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It's just part of being a guy. I need to make things happen if I want them to happen. If I don't make them happen, they don't happen. That isn't something I hold against anyone.
Also a good way to put things. As far as I'm concerned, this falls under "male privilege" (note the quotes, this assumes that men are the pursuers, so to speak...a concept I don't like in the first place).
I'm a firm believer that things tend to balance themselves out. I might find it unfair that, by nature of being female, I could theoretically sit back and pick from the men who choose to approach me. The counterpart to which is that, as the pursuer, I am free to pursue who I want, for as long as I want (within legal and moral guidelines, of course!), and equally free to stop doing so when I no longer feel inclined.
If someone puts me in a position to do all or most of the effort regarding planning dates/events/etc, it makes things easier to end by simply...not doing so. I don't mean to imply that all my relations end that way, but "not continuing to do something" is easier than "actively doing something" (in this case, actively clearing the air with someone who ISN'T passive enough for me to do all of the planning, etc.)
I'm a firm believer that things tend to balance themselves out. I might find it unfair that, by nature of being female, I could theoretically sit back and pick from the men who choose to approach me. The counterpart to which is that, as the pursuer, I am free to pursue who I want, for as long as I want (within legal and moral guidelines, of course!), and equally free to stop doing so when I no longer feel inclined.
This is what I was trying to say, but I wasn't as eloquent in my attempt. Well-written. This ^.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hivemind31
Also a good way to put things. As far as I'm concerned, this falls under "male privilege" (note the quotes, this assumes that men are the pursuers, so to speak...a concept I don't like in the first place).
I don't like it either, but I don't like a lot of things in this world. Still, its reality, I'm not handsome, or rich, or ripped, or a even a singer in a band... things don't fall in my lap, I have to go after them. Always have, always will.
I don't like it either, but I don't like a lot of things in this world. Still, its reality, I'm not handsome, or rich, or ripped, or a even a singer in a band... things don't fall in my lap, I have to go after them. Always have, always will.
Exactly. I don't do it because I enjoy it, or because of some rudimentary concept like "the thrill of the hunt", but rather because, if I didn't, I'd be dateless.
So basically you guys are drawn to passive women and then later hold their passivity against them?
I have no idea if you've made such comments, but it does seem to be a common complaint here among women that men's OLD messages are too brief, not relevant to the woman's profile, too forward or not forward enough, or just wrong. And by common complaint I mean chronic and frequent and tediously routine
So I'm saying it happens a lot.
Most of the men I talk to do feel to some extent that we're auditioning. It's generally accepted and I don't complain about it except perhaps here a bit as devil's advocate, and I realize that there's a performance aspect to women's traditional role in dating and mating, but our role gets a little old at times. For men this performance/auditioning deal starts with the general expectation that we approach, we ask or make first contact and it better be snappy on OLD, we pay, we plan and decide, and we have a disproportionate responsibility to commemorate the anniversary of the lady's acquiescence to or occasional approval of each act. All hyperbole of course, but there's a point in there.
Sometimes, in my darker moments, I feel like some women kind of think men, being the knuckle dragging dolts that we are, should be thrilled with any remotely positive response we get. Like the poor fvcker who got a call back because he can spell and punctuate. Probably made his otherwise paleolithic day.
Nobody said anything about "being drawn to passive women".
That's the conclusion Jade reached when a couple of the guys said they have to carry the conversation most of the time. That seems very unusual, so she concluded they tend to go for passive women. Seems reasonable.
He didn't say it did. By saying "it's part of being a guy", he's suggesting that it IS something that men have to deal with, with no assumptions made in the other direction.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWGirl74
I don't think this applies to just men.
Im saying it applies to me, I don't know about other men, but I think it is true for most men unless they're stunning looking, or super charismatic. I'm neither of those, and most people aren't.
For my lady friends, yes, the primarily sit back and pick from what comes to them, or some are very good and making things seem like its the guys idea. Which is quite amazing to watch. But most just pick from what presents itself. Its rather amazing, the last couple of people I've been out with, the one I was into last year, and the one I'm hanging with now, I can't count the number of times I leave them to go to the bathroom or get us drinks at an event and I come back and some dude has swooped right in. With the woman last year it usually happened multiple times a night. I think she's beautiful of course, but I'm guess the bro dudes here would say she's fat and a 5... It happened twice last night with the woman I'm hanging with now, though one of the people was a dude and the other was a chick.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth
That's the conclusion Jade reached when a couple of the guys said they have to carry the conversation most of the time. That seems very unusual, so she concluded they tend to go for passive women. Seems reasonable.
It isn't reasonable at all, and it isn't unusual. It's the norm. When you go out on the town its what you see when looking around, the guys carrying the load in keeping things moving. San Francisco I found to be the worst for that, with the social scene there it felt like the dudes there worked at being full time entertainers to keep the interest of the ladies they were seeing. Shows to go see, planning hikes, etc etc. This is especially true at early stages of dating... in a lot of ways there is some ritualistic bird of paradise dance dudes to engage women. It's been like that for time immemorial. Not likely to change, since if you don't choose to engage you go dateless, as other dudes will swoop right in and do the dance. Lots of this is just social convention too.
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