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when i was single i met a man on a blind date. he was average looking, very nice and from what i could tell, a good personality. he asked me point blank if he was the type of guy i would consider dating. i told him i would have to get to know him better but i would. and then he said he didn't believe me. he thought i was too pretty to consider him. i told him i was sorry he felt that way, since it wasn't the case at all, but that was pretty much the end of it.
guys are intimidated a lot of the time. i wouldn't be surprised if this is what is happening to your friend.
fyi: i really didn't have that many dates. i'd get a lot of looks on the street but very few men would approach. just the idea of rejection is too much for them.
Really? I've been told I'm "intimidating" but I never translated that into "I'm too pretty to be approached." I didnt pick the guys brains to find out exactly what they meant but I assumed they meant I wasnt approachable. I dont smile at people or make open body language and if people talk to me I try to end the conversation asap.
But on dates I change and try to be a good conversationalist, a good date. Because I agreed to be there and he is usually paying.
But as for the intimidating thing, if I am intimidating for some reason, then it tends to be only the boldest most persistent (read, psychopath) guys that would approach me: the guys unfazed by closed body language or the possibility of rejection.
Which probably explains why most of my boyfriends were possibly on the psychopath spectrum.
Really? I've been told I'm "intimidating" but I never translated that into "I'm too pretty to be approached." I didnt pick the guys brains to find out exactly what they meant but I assumed they meant I wasnt approachable. I dont smile at people or make open body language and if people talk to me I try to end the conversation asap.
But on dates I change and try to be a good conversationalist, a good date. Because I agreed to be there and he is usually paying.
But as for the intimidating thing, if I am intimidating for some reason, then it tends to be only the boldest most persistent (read, psychopath) guys that would approach me: the guys unfazed by closed body language or the possibility of rejection.
Which probably explains why most of my boyfriends were possibly on the psychopath spectrum.
Interesting.
Even as a guy who believes in approaching I may have passed. Not for fear of rejection; I’m of the “you miss every shot you don’t take” school of thought. With that said I also recognized some people just don’t want to be approached. I usually looked for some kind of indication an approach would be welcome. This meant getting her attention to start with. Someone with closed body language I would typically interpret that as someone who wished to be left alone.
There were few exceptions and times I did approach anyway, but usually I looked for the cues, verbal or non-verbal first.
Let’s ignore the fact that women can be just a shallow sometimes more then men... If you want to generalize and say as a whole men are more motivated by looks at first glance then women fine I can buy it but why do men get sh1t for it?
Women as a whole are more motivated by different things like what someone makes status fame talents etc how are those things anymore noble or important before you know someone then looks? Just like looks none of those things can tell you what kind of person they are or what kind of heart they have or if they’d make a good partner at all..
So if women value about certain things about men why can’t men value looks more then women?
Your question sounds as though you believe that all women are looking for status or fame. Not sure what you mean by "talents"; most people are drawn to someone who has a talent in some realm. That doesn't seem shallow at all. That comes under "personality" to me. Anyway, most women who are in LTR's or married are with someone who isn't famous and doesn't have high status, so that should tell you something.
But men are also judged by physical things they have no control over.. Height and hair are extremely important to most women and if you’re lacking in one or god forbid both that limits your dating pool a ton.
Women have so many ways to create attraction physically whether it’s the way they dress..makeup can help a ton.. most pretty women I’ve dated looked like completely different people without makeup..
Plus let’s not act like only pretty women are in relationships so men aren’t all that shallow..
As far as men I think they do struggle more.. I know way more men who’ve had no success at all later in life then women.. as far as complaining well struggling women also have more outlets for affection whether it’s through friends or if they get they need sex that’s much easier to attain for them..
Maybe the bolded is simply because you know more men?
Amazingly enough about height and hair, those rumored shortcomings mean nothing to women, when a guy is energetic, outgoing, and fun to be around. Trust me; I've seen women literally flock to bald guys (a certain mailman in a building where I worked would draw them out of there offices down several flights of stairs whenever he'd show up on the ground floor; all ages, from students to office staff through their 40's) and short guys just 5' tall or less. Give women a warm smile and bubbly personality, or attentiveness, and little else matters, first-impression-wise.
...because given that most people are monogamous/hetero, for every such woman who couples up, there's a man involved, so I don't think men actually have it any harder... It's just that the ones who struggle, complain more loudly and bitterly. Maybe men feel more entitled to it and more angry when they don't get it. I don't know.
Too obvious to sink in. Women have it so much easier...with who: the men they’re in relationships with. It’s the fringe who want to spin it.
But men are also judged by physical things they have no control over.. Height and hair are extremely important to most women and if you’re lacking in one or god forbid both that limits your dating pool a ton.
Women have so many ways to create attraction physically whether it’s the way they dress..makeup can help a ton.. most pretty women I’ve dated looked like completely different people without makeup..
Plus let’s not act like only pretty women are in relationships so men aren’t all that shallow..
As far as men I think they do struggle more.. I know way more men who’ve had no success at all later in life then women.. as far as complaining well struggling women also have more outlets for affection whether it’s through friends or if they get they need sex that’s much easier to attain for them..
Do bear in mind that all of the stuff I threw out in that long post, a lot of it is kind of BS media messages and "things people believe"-- I am trying to explain to you how women feel and think in response to a lot of men's talk and so on.
The point is that a man has like ten paths or more to become "attractive." He doesn't have to be good looking, he could be talented. OR famous or rich. OR witty. OR charismatic. He could pick anything and become good at it and engineer it into a selling point for himself.
A woman? Be pretty, or else. It's all we get. All men care about.
Ah...but is it, though? No. Not really. A lot of men will SAY this, and the media will SAY this and the commercials for a thousand products will work overtime to convince women of this... But ultimately, it's not the basic truth. Men's ability to feel attraction for women is flexible too, and even if looks are a pretty important factor for most men, what that even MEANS varies all over the map. I know men who won't date a heavy lady, and I know men who only date heavy ladies, just as an example. Some men insist that only young women are objectively attractive, and then there's a thread here that crops up saying that a lot of younger men like older women. People like whatever they like.
But as RbccL just pointed to, how do you figure the numbers work, if "women" in general have it so much easier?
It's easier for women to "get sex?" OK...with whom? If a woman gets that easy sex, isn't a man also having sex? Aren't we talking about a population that is mostly hetero? I think we are. I don't think that there are more gay women than gay men anyways, so I think we can set aside the non-het portions of our society for a second to talk about these het dating complaints. So... OK, a tiny percentage of men is getting most of the easy sex in the sex market? Is that the gripe? So you want more women to be willing to indiscriminately give out easy sex to more guys? Then why do ya'll call us names if we do that? Because you do, and you know it. No...no... OK so what, then, exactly, do men want of women, before you'll quit complaining that everything we do is wrong and unfair?
Make sure we all have perfect good looks, and upon age 18, register to be assigned to a man and kept on lockdown to never look at any other man, to breed his offspring? OK perfect world, you can wish for any possible thing for "all women" to do, is that what it looks like? Every woman is hot, every woman is a perfect wifey, every woman is assigned to a man, every man gets a woman? Let's pretend for a second. You know what that means, though? It means that every man only ever gets one woman to sleep with, forever. Because if women have to be this, then men do too, or the numbers don't work. I'm not even talking about morals or social conditioning or whatever, I'm just putting the MATH out there for you.
For every guy who gets lots of sex, there's at least a woman, if not several, who also sleep around. Every time one of those women has a new partner, another guy is getting laid, too.
I would say that men and women want different things, but we don't, not really. The stereotypes don't fit the reality. Some men want a loving lifelong relationship and a family. A lot of women want that, too! Some men just want to have a good time. Guess what? Lots of women are also in that boat.
But all of this blabbity-blah merits naught because at the end of the day, you can not control other people. There's only one person you have any control over and that is you.
Do bear in mind that all of the stuff I threw out in that long post, a lot of it is kind of BS media messages and "things people believe"-- I am trying to explain to you how women feel and think in response to a lot of men's talk and so on.
The point is that a man has like ten paths or more to become "attractive." He doesn't have to be good looking, he could be talented. OR famous or rich. OR witty. OR charismatic. He could pick anything and become good at it and engineer it into a selling point for himself.
A woman? Be pretty, or else. It's all we get. All men care about.
Ah...but is it, though? No. Not really. A lot of men will SAY this, and the media will SAY this and the commercials for a thousand products will work overtime to convince women of this... But ultimately, it's not the basic truth. Men's ability to feel attraction for women is flexible too, and even if looks are a pretty important factor for most men, what that even MEANS varies all over the map. I know men who won't date a heavy lady, and I know men who only date heavy ladies, just as an example. Some men insist that only young women are objectively attractive, and then there's a thread here that crops up saying that a lot of younger men like older women. People like whatever they like.
But as RbccL just pointed to, how do you figure the numbers work, if "women" in general have it so much easier?
It's easier for women to "get sex?" OK...with whom? If a woman gets that easy sex, isn't a man also having sex? Aren't we talking about a population that is mostly hetero? I think we are. I don't think that there are more gay women than gay men anyways, so I think we can set aside the non-het portions of our society for a second to talk about these het dating complaints. So... OK, a tiny percentage of men is getting most of the easy sex in the sex market? Is that the gripe? So you want more women to be willing to indiscriminately give out easy sex to more guys? Then why do ya'll call us names if we do that? Because you do, and you know it. No...no... OK so what, then, exactly, do men want of women, before you'll quit complaining that everything we do is wrong and unfair?
Make sure we all have perfect good looks, and upon age 18, register to be assigned to a man and kept on lockdown to never look at any other man, to breed his offspring? OK perfect world, you can wish for any possible thing for "all women" to do, is that what it looks like? Every woman is hot, every woman is a perfect wifey, every woman is assigned to a man, every man gets a woman? Let's pretend for a second. You know what that means, though? It means that every man only ever gets one woman to sleep with, forever. Because if women have to be this, then men do too, or the numbers don't work. I'm not even talking about morals or social conditioning or whatever, I'm just putting the MATH out there for you.
For every guy who gets lots of sex, there's at least a woman, if not several, who also sleep around. Every time one of those women has a new partner, another guy is getting laid, too.
I would say that men and women want different things, but we don't, not really. The stereotypes don't fit the reality. Some men want a loving lifelong relationship and a family. A lot of women want that, too! Some men just want to have a good time. Guess what? Lots of women are also in that boat.
But all of this blabbity-blah merits naught because at the end of the day, you can not control other people. There's only one person you have any control over and that is you.
Sporkie, I have a better idea. How about at 25 or 30 (some guys don't mature physically until 30, and grow out of that scrawny, gangly stage, and by then most are also on some kind of career path or at least--steadily employed), the guys get assigned to to a woman, by a committee of women, in response to women who apply for a guy, stating their preferences, with a couple of alternative options. The guys will be thoroughly vetted, checking for criminal background, psychological profile, health, IQ, etc. The bitter guys won't make the cut. They'll be assigned to the shrink brigade: therapy or GYOW.
Do bear in mind that all of the stuff I threw out in that long post, a lot of it is kind of BS media messages and "things people believe"-- I am trying to explain to you how women feel and think in response to a lot of men's talk and so on.
The point is that a man has like ten paths or more to become "attractive." He doesn't have to be good looking, he could be talented. OR famous or rich. OR witty. OR charismatic. He could pick anything and become good at it and engineer it into a selling point for himself.
A woman? Be pretty, or else. It's all we get. All men care about.
Ah...but is it, though? No. Not really. A lot of men will SAY this, and the media will SAY this and the commercials for a thousand products will work overtime to convince women of this... But ultimately, it's not the basic truth. Men's ability to feel attraction for women is flexible too, and even if looks are a pretty important factor for most men, what that even MEANS varies all over the map. I know men who won't date a heavy lady, and I know men who only date heavy ladies, just as an example. Some men insist that only young women are objectively attractive, and then there's a thread here that crops up saying that a lot of younger men like older women. People like whatever they like.
But as RbccL just pointed to, how do you figure the numbers work, if "women" in general have it so much easier?
It's easier for women to "get sex?" OK...with whom? If a woman gets that easy sex, isn't a man also having sex? Aren't we talking about a population that is mostly hetero? I think we are. I don't think that there are more gay women than gay men anyways, so I think we can set aside the non-het portions of our society for a second to talk about these het dating complaints. So... OK, a tiny percentage of men is getting most of the easy sex in the sex market? Is that the gripe? So you want more women to be willing to indiscriminately give out easy sex to more guys? Then why do ya'll call us names if we do that? Because you do, and you know it. No...no... OK so what, then, exactly, do men want of women, before you'll quit complaining that everything we do is wrong and unfair?
Make sure we all have perfect good looks, and upon age 18, register to be assigned to a man and kept on lockdown to never look at any other man, to breed his offspring? OK perfect world, you can wish for any possible thing for "all women" to do, is that what it looks like? Every woman is hot, every woman is a perfect wifey, every woman is assigned to a man, every man gets a woman? Let's pretend for a second. You know what that means, though? It means that every man only ever gets one woman to sleep with, forever. Because if women have to be this, then men do too, or the numbers don't work. I'm not even talking about morals or social conditioning or whatever, I'm just putting the MATH out there for you.
For every guy who gets lots of sex, there's at least a woman, if not several, who also sleep around. Every time one of those women has a new partner, another guy is getting laid, too.
I would say that men and women want different things, but we don't, not really. The stereotypes don't fit the reality. Some men want a loving lifelong relationship and a family. A lot of women want that, too! Some men just want to have a good time. Guess what? Lots of women are also in that boat.
But all of this blabbity-blah merits naught because at the end of the day, you can not control other people. There's only one person you have any control over and that is you.
Fantastic post! With the bold, the easiest part is to be good looking. Those other qualities are hard to develop for many men. For me, its always felt like I had a lack of charisma and that elusive thing was keeping me from meeting women. Looks do NOT compensate for lack of charisma. You need both, in my view. Thats where I've always fallen short. Recently, I've been told by more than one woman that I in fact am charismatic. Maybe all the hard work at developing it is paying off! Money isn't the game changer I thought it was either. I now have money. Makes very little difference except that now I CAN look beyond the U.S. for love, and thats what I'm doing. Will it work? Who knows.
And you're also correct (for me anyway) that the attraction is flexible. I am flexible on looks if I can find a kind, caring, smart, non-jealous woman with similar values. Also, as I get older, getting a lot of sex with random women has lost a ton of appeal. I want to be married. I don't enjoy the single life even if I can sleep with a few different women each year. Its not fulfilling. Thats been my reality post divorce. I would much prefer to have a family, and am aggressively pursuing that dream now, just in a different way than the past, because doing the same thing over and over expecting different results is insanity.
Fantastic post! With the bold, the easiest part is to be good looking. Those other qualities are hard to develop for many men. For me, its always felt like I had a lack of charisma and that elusive thing was keeping me from meeting women. Looks do NOT compensate for lack of charisma. You need both, in my view. Thats where I've always fallen short. Recently, I've been told by more than one woman that I in fact am charismatic. Maybe all the hard work at developing it is paying off! Money isn't the game changer I thought it was either. I now have money. Makes very little difference except that now I CAN look beyond the U.S. for love, and thats what I'm doing. Will it work? Who knows.
And you're also correct (for me anyway) that the attraction is flexible. I am flexible on looks if I can find a kind, caring, smart, non-jealous woman with similar values. Also, as I get older, getting a lot of sex with random women has lost a ton of appeal. I want to be married. I don't enjoy the single life even if I can sleep with a few different women each year. Its not fulfilling. Thats been my reality post divorce. I would much prefer to have a family, and am aggressively pursuing that dream now, just in a different way than the past, because doing the same thing over and over expecting different results is insanity.
Confidence goes a long way to developing charisma, btw. Maybe after all these years, you've found your authentic voice, and are expressing yourself more or better? That's great feedback to get! But now that you've become more attractive to US women, why give up on them? The women where you're planning to search don't care about charisma; any reliable, non-alcoholic, mildly affectionate and stable schlump will do. (Though the obese need not apply.)
Wouldn't you rather have someone who appreciates the new you, and the effort you made to arrive at that?
Fantastic post! With the bold, the easiest part is to be good looking. Those other qualities are hard to develop for many men. For me, its always felt like I had a lack of charisma and that elusive thing was keeping me from meeting women. Looks do NOT compensate for lack of charisma. You need both, in my view. Thats where I've always fallen short. Recently, I've been told by more than one woman that I in fact am charismatic. Maybe all the hard work at developing it is paying off! Money isn't the game changer I thought it was either. I now have money. Makes very little difference except that now I CAN look beyond the U.S. for love, and thats what I'm doing. Will it work? Who knows.
And you're also correct (for me anyway) that the attraction is flexible. I am flexible on looks if I can find a kind, caring, smart, non-jealous woman with similar values. Also, as I get older, getting a lot of sex with random women has lost a ton of appeal. I want to be married. I don't enjoy the single life even if I can sleep with a few different women each year. Its not fulfilling. Thats been my reality post divorce. I would much prefer to have a family, and am aggressively pursuing that dream now, just in a different way than the past, because doing the same thing over and over expecting different results is insanity.
You need both, looks and charisma, to appeal to women?
LOL no. No, you do not.
In fact if you have neither of those, learn to play a guitar. Or juggle. Or fly a plane, or make art, or to write, or...
Case in point... I knew a short little dude, like 5'2" or so, who was mid 30's when I met him, and had spent most of his life homeless, drifting and grifting. He had kids with a woman that he hadn't seen or paid support on in years, he has a big gnarly hairy mole on one ear where you can't help but see it, he's got not just no money but negative money. Severely obsessively addicted to weed. Criminal record! All he had going for him, is that he had pretty eyes and a weird kind of "cute" going on, and a dash of up-front charm (that wore thin fast once you got to know him) but significantly he could play a guitar and sing.
He claims to have had over a hundred female partners, he complains that they always catch feels and want to be serious with him, and I watched how attracted women were to him, and for a very short time felt a little of it myself (as I said, until I got to know him.) But he's got another steady relationship now and a baby, though they have lost their home a few times and had to couch surf together and wander.
If this little bastard has women throwing themselves at him, the ONLY thing he's got is that he has a whole "IDGAF" confidence, the ability to noodle about (he's not even that good) on a guitar, and kind of a cute face, but not remarkable. He looks, at first, on the surface, like a good time. Like a hippie drifter without a care in the world. Sometimes it's nice to think, "how would it feel, to not have a care in the world?"
He's got his own brand, and that is the point I'm trying to make. Whatever it is, he believes in it. And it's been my feeling that's a lot of what causes guys to struggle, is they don't believe in their own brand, they expect to fail, which affects the choices they make and how they come off.
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