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Exactly. I've owned three pre-war homes, built in 1888, 1926, and 1925 respectively. All had modern plumbing, electrical, and heating infrastructure, and all had recent (within the past 20 years) updates to kitchens and baths. They all were functional and comfortable.
The 1888 and 1925 houses, though, had their original features remuddled right out of them with new molded fake wood interior doors, molded fake wood trim instead of the original wood trim, etc. The 1926 house - I was the second owner, believe it or not - had all the original trim (unpainted, thank goodness) and decorative features. I miss that house.
Agreed. I'll never know why whichever owner of my current house (the 1925 house) decided to rip out all the original interior doors and replace them with molded fake wood junk, or tear out the original baseboards and door/window frames and replace them with generic fake wood trim. What was the point?
This is the type of person who should not own an older home.
Sounds like buying it as is and rehabbing it is the less expensive of the options.
Again, some people should not be buying older homes.
The kitchen wasn't made with "quality materials"?
So much for "character", eh?
I don't understand this snide remark from you and Otterhere. Most old kitchens need to be brought up to code and this one was no different. The quality is in the build of the house, the beautiful oak and terrazzo flooring, wrought iron on the porch, and original 50s bath fixtures. We remodeled the kitchen to look like it was original, not that I owe you or anyone else here a defensive explanation. Satisfied?
But that's not sufficient for everyone. Heck, in the last two years I've created 13 garden beds and had a triple-level waterfall and small pond installed in my yard. A "flower in a pot" would never satisfy my need to garden and create a wildlife habitat around my vintage home.
Sure, but someone who loves gardening that much probably wouldn't be inclined to buy a condo in the first place. I'm lazy though and I can barely keep a basil plant alive for more than a month (believe me I tried...went through 3 this year before I gave up), let alone 13 garden beds. A balcony/patio with a comfy chair will do me just fine. I can't even use it these days anyway because the cat likes to jump up on everything
Sure, but someone who loves gardening that much probably wouldn't be inclined to buy a condo in the first place. I'm lazy though and I can barely keep a basil plant alive for more than a month (believe me I tried...went through 3 this year before I gave up), let alone 13 garden beds. A balcony/patio with a comfy chair will do me just fine. I can't even use it these days anyway because the cat likes to jump up on everything
Oh, I understand about the cat - I can't even unbox a new rosebush on my enclosed porch because my boy cat will start eating it, thorns and all, the minute my back is turned!
I don't understand this snide remark from you and Otterhere...not that I owe you or anyone else here a defensive explanation. Satisfied?
An "updated" or "upgraded" kitchen with the holy trinity (granite, tile, stainless steel) in an otherwise original historic house is out of place and jarring. It's possible to do it tastefully and in keeping with the age and style of the house, but it's too often not. That's what I envision when I hear a kitchen has been modernized.
An "updated" or "upgraded" kitchen with the holy trinity (granite, tile, stainless steel) in an otherwise original historic house is out of place and jarring. It's possible to do it tastefully and in keeping with the age and style of the house, but it's too often not. That's what I envision when I hear a kitchen has been modernized.
I think of modernized as meaning having up-to-date electrical, appliances, and workspaces. I plan to “modernize” mine at some point (my home is from the ‘20s). Although I love modern architecture, that does not match the house at all and I have been relying more on the country cottage styles for inspiration. I also need to update the bathroom, but it was last updated in what looks to be the early ‘80s with awful vinyl floors and mauve wallpaper. I think the vinyl was also mauve at some point but it is now faded.
There's "Character" and there's "broken." Kitchens often get harder use than any other room in the house, they have way more moving parts, etc. That tile countertop installed in 1920 is likely at the end of the road, ditto wood counters, and that assumes that it wasn't updated 30-50 years ago with some kind of laminate. And if the doors are falling off the cabinets...
Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere
An "updated" or "upgraded" kitchen with the holy trinity (granite, tile, stainless steel) in an otherwise original historic house is out of place and jarring. It's possible to do it tastefully and in keeping with the age and style of the house, but it's too often not. That's what I envision when I hear a kitchen has been modernized.
Eh, tile is as old a flooring material as there is, I've lived in very old places with it and remember my Grandmothers house (over 150 years old) had it. Stainless is a pretty timeless look as well, it looks a lot more consistent to the original style than a 1991 white appliance. Granite? Looks too modern to me but still looks better than tile counters or laminate...butcher block is often the most appealing, or slate.
There's "Character" and there's "broken." Kitchens often get harder use than any other room in the house, they have way more moving parts, etc. That tile countertop installed in 1920 is likely at the end of the road, ditto wood counters, and that assumes that it wasn't updated 30-50 years ago with some kind of laminate. And if the doors are falling off the cabinets...
Eh, tile is as old a flooring material as there is, I've lived in very old places with it and remember my Grandmothers house (over 150 years old) had it.
I'm referring to the so-called holy trinity of renovation as frequently mentioned on "House Hunters." I know granite countertops and stainless steel appliances were two, and may be mistaken about the third element...
But pretty sure it was tile flooring replacing wood or linoleum.
OSB is stronger than “real boards” in sheathing applications. No doubt that the framing lumber was probably better but the 1x lumber has a lower shear strength than OSB.
OSB fails rapidly if there is a water leak in comparison to solid boards. It doesn't hold nails as well as solid boards either so siding is more likely to fail eventually with it (unless the contractor religiously nails into the studs with long enough nails for the siding). It also fails rapidly when the glue gets heated by a fire. New homes fail quickly and become very toxic when they catch fire in comparison to older homes. You might have only a few minutes to get out after a fire starts compared to 17 minutes or more in an older home.
I have friends that live in really expensive areas and they bought homes that's 100 years old. One spent 150K +, another spent 200K on renovations. They couldn't afford newer houses but just spent years living in them and updating things as time passes. A 100 year old house costs 800K.
The biggest thing is that after spending that much, there are still updating to do. They redid kitchens, bathrooms, flooring, siding, etc. But one friend only fished out the knob and tube wiring for new wires, but the house still doesn't have insulation, and only has plaster walls, but at least he changed all the windows.
My question is, to really do it right, such as updating a 100 year old house, by changing roof, shingles, take out Knob and tube wiring, new drywall with insulation, bathroom, kitchen, flooring, etc, wouldn't it be better off just buying a new or at least a house built after 1980 to not have asbestos and lead paint? At least it will last much longer and it won't have major issues in a few years. Where's the point where it's not worth it to buy old, there's a certain point where age will catch up and the foundation will be costly to fix, and a teardown is cheaper. I really feel that if someone spent that much Into renovations and after 10 years the house cost a ton to fix, if it's a teardown, then so much money is wasted on cosmetic stuff.
Plaster is a superior product. It was abandoned in common construction because of costs not because drywall was better.
Older wood windows can last for centuries if maintained. They can be weatherstripped and given storm windows to make them nearly as efficient as modern windows. And unlike the old windows, the modern windows might struggle to make it 10 or 20 years before needing to be replaced again. Broken glass in an older window is far cheaper to repair too as modern windows typically require the entire sash be replaced.
Insulation is helpful but beware that modern insulation methods with vapor barriers are probably a big cause of our common mold problems. You want the house to breathe.
If an older house still has original wood flooring, I fail to understand why anyone would want it replaced with cheaper modern materials. Wood floors can be repeatedly sanded and refinished if necessary.
I agree old wiring is dangerous but I would go further and say a home should be wired with metal conduit to protect the wiring, not just romex run through the walls. Something as simple as a mouse getting in and chewing that exposed wire can lead to a fire. Or a nail from hanging a picture.
Old stone foundations rarely fail unless there's major drainage issues.
Modern vinyl siding or whatever the latest trend is, is not as good as solid wood. In fact vinyl siding can cause the wood of the house to eventually rot by trapping moisture.
And while tastes in architecture is subjective, most modern houses just look like plastic, artificial boxes to me. I've been watching as a house 5 miles from mine gets remodeled. All the nice Victorian trim around the windows gone so tiny vinyl windows can be fitted where once larger windows were. The fancy front door replaced by a big box store special. Vinyl siding going up. The gingerbread trimmed front porch replaced with a sun-baked exposed deck. In short, it's beginning to look like just another plastic box that will in fact need serious maintenance in 10 years down the road. Much more than a paint job and some new storm windows. Any unique appeal the house had is basically gone.
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