Moving from Rochester, NY to Raleigh area, any tips? advice? (Chapel Hill: amusement park, HOA fees)
Raleigh, Durham, Chapel Hill, CaryThe Triangle Area
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My family is considering a move to NC in the next year or so. Well, I want to, but have to convince my husband! I do like Rochester. It is a great place to raise a family, but the winters are getting to me. It was even cold in October this year! My kids are even wishing for Spring now so they can ride their bikes. I'm positive on the outside for them, but I hate the bitterly cold weather.
So, I'm interested in NC because it's like having the best of both worlds, four seasons with milder winters. If we want snow, we can travel to the mountain areas,right? Their are resorts for skiing, I've read.
1. Obviously jobs are our first priority. I'm a teacher, but have heard it's so crowded in certain counties, that classes are held in trailers, true?
My husband is a computer engineer and is looking into RTP, to start with.
2. Schools are important, of course. I have 5yr old twins and a 3yr old. I would love to hear of recommended school systems, preferably traditional calendar. Not sure how I might like multi-track.
3. Housing - we would like living in a neighborhood that isn't "cookie cutter," as my husband calls it, with a decent size yard. I like the idea of a neighborhood playground and pool, since it gets so hot in the summer. Any recommended neighborhoods?
4. Culture and activities for families is obviously a plus.
Planning a visit next month. We have family in Apex. We visited twice previously, before kids.
thanks so much to anyone who reads a long thread . . .but moving is a big decision now, with kids, not like when it was just the two of us. : )
You'd probably want to avoid Wake county due to the very "in flux" situation right now with schools. Wake is also where the worst overcrowding (trailers, perpetual transfers, etc) have been rampant. As you may have heard, a brand new majority on the School Board has breezed in, promising to "kick #### and take names" and it's causing a lot of angst on all sides. This doesn't sound like it would be the best environment to come into as a teacher, either.
Orange county schools (NW corner of The Triangle) are the cream of the crop in this area, but of course this means that costs of living are high there. I also hear good things about the Clayton (Johnston county, SE of the Triangle proper) schools, but that would be quite a hike to RTP.
I grew up and spent half my adulthood in Rochester... Below are my answers in blue.
1. Obviously jobs are our first priority. I'm a teacher, but have heard it's so crowded in certain counties, that classes are held in trailers, true?
I moved here 17 years ago, and there were trailers. They've never gone away. (Actually, some may have disappeared recently, but trailers are no big deal. They are, by far, the least of your worries.)
Wake County is a humongous school system that covers Raleigh and surrounding towns (unlike Rochester's system).
It's currently in a state of flux with a new school board trying to make massive changes that some people don't want, and the long-time school superintendent just quit unexpectedly because he doesn't agree with what they're doing. Go to http://www.wcpss.net -- the main school system site -- and also read this forum for a lot of the background. Also read the local Raleigh newspaper, newsobserver.com.
There have been a lot of layoffs in the school system.
North Carolina has the tenth highest unemployment rate in the country. I heard Rochester's economy was recovering faster than the Triangle's economy.
My husband is a computer engineer and is looking into RTP, to start with.
IT has been hard hit by layoffs. It's really bad here. Call up some agencies and see what exact skills they're looking for. Maybe he'll get lucky and have what they're looking for.
2. Schools are important, of course. I have 5yr old twins and a 3yr old. I would love to hear of recommended school systems, preferably traditional calendar. Not sure how I might like multi-track.
See above. A lot of people like year-round schools here.
3. Housing - we would like living in a neighborhood that isn't "cookie cutter," as my husband calls it, with a decent size yard. I like the idea of a neighborhood playground and pool, since it gets so hot in the summer. Any recommended neighborhoods?
Homes cost a lot more than in the Rochester area. Most homes are much newer than Rochester, and most subdivisions can probably be considered "cookie cutter," depending upon your definition of "cookie cutter."
Many newer subdivisions have pools and playgrounds. It would be a good idea to find jobs first and then ask about specific subdivisions.
Most people are surprised by the tiny yards in the newer subdivisions, despite the high prices. Older neighborhoods (from the 60's) have bigger yards, but older neighborhoods are not as prevalent.
4. Culture and activities for families is obviously a plus.
Well, those are all over the Triangle area. Pick up a copy of "Carolina Parent" magazine while you're here. Some people think there isn't enough to do here. It depends on what you're used to. I think there is plenty to do, you just need to look a little harder for it sometimes.
Your family should be a great resource for you for information.
Also -- unless you love extremely humid summers, you'll miss Rochester's gloriously comfortable summers as well as Lake Ontario, the Finger Lakes, all the festivals, convenient Seneca Park Zoo and Sea Breeze Amusement Park, and Rochester's proximity to Canada. I do. You have to go out of town to find a zoo or amusement park.
Natives here love to brag about being "only" two hours from the beach and four hours to the mountains (and skiing). In Rochester, I would ski on Wednesday evenings, 45 minutes away at Bristol Mountain. Lake Ontario beach (with pier, harbor, sand beach, boardwalk, Abbott's custard, sunsets, water as far as the eye can see, and the historic Denzel carousel) was 15 minutes away, within the city limits. Two hours away is a whole different country to explore.
Last edited by lovebrentwood; 03-02-2010 at 10:38 AM..
My husband is a computer engineer and is looking into RTP, to start with.
IT has been hard hit by layoffs. It's really bad here. Call up some agencies and see what exact skills they're looking for. Maybe he'll get lucky and have what they're looking for.
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Take note of the latest news from IBM: another 2000 layoffs (obviously, not all here, but that's that many more experienced IT folks who'll be applying for local IT and engineering jobs.
Aha....like Brentwood I also was born and raised in Rochester, and moved to Raleigh from 1994-2007. We actually moved back to Rochester for a variety of reasons; not that I'm suggesting that would happen to you.
Weather: spring is definitely nicer in Raleigh than Rochester; March is my least favorite month here and was my favorite month down there. Late fall around November is usually more pleasant there than here as well. Winter is not sunny and 70 degrees like everyone up here likes to think it is. December-late feb/early march is usually highs in the mid-upper 40's, lows in the 20's with a few streatches of 50-60 degree days thrown in the mix. Obviously they don't get a tenth of the snow that we get here but the snow they do get affects them 10x worse. We'll get 6 inches here without batting an eye and really little to no inconvenience. 6 inches there (which usually happens about once every 2 years; with most years seeing at least one or two 3+ inch "storms") is a big deal and can shut things down for up to a week. It's not the local's fault; its just they way things are. I'm sure I wouldn't have to tell you that summer and early fall here in Upstate NY are pretty hard to beat; so those are definitely the times of year you may find yourself wishing you were not in Raleigh.
Schools; The issue a Rochesterian will likely be concerned with. Unless you are currently in Greece CSD; Wake County Schools will simply not be on par with what you would expect in a suburban Rochester school district. They are a mess. There are some great schools; but whether or not your kids will be assigned to them (Which you can NOT gaurentee by moving to a neighborhood that is close to the school) and whether or not they will STAY assigned to them is always a big question.
COL; Property taxes and gas prices, and most utilities are lower in NC in comparison to Upstate NY; for everything else its the opposite. It makes the COL about the same; with, at least in my experience, it being a little more affordable in Rochester.
This area is changing by the day. If you have a job to come to or money to live off, you will be fine. I love it here, the people, the weather - except Jan-March.
But jobs...yuck! They are hard to find right now. The school situation has gone down hill fast! Potentially, being a new teacher, you could find yourself teaching in a hi poverty school with little to no budget once the changes take place.
IT sector has taken a huge hit! I think it's way too risky right now to move here given your backgrounds.
Like some of the other respondents my wife and I are also from Rochester. We did undergraduate and graduate work at RIT and lived in Scottsville, Fairport, and Webster (twice!). We now make our home in Apex. So maybe like them I can offer you some good - but perhaps slightly different - advice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjm1013
1. Obviously jobs are our first priority. I'm a teacher, but have heard it's so crowded in certain counties, that classes are held in trailers, true?
True, but they're not as scary as you might think they would be. My daughter is now ten years old (we moved here 2.5 years ago) and they generally alternate turns between the main building and the trailers. I've been inside the trailers for parent/teacher conferences, and they're not bad. They have windows, heat, and air conditioning and all the usual classroom supplies (whiteboards, desks, cubbies, etc).
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjm1013
My husband is a computer engineer and is looking into RTP, to start with.
Be aware that the IT market in this area has been hit pretty hard. Lots of laid off IT workers looking for work means lots of competition for the few openings you might see. I would suggest waiting until you have lined up a job before taking the plunge. Look around outside RTP too, that may be the IT "hub" of the area, but there are a lot of good firms (e.g., my employer: SAS) that reside outside RTP proper.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjm1013
2. Schools are important, of course. I have 5yr old twins and a 3yr old. I would love to hear of recommended school systems, preferably traditional calendar. Not sure how I might like multi-track.
Year round sounds strange when you start reading about it, but they're really just a way of maximizing school utilization in an area where lots of people are moving in and few people are beating a path to county government asking to pay higher property taxes to build more schools. It's a practical and workable solution that utilizes the buildings year round while putting 33% more students through the existing system each year. Also, depending on your situation, it may work out better. My family thinks it's terrific! My daughter gets a lot less bored on a three week vacation than she would with a twelve week one, and we find that it keeps the material fresher in her mind from year to year. In our experience we have found that a significant proportion of the people who don't like it feel that way because they have older kids in traditional middle or high school and younger kids in year-round elementary schools. That can make scheduling vacations difficult, and it's a very valid point. For us, with only one child, it's fantastic!
A bigger concern down here lately is the brewing storm over differences between folks who advocate strongly for school diversity policies (e.g., busing children to a more distant school to achieve racial or financial parity across schools) and those who favor community schools (allowing the children to attend the school nearest where they live). There is a lot of great arguments and well-intentioned people on both sides of the issue, but it has been thrust into the limelight lately because recent school board elections have tilted the debate in favor of the community schools side and that's ruffled a lot of feathers.
For whatever it's worth, I think there are a lot of great elementary schools down here (don't know much about the middle or high schools yet, my daughter is too young). We had a some issues with our Webster school so that was a major factor in our move too. We chose our current home in Apex in no small measure because it put us in the Salem Elementary school district, which is where we REALLY wanted to be at that time and based on our own research. Other schools that I have heard have good reputations would include Davis Drive, Olive Chapel, and Baucom. But that's just a sample and there are lots of other good schools too: check out great schools dot net for more objective school ratings, honest parent reviews, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjm1013
3. Housing - we would like living in a neighborhood that isn't "cookie cutter," as my husband calls it, with a decent size yard. I like the idea of a neighborhood playground and pool, since it gets so hot in the summer. Any recommended neighborhoods?
You likely won't find a decent sized yard (whatever that means) in any reasonable price range in Raleigh or any of the first or second rings of suburbs. You'll have to get out a little ways further, perhaps even into one of the adjoining counties. This area has experienced EXPLOSIVE growth over the last few years, all the homes on large lots command a very high price. The good news: most of the communities have reasonable HOA fees (mine is only $35 / month) and for that provide walking trails, a community swimming pool, club houses, playgrounds, and so on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjm1013
4. Culture and activities for families is obviously a plus.
Don't know much about this one. My daughter lives and breathes soccer, so we're busy with that almost every night and weekend. Our social life is whatever we can squeak out with the other soccer moms and dads at all those practices and games. But certainly as the state capital you can find a number of museums and attractions (including a great permanent butterfly exhibit at the museum of natural history). We also have lots of good restaurants and movie theaters and a number of nationally recognized schools and universities.
No doubt you'll find people that will tell you all kinds of reasons why you should think twice about moving here. We certainly heard a lot of those arguments. Those are valid and honest opinions based on their own personal experiences. I don't dismiss them. I can tell you this as one family that took the same plunge you are now considering: we love it here! It goes without saying that we miss our family and friends still back in NY, but overall we have no regrets about moving out of Rochester. We found a comfortable, child-friendly community to live in; two fantastic IT jobs (this was prior to the market collapse, would be harder to do now); a great school; lower taxes; and much milder weather (flower buds in February, amazing!). For us, it's been almost entirely positive.
Having said that, if you do choose to join the extended family of former Rochester residents living down here now, take your time and plan it carefully. Research the schools and communities and learn the job market and area. Don't make the mistake of assuming that "of course an experienced and educated IT or education worker can find work in the triangle." It's not like that anymore (if it ever was) and you can expect to be looking for work for many months. So use those months to your advantage, expand your job search beyond just RTP, and when you're ready to take the plunge feel comfortable in knowing that you've done your research, that others have been where you are, and that it all worked out great for at least some of them.
Consider buying in Orange County and teaching in Chapel Hill City schools. This would give you the opportunity to buy more house and land and have a lower tax rate. Additionally, by living in Orange and working for Chapel Hill schools, your kids can then go to Chapel Hill schools which are solid. Also Orange county will feel more like the outer burbs of Rochester.
Sorry no Wegmans but we have good coop grocery stores, and you can always supplement with Harris Teeter and Trader Joe's. Also no Dinosaur BBQ, but the stuff here is better and if you want Dinosaur, you can buy the sauce at our grocery stores and make it yourself.
Apologies in advance for our lack of a completed interstate loop, our inefficient and underfunded snow removal, and our complete disinterest in the Bills.
Just word of advice and car insurance is very different and you get into accident and even 1% is your fault and no pain and suffering money for that person. Four other state also go that way and so it not like NY no fault and very important for under insurance and un-insurance. Wake co schools are mess and want to check them out and just go to NC WRAL. In fact article today and they are laying off and getting budget cuts. Taxes are also high for the southeast area as well. Jobs pay less then the northeast does. Lot to think about as well. Just want you to get a full picture but a lot to do with family if that what you are looking for. NC is not cheap anymore that for sure not like the older days.
My family is considering a move to NC in the next year or so. Well, I want to, but have to convince my husband! I do like Rochester. It is a great place to raise a family, but the winters are getting to me. It was even cold in October this year! My kids are even wishing for Spring now so they can ride their bikes. I'm positive on the outside for them, but I hate the bitterly cold weather.
So, I'm interested in NC because it's like having the best of both worlds, four seasons with milder winters. If we want snow, we can travel to the mountain areas,right? Their are resorts for skiing, I've read.
1. Obviously jobs are our first priority. I'm a teacher, but have heard it's so crowded in certain counties, that classes are held in trailers, true?
My husband is a computer engineer and is looking into RTP, to start with.
2. Schools are important, of course. I have 5yr old twins and a 3yr old. I would love to hear of recommended school systems, preferably traditional calendar. Not sure how I might like multi-track.
3. Housing - we would like living in a neighborhood that isn't "cookie cutter," as my husband calls it, with a decent size yard. I like the idea of a neighborhood playground and pool, since it gets so hot in the summer. Any recommended neighborhoods?
4. Culture and activities for families is obviously a plus.
Planning a visit next month. We have family in Apex. We visited twice previously, before kids.
thanks so much to anyone who reads a long thread . . .but moving is a big decision now, with kids, not like when it was just the two of us. : )
Up stater transplat-er back to upstate for a work assignment and then back to NC. IMHO these are my up state-er answers to your questions in the order you asked.
1. Unless one is retired or independently or dependably wealthy a job is a pretty big deal. Every area is always looking for 'good' teachers. This area is no different. Because of growth trailers are a staple of the school system here. No getting around that. Children come quicker than one can stack bricks. They are air conditioned and provide sheltor from the sun. If many can learn in them than one can teach in them IMHO.
2. IMHO the sooner you start them in multi-track or year round schools the better. See #1 above. Children are coming quicker than one can stack bricks. But it is 100% a personal choice what one likes better or worse. Heard that said or saifd it at some point!
3. Cookie cutters are out and urban corrals are in. Going outside the corral to the pasture country cost money. One area to look is Wake Forest. One can find a deal on both an urban corral as well as a pasture based home. Again the area offers everything in between. Neighborhood is a personal choice. Most have neighbors and are generally safe statistically. Personal choice comes into play.
4. One thing the area has is culture. From the downtown streets of Raleigh to the banks of Falls and Jordan Lakes to hiking and bike paths sprinkled around the area. Some people find culture in trailers and barns. Its all up to what you are looking for as it relates to culture.
Rochester is a nice place. Lots of liquid sunshine and occasional..well OK...solid rain! The kind that flakes!
Things on my list to think about for any move:
1. How much will you miss family?
2. How much more/less of a commute will it be to work/play?
3. Property Taxes are less in NC but in some cases so are the services.
4. Can you tolerate cold better than heat?
5. Your children are young and that helps. The older they are the harder to move them.
6. Its easier on everyone involved if you have a job lined up prior to the move. The move itself is stressful enough and one does not have employment it elevates the stress level.
But with the proper planning and home work the transition can be a great experience. IMHO this is as good an area as any to move to and raise a family. Best of luck in your decision.
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