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Social rules and courtesies like this are rarely, if ever, based on rationality or "fairness" or "equality." They simply are what they are and some choose to adhere to them while others don't. In our society and culture, it is more often up to the man to woo the woman than the other way around. There are plenty of exceptions of course, but these "chivalrous" acts are to be done without expecting any sort of return. That's the difference between chivalry and social bartering.
Sylvian, this is what you want to hear is it not? Dating is not fair to the man in this particular way. The man is trying to win her affection. He may do or give many material things for this affection, and the affection itself is all he may get back. So be it. You can either play the game or sit out.
Social rules and courtesies like this are rarely, if ever, based on rationality or "fairness" or "equality." They simply are what they are and some choose to adhere to them while others don't. In our society and culture, it is more often up to the man to woo the woman than the other way around. There are plenty of exceptions of course, but these "chivalrous" acts are to be done without expecting any sort of return. That's the difference between chivalry and social bartering.
Sylvian, this is what you want to hear is it not? Dating is not fair to the man in this particular way. The man is trying to win her affection. He may do or give many material things for this affection, and the affection itself is all he may get back. So be it. You can either play the game or sit out.
Well apparently according to a lot of people the way things used to be done isn't that common anymore. Chivalry is something that is no longer practiced in mass so quite frankly, it's no longer a must if you want to date.
Social rules and courtesies like this are rarely, if ever, based on rationality or "fairness" or "equality." They simply are what they are and some choose to adhere to them while others don't. In our society and culture, it is more often up to the man to woo the woman than the other way around. There are plenty of exceptions of course, but these "chivalrous" acts are to be done without expecting any sort of return. That's the difference between chivalry and social bartering.
Sylvian, this is what you want to hear is it not? Dating is not fair to the man in this particular way. The man is trying to win her affection. He may do or give many material things for this affection, and the affection itself is all he may get back. So be it. You can either play the game or sit out.
Women's fraudulent language goes unchallenged. Garfunkel, try for yourself to induce these same women here, to say here, what you have said to me. Try for yourself to get your cogent thoughts to leave their lips. Here in this thread. I am meaning the single, unattached women who date and who brag about points and spades but who really offer nothing.
Only then will you understand what is missing here.
I've got a woman here who dances all around a question, yet says she "guarantees" her integrity. What a bunch of double-talk hogwash. Have I not been belaboring over several posts to call in her guarantee? Still, she believes her pretty words about herself with all of her heart.
Do you know where I went wrong with her? In my Post #248 where I introduced too many new words all at once. It scattered her attention as if I had set off firecrackers all around her. In her reply to it, she addressed those many new words, exclusively, completely derailed from the call to the question. There is little hope a person who does that will find her way back on track. Sorry to say, but that is why some men stop talking to their woman and become angry, or maybe just start to bark short commands, a style that the woman finds offensive. It is because the more words you throw at some women by way of an explanation, the more fractured and unproductive their thinking becomes. You explain something to a woman, thinking she is following the point, just to find that she responds only to the novelty of new words. And the point disappears. If you let it.
This is what comedian Bill Burr calls women going rogue, going off-road, when men have a point and women sense it.
Myself, I believe the interlocutors have cognitive issues, or are dissembling, or maybe both. Either way, it does not speak well for them and it does not help anybody.
Thank you.
Last edited by sylvianfisher; 10-01-2015 at 07:46 PM..
You do crack me up. You really have absolutely no clue.
I suppose you (conveniently?) missed the point I made that my relationship style is probably not best for whatever your "case study" is. Fact is, I'm in a male-led, authority-based, relationship. All of your passive-aggressive talk about wimmenz really is humorous. You could be any one of the thousands of men who proclaim themselves "Dominant" and don't have the first clue as to how to control themselves, let alone another human being.
You may very well have a penis, but you have absolutely no clue about what it is to be a man.
The answer to your question was the potential for a woman's adoration.
If you have no interest in that, than do not worry about being a gentleman.
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The answer to your question was the potential for a woman's adoration.
If you have no interest in that, than do not worry about being a gentleman.
This is pretty much what chivalry boils down to. It's a way to get the adoration of women/stand out among men/to "woo" her. It's considered masculine behavior.
I would add that this kind of things tends to work best with a traditional woman who likes and appreciates tradition gender roles (this is the kind of relationship I am in). It also works well with moderate (middle of the road) gender roles I think. But too much of it might be "over the top." If you are dating a more liberal/liberated from gender roles woman it will go over like a lead balloon.
A man doesn't HAVE to do anything. Society today expects NOTHING of him as far as manners or chivalry. So it all boils down to what kind of woman you are interested in attracting. Are you looking for a traditional woman in a traditional relationship? Well, then act like a traditional gentleman and you will find your traditional lady. If you are more middle of the road and want a more middle of the road when it comes to gender roles woman, well, it's going to be harder. But it's best to err on the side of too chivalrous (but read body language and listen to her to figure out what is too much and what is too little). You want a very liberal/liberated woman... share the chivalry or forget it... or whatever works (that kind of relationship isn't for me, so I know little about it).
Whatever you do, just don't be one of those lunkheads who wants a traditional woman, but assumes all women are super liberal and treat them as such (no chivalry) and then wonder why you can't find someone. If you don't act like a traditional man, the traditional women will write you off as nothing special. These are the guys I see complain women are confusing (they claim women want to be treated like a man, but not treated like a man at the same time). What's happening is you are confusing mixing up different "types" of women and lumping them into the same boat and trying to attract all of them at once (and getting no where).
You have to figure out what type you are interested in attracting and go from there. For example, if you are looking for a traditional feminine woman and a liberal woman shoots you a dirty look for holding the door, forget about her. You weren't interested in her type anyway. She's not the one you are trying to impress... but the more traditional woman you are interested in, will appreciate the gesture. That sort of thing (but just adjust your behavior for the type of woman you are interested in attracting).
One thing I'd like to note about relationship styles. Just because I woman is independent and self-identifies as feminist, doesn't mean she doesn't like somewhat traditional roles in relationships. The essence of feminism is that women should have the choice to lead any lifestyle they want. Everyone will make different choices.
I am a leader at work and in friend circles and I don't like that in relationships. It is my preference.
One thing I'd like to note about relationship styles. Just because I woman is independent and self-identifies as feminist, doesn't mean she doesn't like somewhat traditional roles in relationships. The essence of feminism is that women should have the choice to lead any lifestyle they want. Everyone will make different choices.
So as a feminist she gets to pick whatever benefits her pretty much when it comes to roles, right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by sylvianfisher
Actually, no, the last question on the table for her would not match what you wrote above.
I only reply here so that she will not assume that you have relieved her from answering.
Her last comment to me was unnecessary and I deserve a little better from her for my patience.
Thank you.
You are bringing valid points to this thread without the need of insults. If I remember correctly you can get infractions or suspended from the forum. Male posters have gotten in trouble for that before. I am not sure why the other way around is permitted. The same female posters have insulted you repeatedly already in this thread and nothing has been done about it.
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