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You could offer to pay your agent even more than you originally agreed to, haha. Think about what the listing agent does: advertise, research, negotiate, attend to the legal matters. Oh yeah, and if your agent does not attract a buyer on his own, he uses the help of a buyer agent who brings buyers to him, also negotiates (against you), and handles legal aspects including timing of inspections, appraisals, etc if needed. So, essentially your agent has all the responsibility but subcontracts if necessary to a buyers agent in order to find that special person with money and a willingness to sign on the dotted line.
If you sell without the complication of the buyer agent, who is certainly working on behalf of the buyer and not you, so much the better. Your agent has done a great job! You have sold your house! Don't complain and don't look back.
However, you said that he said "he does it very often to yield highest selling price for his seller". This is not clear to me. What does he do often? Try to get unrepresented buyers? Does this mean he favors unrepresented buyers in any way (the words strongly suggest that this outcome was intended rather than simply by chance)? If this were the case then obviously you may be out of pocket with a lower offer than if he pushed his hardest to get any kind of buyer, represented or not. I mean, if he was looking for an unrepresented buyer and favored an unrepresented buyer than he could be restricting the market and I would not be happy with that. And to me, that's what it sounds like he could be implying from those words. If it were me, I would challenge that.
It can be argued, (and often is) that the unrepresented buyer is more likely to pay a higher price, as he doesn't have the benefit of a knowledgeable agent with solid negotiating skills to counter the work of the listing agent. Would you expect the average person to be able to negotiate a better deal than a good real estate agent?
It can be argued, (and often is) that the unrepresented buyer is more likely to pay a higher price, as he doesn't have the benefit of a knowledgeable agent with solid negotiating skills to counter the work of the listing agent. Would you expect the average person to be able to negotiate a better deal than a good real estate agent?
The market dictates the price, not the agent. I have never once felt that a buyers agent has had any influence at all over the negotiations when negotiating the price to appear on the contract. Most times the buyers agent is just a conduit to keep the emotion out of the conversation.
The place the buyers agent earns his pay (in my opinion) is when negotiating repairs, getting quotes, recommending subcontractors, working with banks over the financing, etc, and also anytime a clueless buyer just needs his hand held.
But to directly answer your question - No I don' think a buyers agent influences the price in any impactful way.
On the surface I do tend to agree with the others in that his job is to sell the house and if he does it working with the help of a buyer's agent or alone, it shouldn't make a difference to you. I'm a layman, not an agent so just my personal views.
However, you said that he said "he does it very often to yield highest selling price for his seller". This is not clear to me. What does he do often? Try to get unrepresented buyers? Does this mean he favors unrepresented buyers in any way (the words strongly suggest that this outcome was intended rather than simply by chance)? If this were the case then obviously you may be out of pocket with a lower offer than if he pushed his hardest to get any kind of buyer, represented or not. I mean, if he was looking for an unrepresented buyer and favored an unrepresented buyer than he could be restricting the market and I would not be happy with that. And to me, that's what it sounds like he could be implying from those words. If it were me, I would challenge that.
Also, I would suggest that you ensure that this buyer is well qualified. Sometimes when agents are about to be fired, viewings and buyers can mysteriously materialize. I understand that slimy feeling and I would not be happy if he left out that 'detail' of them being unrepresented. I would ask loads of questions, including if there is any relationship between him and the buyer. I would not want any new surprises. Are you satisfied with the buyer or have you not got that far?
You summed it up very well. Yes he represents unrepresented buyers a lot...
I passed everything along to the attorney. AT least will feel a little "covered"...
I've bought 2 properties without having a realtor represent me, just the listing agent. Not to save money but because it removes a layer of communication delay and because it seems like the listing agent has more motivation to sell to me with no other agent involved. I don't know what their listing agreement is with the seller, some agents do get more money if no other agent is involved but not likely the whole commission.
On 2 different purchases being represented by a buyers agent I know for a fact the listing agent did everything possible NOT to get my offer to the seller, trying to get the entire commission for themself. This is probably why I dislike using a buyers agent. Yes I made those buys even dealing with a difficult listing agent but hair-pulling stress.
The market dictates the price, not the agent. I have never once felt that a buyers agent has had any influence at all over the negotiations when negotiating the price to appear on the contract. Most times the buyers agent is just a conduit to keep the emotion out of the conversation.
The place the buyers agent earns his pay (in my opinion) is when negotiating repairs, getting quotes, recommending subcontractors, working with banks over the financing, etc, and also anytime a clueless buyer just needs his hand held.
But to directly answer your question - No I don' think a buyers agent influences the price in any impactful way.
Always a pleasure to read your very clear and logical posts, Mark. Sometimes I have to check to make sure I'm on the right forum when I read your posts. :-)
My view is that:
1. Buyers very commonly end up finding out that they need to pay more than they initially intended to when buying a property. Many potential reasons - they learned the reality of the market, growth of expectations, fell in love with something slightly over budget, fall in love and "can't lose it", or whatever.
2. Buyers are often very nervous and unsure of everything and the (high) price that they need to pay is, I think, often the most stressful part (is it too much?, am I overpaying?, can I really afford it?, ...)
3. Buyer's agent can provide comfort in the (often stressfully high) price offered/paid. "The comps support this price", "this is a great neighborhood and it's risen in value", "if you really want it, you can't mess around with a low offer". Or whatever.
Therefore, I see the buyer's agent role as more of a general force to increase prices paid rather than to reduce prices.
The whole collaborative selling model between the buyer's/listing agents is built on providing comfort to the buyer or holding his hand as you put it so this would seem to be a feature rather than a defect. Am I wrong?
So your listing agent did their job and sold your house for an acceptable amount, and you are upset the agent will make more money than you expected since he's not splitting the commission, yet will have to do more work...
Get over it. It could have sat on the market for months, and then a buyer with an agent may have made a low ball offer...
You summed it up very well. Yes he represents unrepresented buyers a lot...
I passed everything along to the attorney. AT least will feel a little "covered"...
You're confusing the terms. If the buyer is unrepresented, then your agent is working FOR you and working WITH the buyer. The difference is important. In this scenario, your agent is working to advance your interests, not the buyer's. His goal is to get the best price and terms for you. Sensitive information you share with him is to be kept confidential, while anything he learns about the buyer, including motivation and willingness to pay a certain price, will be shared with you and used to your advantage.
No. By law, both buyers and sellers are permitted to act without representation. You are permitted to walk away from the sale, even at this point (although it will cost you). But you cannot demand that the buyer hire an agent.
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or ask the agent flat out to reduce the purchase price by 3%
Well I suppose you can always ask, but why would he agree to this? You have a contract which he is presumably following. Even if the buyer is unrepresented, they have 'implied agency' with your agent, which means your agent has liability and responsibility to the buyer...even though they didn't ask for this situation. Why would it be fair to expect your agent to take on that additional responsibility for free?
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or turn him into his broker and ask for someone else to take over the listing
]
Again you can ask....but given that you have already accepted the offer, he will still likely get his commission. The broker may grudgingly fulfill your request, but since the replacement agent probably won't get paid and is coming into the deal when it is mostly finished, you probably won't be happy with the new relationship either.
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Was it his responsibility to disclose to me that the buyer is not represented(I cant find that law)?
No, in fact it could be considered irresponsible to present an offer as if it is somehow less worthwhile because of the buyer's unrepresented nature. Certainly it would be unethical for him to suggest more aggressive negotiating strategy simply because the buyer was unrepresented.
It kinda sounds like you are upset about other things and using this as an excuse to 'get back' at your agent for something.
Well I suppose you can always ask, but why would he agree to this? You have a contract which he is presumably following. Even if the buyer is unrepresented, they have 'implied agency' with your agent, which means your agent has liability and responsibility to the buyer...even though they didn't ask for this situation. Why would it be fair to expect your agent to take on that additional responsibility for free?
Please forgive me if I'm being ignorant but without a dual agency agreement (there is none in this case), how can an agent have agency relationships on each side of the transaction - an expressed one with the seller and an implied one with the unrepresented buyer, as you point out above. I understand that the concept of implied agency simply means that it is not formalized but does this concept also allow something like a dual agency without a dual agency agreement? Obviously if they were to have expressed agency relationships with both seller and buyer then this would have to be done via dual agency (if allowed) so why is it different if the agency relationship with the buyer is implied and that same agent has an expressed agency relationship with the seller?
Does the seller need to be notified if some action triggers an implied agency with an unrepresented buyer as there would be some sort of dual agency once implied agency is triggered with the buyer? If what you're saying is true and there is an implied agency with the buyer, it would appear that in this case, the seller was not informed that his agent now has an implied agency relationship with the other side of the transaction. Is that problematic in itself? Another reason why the seller should have been informed of the unrepresented status (and implied agency) with the buyer?
Seems like murky waters to me.
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