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I think women who say they want a successful man basically means they just don't want a bum azz scrub... It's like a job app that requires a degree, but not in any specific field.
A lot of women in this thread are tempering their definitions of "successful." If your definition of successful was really that a guy be able to support himself financially and still have at least a little disposable income, then you would see no drawbacks in dating a guy who made $35k/yr as a carpenter and was financially prudent enough (uses coupons, invests wisely, etc.) to have an upper-middle-class lifestyle. But no ..... a guy has to have
a "cool" job title
a high income
in order to be good enough for you. That's the textbook definition of shallow. It's also plain stupid. There are tons of $250k/yr guys who are using borrowed money to make ends meet because they tried to live like millionaires.
Success, to me, means being self sufficient- relying on nobody else to pay your bills.
And, yes there are grown adults out there who are still relying on others to support them.
I've lived as an independent adult since I was 16,
so I can't relate to adults still living at home.
Totally different worlds & standards, I guess.
That being said, if a man has a stable job (I don't care what kind- white or blue collar)
I respect that--
I consider that far more successful than being a leech, or scamming freebies from the government........
Or, worst of all- looking for a sugar mama or sugar daddy
What success is, is different for everyone. What Believe stated is pretty much what I feel is a successful man as well. Pretty much for the same reasons stated. Bascially, he's made it as an financially independent adult and knows where he's going.
What's funny to me are the men here who think it's about raw wealth. Honestly, you are acting like a bunch of women who assume that when men say they want someone who is "attractive" that only means they want a hot model or someone who is a 10. Like those women who assume because a man wants someone attractive that he "must" mean a super sexy model, you are also guilty of taking a simple yet widely varying concept and making into a grossly distorted, overly focused, and unrealistic standard for yourselves that most women just don't have.
First off, thank you all for the excellent responses. Second, I think it's interesting how 'successful' includes other traits, such as independence. Someone might work full time at McDonalds making enough money to pay their own bills, but I wonder how many people will describe him as successful. Related to the idea of success is the notion of failure. How do we decide that someone is a failure? I would never declare someone who works at McDonalds to be a failure. Maybe he makes enough to support himself. Maybe he's content with working there. But I can't imagine many labeling him a success story. And that brings me to my third point, which others here have already touched upon. Our definitions of success are heavily dependent on our own achievements as well as the people we associate with. If a woman owns her own business, maybe she'll see the guy who's still working for someone else has a failure. Maybe a woman has friends whose partners are all highly paid professionals. Will she now measure every guy she meets against them?
If you ask a woman what she looks for in a man, you'll often hear something along the lines of "attractive, funny, outgoing, successful, etc.' But what exactly does 'successful' mean? Does it mean he's reached a certain income level? Does it mean he's now the boss of something? Does it mean he owns a home and no longer rents? Does it mean he's debt free? I realize the answer is going to vary and I'm hoping this doesn't escalate into gender bashing. But it seems like the word 'successful' is almost code for something else. Much like the word 'confident', no one will think less of you if you say you want someone who's confident. It's one of those safe words. Sounds great, but it's sufficiently broad that no one can really pin down exactly what you have in mind.
When I look at myself, I sometimes wonder if I meet the definition of 'successful' that these women subscribe to. I've been working steadily for nearly 2 decades in the same field, I have a good income that's more than enough to meet my needs, and except for a mortgage and car payment, I'm not carrying any debt. I don't still live at home with my parents. But I'm not a manager, I don't own my own business, and I don't have the kind of job title that really makes me stand out. So does that mean I'm not successful?
So for the men, how do you interpret it when a woman says she's looking for someone successful? Do you think it's a just nice way of saying she's a goldigger? Or do you see it in a positive light? For the women, how do you decide whether a man is successful? Is there some formula or litmus test that you apply? Is being successful a yes/no quality or do you feel it's more fluid than that? And if so, how do you measure it?
My meaning is simple, a successful man is a man who is happy with what he has based on what he actually earned with no outside assistance. Now a woman defining if a man is successful may be an entirely different definition.
Success, to me, means being self sufficient- relying on nobody else to pay your bills.
And, yes there are grown adults out there who are still relying on others to support them.
I've lived as an independent adult since I was 16,
so I can't relate to adults still living at home.
Totally different worlds & standards, I guess.
That being said, if a man has a stable job (I don't care what kind- white or blue collar)
I respect that--
I consider that far more successful than being a leech, or scamming freebies from the government........
Or, worst of all- looking for a sugar mama or sugar daddy
You can be a MCDonalds full time worker and rely on no one to pay your bills.
What success is, is different for everyone. What Believe stated is pretty much what I feel is a successful man as well. Pretty much for the same reasons stated. Bascially, he's made it as an financially independent adult and knows where he's going.
What's funny to me are the men here who think it's about raw wealth. Honestly, you are acting like a bunch of women who assume that when men say they want someone who is "attractive" that only means they want a hot model or someone who is a 10. Like those women who assume because a man wants someone attractive that he "must" mean a super sexy model, you are also guilty of taking a simple yet widely varying concept and making into a grossly distorted, overly focused, and unrealistic standard for yourselves that most women just don't have.
So what is your concrete definition of success then?
So what is your concrete definition of success then?
I said in my second sentence that it was pretty much the same as Believe's (the person I quoted). I just added that he also knows where he's going (which means he has a plan and not just living where the wind will take him).
I said in my second sentence that it was pretty much the same as Believe's (the person I quoted). I just added that he also knows where he's going (which means he has a plan and not just living where the wind will take him).
So a McDonald's worker who is an aspiring guitar band singer and is self supporting is successful then?
-supports himself
-plays in a band on the weekends/other gigs for weddings and such
-has a mcdonalds job.
-has a plan (plays guitar on weekends for exposure; hopes to eventually make it big and be discovered)
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