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So I (a 35 y/o male) have a cousin, John. He's 54 y/o, has a high paying job, and a very good and nice guy. He's awkward socially to an extent, but he's not a weirdo or a creep. Just a simple man. Anyway, John has a crush on a woman named Angela (42 y/o). What I was told by John and based on my own personal interaction with her, she's tall (about 5'9ish), cute, lean, a nurse, dietician/nurse, sings, ballroom dances, physically active, and outgoing. This woman also does singing performances with another guy who's part of another band.
My cousin, well, lacks much of what I listed (but goes around and watches her perform). He's about an inch or two shorter than her, overweight, not active, and isn't outgoing. So in terms of how much he has in common with this woman: not much. Just they have the same beliefs, spiritually and politically, and both like dancing. Problem is John doesn't do much dancing either.
Now John is hoping beyond his wildest hopes that Angela likes him in secret and hooks up. But she had implied that she is not interested in him a few times. Stranger part is they're still friends. Which is good, I think. However, whenever he's around her face to face, he hardly talks to her. Let alone, when she starts singing at these gigs she and her partner sign up for, he doesn't even try to get up and at least dance with someone or in place. He's basically just there.
What he had told me was Angela maybe communicating with him through the songs she sings, like subliminal messaging. I can assure you I saw none of that. But John believes she is. Wouldn't we, as men, though, love a good looking woman to send us messages like that to us that are obvious, right?
In any case, he has stayed in contact with her, and has known her for well over 2-3 years(?), and has told her that he wanted more than a friendship, and she, again, basically told him 'no'. Only reason Angela keeps him around is because John is harmless. He wouldn't hurt a fly.
Plus I think she knows that he doesn't have a chance with her and he wouldn't do anything drastic that would cause problems. So I think that's another reason she's okay with him. You can tell that John's qualities isn't going to attract her, unless if he reveals how much he's worth (6 figure income and MAYBE millionaire status).
Here's where it get's interesting and how I got lumped into the mix. I'm over 6 feet tall, I'm physically fit, I dance, sing, active, and outgoing, in addition to also working in the health field and sharing the same beliefs. She MIGHT be interested in me. So far, I've only met her 3 times face to face, and I danced with her (once), sang together with her (two songs), and only talked for awhile (both in person and online). I didn't bring any of those on, she did. Whenever she performed, I spent most my time with other people dancing, singing, talking, whatever, and only hung around her when parts of the crowd left before I jumped back in with more people.
After the two times I met her, she even asked my cousin, when I wasn't with him at one of her performances, where I was at. The first time I met her, John asked me to come along and watch her perform and did so a second time. The third time he had taken me to go watch her perform, he was a little hesitant to even ask, but did so anyway. I have a suspicion that Angela interacting with me more and more might have John a little jealous, and that is not my intent nor trying to steal her away from him.
Anyway, the third time came around and met up. This event was for charity and there were 3 groups performing that night (Angela was going second). John and I talked for awhile, until Angela came, then he ended our conversation while I was eating and he talked to her. Meanwhile, I'm seeing these other guys come in and have a thing for this woman. It was as if the simp brigade rolled in, so I didn't talk to Angela much. I did what I normally did at things like this and interacted with other people, having fun with the crowd and the other musicians there. I did the same thing with Angela and her partner while getting pictures in with the people attending.
All the while John was in the back with the simp brigade doing NOTHING. I got him to come up, after trying a couple of times, and tried to have fun with him, but he wouldn't do anything. At that point, I knew there was something up, and I began to wonder if he was mad at me. I got Angela to laugh a couple of times while she was on stage and wasn't singing, shooting messages of song requests. Some of it was stuff she wouldn't typically sing, but it was part of the joke. And at the end of the night, the only serious thing I talked to her about was an event I was going that I had never been to before and she did. John witnessed all of this.
At the end of the night, we all left about the same time, but what I noticed was I didn't see John leave. He didn't even say goodbye or anything, and I wanted to. Over the past several months, we did other things together and now have a good bond. A few days later, I texted him. I mentioned in case if he and Angela don't pan out that there was another woman I met earlier, the night I texted him, and was very nice. Someone that would probably be interested in him. He didn't want to hear it, and insisted that he wanted to be with Angela.
Where I stand now, I will not go after Angela out of respect for John, so long as he's infatuated with her. I don't even know if for some reason he no longer has interest that I will go after this woman. John and I formed a good friendship with each other, and I don't want to wreck it over a woman. However, the way that Angela has interacted with me has shown that she would prefer a guy that doesn't act old and not a stick in the mud. Admittedly, she has been nice to me and I could consider her as a possibility. We do share quite a bit in common, so by those standards, I don't think there's anything wrong there. And we had fun together the 3 times we met face to face.
But I don't want to choose her while sacrificing my friendship with John because his time with me has helped him get out of his shell more as we continue to bond. Every time I suggested what he should do, he doesn't do it. Only thing I haven't told him to do is basically flash his wallet and show off how much he has in the bank because I would hate for him to do that and then if they did hook up, it would ONLY be about money. I want him to remain the good person that he is.
I feel like I'm in a bit of a bind here, and I'm sure John may ask me again to go with him to Angela's next performance. It's just every time I had played the part of wingman, the pilot misses his mark, even when having him aligned, and instead the stewardess has more confidence in the wingman. Am I making the right call in not pursuing Angela, at the moment, because John is interested in her? If Angela does have interest in me and she basically makes it known to John that she wants to start something with me, should I give it time? I'm sorry this was a long story, but I feel as if that I'm the middle-man here and I'm trying to find the best solution. Anything will help. Thanks!
So you're playing wingman for a guy with an unhealthy crush/obsession on a woman? All the while knowing she has rejected him, told him no, and he stands no chance with her??
What's your goal here? To see him get crushed by her?
Then when he's ruined by it, you can ease on into her limelight?
Let's be clear here. You did this. You're the one who put yourself in that "bind".
I don't become interested in my friends' girlfriends or the women they're desperately after because I don't try and test the waters with them anyway. That's a step I don't even take. As do most people.
You're not "in a bind". You're going after the woman your friend has been talking to you about for years, and pretending like all of that just befell you. Flirting isn't a one way thing. If she's been flirting with you for 3 occasions now, pretty sure you've been flirting back.
Now quite obviously if you go any further with her this will make John mad at you so huh... Yeah the choice is just whether you want to prioritize your friend or that woman, despite saying you don't want to ruin that friendship over a woman.
Obsession is never "harmless." He is fantasizing about a relationship that isn't there, and yes, that is creepy.
I think you should stop encouraging John to go see this woman sing, and you should back out yourself. Wash your hands of the whole business. It doesn't seem like there is much positive about your friendship with him or her. It seems very dark.
You either consider Angela off limits under any circumstances or you don't. There is no way to sugar coat it and make it seem OK to pursue someone you know your friend and cousin is crazy about. That's it.
Let's be clear here. You did this. You're the one who put yourself in that "bind".
I don't become interested in my friends' girlfriends or the women they're desperately after because I don't try and test the waters with them anyway. That's a step I don't even take. As do most people.
You're not "in a bind". You're going after the woman your friend has been talking to you about for years, and pretending like all of that just befell you. Flirting isn't a one way thing. If she's been flirting with you for 3 occasions now, pretty sure you've been flirting back.
Now quite obviously if you go any further with her this will make John mad at you so huh... Yeah the choice is just whether you want to prioritize your friend or that woman, despite saying you don't want to ruin that friendship over a woman.
Exactly.
The OP is not in any 'bind,' he put himself in that situation.
If the OP was genuine and sincere about not wanting to ruin the 'friendship' and bond he has with his cousin, he would never have even thought of pursuing her in the first place. It seems like he's trying to have it both ways, making it seem like he's concerned about his friendship while still pursuing this woman on the sly.
He alludes to only pursuing her openly if he knows for sure his friend is no longer interested. But we all know that in real life, these quite and shy guys who become obsessed with the object of their affections never lose interest.
We may sound harsh, but we are being brutally honest. I get that perhaps the OP was only looking for moral support in pursuing this woman to assuage a guilty conscience. But it is what it is.
Let me clarify some things here: I don't really know this woman all that well, and no, I have no intention on pursuing her, at this point, if ever. All I'm saying is, based on my interaction with her, as a single man, the idea of this woman is tempting because we do share a lot in common. Any single guy would think the same thing with a woman who they share commonality with, so don't lie about that. The reason I'm not pursuing is because of John. And my friendship with John is strong. I've invited to things that have nothing to do with the woman. Right now, there's another woman, more than the other ones, that I can tell is interested in me, and I'm considering taking her out well before Angela. So to say I'm being inconsiderate towards my cousin and only using him to get close to Angela is ridiculous. That's not what this is at all.
Now, fair play to those that mentioned this, I DID get myself into this bind. Heaven forbid I try to be a good cousin and help a family member in need. However, I'm not encouraging him to go pursue this woman. As a matter of fact, I was trying to pull him away and we go find other people that are more compatible with us because we're both single. I've pointed out other women to him. Not long ago, I told John about a woman that he would really like. As a matter of fact, there were two women, both good looking, active, a lot of fun, and very nice. Closer to his age, too. I've even tried, in Summer, to get him to talk to this one woman who's interested in me because, at the time, I wasn't looking for a relationship with anyone
John turned them both the other women closer to him down, as well as the one that's interested in (who's the same age as Angela). I was disappointed because I liked both of the older women and the younger woman because they would have treated him right. One of the older ladies was liked him A LOT, but he turned her down hard. He's fixated on this one, and I'm worried that one day she may say she has had enough and cut him off completely. John would be devastated. I'd go down with the boat too, but it wouldn't be a big loss to me because we don't hang out and there's the other women that have expressed interest.
He had told me before that if I liked Angela, I could chase her. That's a trap, and I'm not doing it. I don't I think ever will, at least at this point. However, if he had found a woman that's more interesting and is willing to give him a relationship with her, breaking him of this trance, then it would be a maybe on my end with this Angela. Even then, I wouldn't play the chase game. In any case, my hope is John will find someone for him. Quite honestly, I'm hoping to find someone for me. Who that might be? I don't know. Whoever not only finds me interesting, but also I'm interested in her (and there's a story with one woman that happened a over month ago I can think of, but that's for another time).
Anyway, I hope this clears up things better because it's hard having to explain everything on the internet and it's easy to judge and condemn when there are no faces to confront the accusers. I do know this about them, they've been through this before. Just from their choice of words and acting as if they're holier and more knowledgeable than thou. Some I wouldn't be surprised if they were men that are currently obsessed over certain in their lives, and they're not in relationships with those women. Be careful with what you say next time.
John will probably never let go his crush on Angela, at this point it's more than likely an enjoyable fantasy on his part and he wouldn't really know what to do if she did decide to give him a chance.
It's doubtful John will consent to give up going to her performances. Why should he? He enjoys them. So I wouldn't go there. He's a grown man, he can decide these life choices for himself.
As far as your interest in Angela, give it a rest out of respect for John's feelings. It might be worth thinking about to befriend her though bringing John into the circle. You'd have to be on your best though, not disguising romance as friendship.
Any big pronouncements about quitting your regular outings with John are probably to be avoided. It would look too weird. What would be the reason? Or the point. John will either move on from Angela or not, as he decides.
As you're already doing, look elsewhere for love.
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