform? Let's stop allowing these SOBs to make us sick with their poisons.
Go to your food pantry ... or look at the labels of the products most people regularly buy at the supermarket, and look at the ingredients. Take a look at a "Hostess Cupcake" (I used to eat that crap), and you'll see 25 or more ingredients, a dozen of those things you can either not pronounce or tell anyone what it actually is. A real cupcake would require about 5 or 6 ingredients, not 25. Hmmm ... flour, sugar, egg, chocolate, butter, coconut oil. Look at EVERYTHING, and what you might discover is that half of what the normal American diet consist of is chemicals, preservatives, and Soy ... all poisons. And you wonder why people are fat and sick all of the time?
Look at the people still loading their baskets with products containing Aspartame ... a known poison that has been banned by some European countries, but marketed heavily in America.
Fluoride in the water, mercury and cancer viruses in the vaccines. Prescription medications that if you look closely at the fine print ... the possible side effects are more dangerous than the condition the drug was prescribed to treat.
The entire industry thrives on sickness, not health. And I want no part of it .. and neither should anyone else with a common understanding of what really goes on inside this insidious industry.
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