Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I agree with you, zentropa and I'll go one further on that. I think that it has the potential to infinitely exacerbate itself.
Because I have known autistic people who have close relationships with others that they trust, and they get into social situations and might be kind of tone deaf to social cues or say inappropriate things. But if they have someone in their life that they trust to give them honest but kind feedback, then they can be coached. And with coaching, people can learn different ways to evaluate social information and make better decisions before they act or speak. But they are not going to have that precise feedback come from within, they may have very poor insight into what they might have said or done, how it looked to someone else.
And I say this, too, from experience with my son. While not autistic, as I've said, he's got issues that do affect how he interacts with other people. He also has poor insight into his own mental state and how others perceive him. But he does trust me enough to accept my coaching and advice, and I know him well enough to find ways to phrase feedback that he can understand.
But if someone is completely isolated and doesn't trust anyone to help them with insight into their behavior...they won't have access to that kind of help. A therapist could certainly be a benefit, though there's always the challenge to find one who is a good fit for what someone needs, and they cannot be there to witness interactions and always give truly clear feedback, they can only take a client's word for whatever happened. Which...if it's coming from someone with poor insight to evaluate these things...isn't always accurate.
Well I will certainly admit that I have been guilty of delusional thinking.
But to clear things up a bit, I'm not technically an incel. It's just that I have had so much bad luck with women that I know what it can feel like to be one. I was well up in my 20s before I even went on a date and sometimes years would pass before I would be able to find anyone else desperate enough to give me a chance.
The last so called "girlfriend" was a special piece of work herself as she didn't care about me at all and was just using me for alcohol and cigarettes. She probably saw my desperation as a sign that she could take advantage of me. Unfortunately, she would have been correct in that assessment.
In any case, the last time I saw her was in 2011. I continued with the online thing until about September of 2015 when I decided to give up altogether.
So while I'm not an incel, I'm definitely red pilled and some of the language can apply to both camps.
Well, I've seen this "red pill" term before but only now was curious enough to look it up. Thanks. Now I know what that means, lol. (I've missed a lot of pop culture.)
I've been familiar with incels since I was a teenager. I remember the news when Elliot Rodger went on his rampage. I have a socially maladjusted cousin who had similar disturbing thoughts and eventually embraced the ideology in his 20s.
From what I gather, incels aren't obsessed with sex per say but the lack of any form of intimacy with the opposite sex. My cousin growing up, never had any female friends, and never got any discussions on sex. When he brought it up with parents, they would shut down the topic. They also didn't approve of him doing feminine things.
It seems to me that sex is like drug prohibition for incels. By making it taboo to have an honest discussion about it, many hype it up and develop totally distorted views. Perhaps by having comprehensive sex ed and breaking down gender norms, they'd be less likely to fall down the rabbit hole.
LOL... there are some CRAZY responses in here. Everything from white supremacy to women being allowed to work are the reasons for incels??? I really don't think that's it.
Granted, I don't know any incels, but the whole women in the workplace thing... my mom was a CIA agent before I was born. I grew up watching Dolly Parton on that 9 to 5 movie. I think you guys are either trying to bring back an old problem, or you're hopelessly out of touch.
When I was growing up, I was a really good looking kid. I did sports, was in really good shape, and I never really thought about it, but I always had girls coming after me. But I was a huge dork at the same time. I ran a BBS, loved computers. There was a really attractive (and very intelligent) girl that would come to my door every morning to walk with me to school, and I'd try to leave as early as possible to get to school so I wouldn't have to walk with her. Other girls, I don't even know how they ended up at my house, but they were always complimenting my mom on our staircase, or furniture, etc. These girls would hit on me constantly despite the fact that I was a huge dork.
Imagine for a second now that I wasn't good looking, and ONLY had the dork thing going for me. The "self-validation" that I have, they wouldn't have. They'd just have the dork part, and girls would be repelled and totally uninterested. No one is really interested in your brain when you're in high school.
Now, fast forward today... when everyone has the internet and porn and social media are easily accessible to anyone and everyone. Sex, sexualization, and everything else is happening at a much faster rate today than at any point in our history. Kids are being introduced to sex (and having sex) at a much earlier age than in the past 100 years in our country.
NOW, consider those kids who are dorky, and spend all their time on computers and playing video games. They are not maturing socially, not being forced to interact with other kids, and are basically developmentally challenged. Asperger's syndrome seems to be far more prevalent today than ever. These kids are frustrated, pent up, and they've become angry.
Now, I'm not justifying any kind of hate or anger that comes out of that... I don't know, I don't know any incels, but I'm just trying to explain it.
I think that white supremacy, or women working, or any of the other really crazy stuff in here is totally just out there. It's just a matter of people wanting something they can't have, and being bitter about it.
I really blame social media. It puts up a facade of reality that people work so hard to emulate. It also sexualizes our daughters. But introducing MORE sex discussion with kids, is DEFINITELY not where we need to be.
Just...one thing... I have a son who does not have issues that are precisely LIKE this but in his own way, they're just as severe. The problem was, they are not always like that from birth or childhood. Some mental illness manifests later on. My kid was outgoing, friendly, he was like the family ambassador. We had no idea he had this schizo-affective stuff until he'd already dropped out of high school and was late teens/early adulthood. And if you were to Google, you'd find that's pretty common for schizo-spectrum issues.
It makes him this kind of socially awkward and socially anxious sometimes because of the paranoia/delusions part. He seriously believes that he's being observed and judged by everyone, all the time. Delusions of persecution. He is not so crazy that he's constantly like disheveled and spouting nonsense, especially if he's on his meds, but there's some stuff going on in there that makes it hard for him to relate to other people for sure, and also more prone to falling into conspiracy beliefs.
I'm not suggesting that cuddle monster or anyone here has something like this. I just want to point out that not all mental illness can even be spotted, or has manifested itself, in childhood at all. There are a few conditions where a perfectly functional kid suddenly becomes a completely different person.
What I find even more fascinating is Jill basically said women are inherently weak and nobody really objected to it.
I’ve found more women then not kinda feel that way and don’t feel women have skills to make decisions or be leaders.
What I find even more fascinating is Jill basically said women are inherently weak and nobody really objected to it.
I’ve found more women then not kinda feel that way and don’t feel women have skills to make decisions or be leaders.
Considering this thread has 45+ pages in less than a month, I think the reality is that no one even saw that comment.
I see no difference in the ability for a man or woman to be a leader. It has far more to do with upbringing, confidence, and personality.
I think many women simply just don't want to be leaders... but I see that changing. Most of my bosses in industry have been women, and many of them were technical before they went into management.
I was about to say the same thing. Nothing was said about being emotional isn’t masculine.
Jill1983’s post was about the preference for relationships where the men are confident, stoic, “rocks” that “contrast the weaknesses like self-esteem issues” of the women in the relationship. I’m not even interpreting, that’s literally what she said.
That sounds like a recipe for a relationship that’s not very healthy, possibly abusive.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
