Electric scooters preferred in core area? (Portland: calculating, subsidized, income)

[Nell Plotts]

There is an article in the Willamette Week that indicates that the City wants folks to use scooters. WTF? I am closer to 80 yoa than 75, able-bodied but using a scooter to get around isn't possible. Now when they permit two-seater golf carts with enough power to climb the west hills ... that I could use, but I don't think that would work to transport grandchildren.

[texasdiver]

What article are you talking about? i went to the WW web site and couldn't find any scooter articles. I can't imagine they would ever require scooters on certain streets, just make them a legal option.

I'm a fan of these scooters but I think the city should actually work with the scooter companies to geo-fence them into specific parking zones. They have the technology to do it.

So, for example, the city could establish certain scooter parking zones on each block or wherever appropriate. They could just pull out one car parking spot per block and zone it out for bike/scooter parking with paint and planters or whatever is appropriate. The scooter companies can modify their software to require that scooters be returned to designated parking spots which they can do with their GPS which is that precise. Or, just add $1 to each ride for scooters not returned to designated parking spots and give a $1 discount to each rider to retrieves a scooter from an unauthorized parking spot.

If the city can't provide enough designated scooter parking spots, the scooter companies can work with private companies to create additional parking zones in private lots like Safeway, Fred Meyer, Wallgreens, etc. I'm sure there are a bazillion businesses in the city with private parking spots that would be amenable to carving out a space for scooters for the right price.

All the scooter 'clutter" would solve itself in a week or so. The scooter companies would just have to adjust their pricing to provide adequate incentive for the great majority to be returned to designated parking spots. They may not *want* to do that as it is so much easier to just have the cluttered about everywhere. But they certainly have the technology to make it happen if they chose to.

And, of course our streets could be better designed with secure and safe bike lanes that would be available for scooters and other similar devices like one-wheels, hoverboards, etc. They all belong in the bike lanes not the sidewalks if they are moving at bike speed and not walking speed.

[Nell Plotts]

https://www.wweek.com/news/2019/10/1...-kill-the-car/

Copenhagen should be our model, even they did not kill the car. The difference is that that Copenhagen, and most of Denmark, is flat.

[MtnSurfer]

The interesting part will be how to not become road kill during the transition. Traffic can get pretty crazy in Portland and not everyone seems to be in charge of all their faculties while driving (i.e. some appear to be high) or just rushing around too fast. So it might be hard to avoid collisions with those fancy new scooters. Then there are the accidents which occur simply by hitting a pothole, slippery roadways, miscalculating a turn, etc...

That electric scooter might be fun. It also might be deadly

Derek

[texasdiver]

Originally Posted by Nell Plotts

https://www.wweek.com/news/2019/10/1...-kill-the-car/

Copenhagen should be our model, even they did not kill the car. The difference is that that Copenhagen, and most of Denmark, is flat.

OK well, the article is actually a bike activist describing what he thinks the city *should* do, and not at all about what the city is actually planning to do. Basically it's just a bike activist's fantasy wish list.

That said, I think the #1 priority for Portland should be to develop safe 3rd mode transportation infrastructure. Basically what we call protected bike lanes but really should be narrow protected lanes for all modes of narrow, light and medium-speed vehicles from bikes and e-bikes to scooters one-wheels, Segways, and all the new stuff that hasn't even been invented yet that will be small light vehicles powered by electric motors. It is actually very cheap to do, just some paint on the street and some easy barriers like concrete planters and bollards. The difficult part is the political part which is removing all the free subsidized on-street car storage to make way for protected bike lanes.

The problem today is that we really don't have much in the way of infrastructure for all these new lightweight and medium speed vehicles. They aren't safe in the car lanes and aren't save on the sidewalks. Rather than go down the road of advocating for any one specific type of vehicles like bikes or scooters, the city should be agnostic about the specific vehicle type and just create the safe space for all of them to thrive and we will eventually know which modes are better (bikes, e-bikes, standing scooters, seated scooters (like electric vespas) and so forth. As a cyclist I'd much rather share space with scooters than cars or pedestrians.

[ccjarider]

Originally Posted by Nell Plotts

There is an article in the Willamette Week that indicates that the City wants folks to use scooters. WTF? I am closer to 80 yoa than 75, able-bodied but using a scooter to get around isn't possible. Now when they permit two-seater golf carts with enough power to climb the west hills ... that I could use, but I don't think that would work to transport grandchildren.

Just gotta say - I love the fact that you are pushing 80 and use the term "wtf" in a post . Made me laugh.
That's awesome - have a great day.

[ccjarider]

Originally Posted by texasdiver

What article are you talking about? i went to the WW web site and couldn't find any scooter articles. I can't imagine they would ever require scooters on certain streets, just make them a legal option.

I'm a fan of these scooters but I think the city should actually work with the scooter companies to geo-fence them into specific parking zones. They have the technology to do it.

So, for example, the city could establish certain scooter parking zones on each block or wherever appropriate. They could just pull out one car parking spot per block and zone it out for bike/scooter parking with paint and planters or whatever is appropriate. The scooter companies can modify their software to require that scooters be returned to designated parking spots which they can do with their GPS which is that precise. Or, just add $1 to each ride for scooters not returned to designated parking spots and give a $1 discount to each rider to retrieves a scooter from an unauthorized parking spot.

If the city can't provide enough designated scooter parking spots, the scooter companies can work with private companies to create additional parking zones in private lots like Safeway, Fred Meyer, Wallgreens, etc. I'm sure there are a bazillion businesses in the city with private parking spots that would be amenable to carving out a space for scooters for the right price.

All the scooter 'clutter" would solve itself in a week or so. The scooter companies would just have to adjust their pricing to provide adequate incentive for the great majority to be returned to designated parking spots. They may not *want* to do that as it is so much easier to just have the cluttered about everywhere. But they certainly have the technology to make it happen if they chose to.

And, of course our streets could be better designed with secure and safe bike lanes that would be available for scooters and other similar devices like one-wheels, hoverboards, etc. They all belong in the bike lanes not the sidewalks if they are moving at bike speed and not walking speed.

Read your post - Do you really think all the overthinking. over regulation and busywork you propose is even possible? Would it solve anything except making work for 6- 10 taxpayer funded city employees to manage said bureaucracy.

No wonder Portland is the mess it is. People expect city gov't to solve every little issue.

[texasdiver]

Originally Posted by ccjarider

Read your post - Do you really think all the overthinking. over regulation and busywork you propose is even possible? Would it solve anything except making work for 6- 10 taxpayer funded city employees to manage said bureaucracy.

No wonder Portland is the mess it is. People expect city gov't to solve every little issue.

1. Yes, I think it would be easily possible.

2. I expect that any city involvement could be funded by fees imposed on the scooter companies not the taxpayers.

Right now these giant tech companies are just acting as free riders. Dumping their scooters on city streets and expecting everyone to just accommodate them for free so they can make their profit. These scooter companies are not mom and pop operations, they are owned by giant out-of-state tech companies like Uber and Lyft and funded by giant venture capital firms. If they want to be part of the transportation mix in Portland (or anywhere else) they can pay their own way like everyone else. Car owners pay fees and gas taxes as well as income and property taxes. Cyclists and pedestrians are mostly local residents who pay income and property taxes that support local transportation. The out-of-state tech companies that own these scooters can certainly pay their own way too.

[Nell Plotts]

Small detail: Uber and Lyft are now publically traded companies and are not now funded by venture capital firms.

[texasdiver]

Originally Posted by Nell Plotts

Small detail: Uber and Lyft are now publically traded companies and are not now funded by venture capital firms.

I think it's both. They are publically traded but venture capital firms still own billions of dollars of shares.

But some of the other scooter companies are sheer venture capital plays. For example, Bird Scooters which put scooters in Portland: https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/3/2...unit-economics