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Old 12-25-2017, 05:49 PM
 
64,120 posts, read 40,439,537 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant View Post
I'm not sure what this comment even means.

In therapy, in theory, self-knowledge is at least somewhat objectively factual, at least according to the particular system of psychology used (Freudian, Jungian, CBT, and so forth).

In religion, there is just unsubstantiated (and, generally, unsubstantiatABLE) truth assertions, using the failed epistemology of religious faith and random dogma. It is entirely subjective and at best tangentially tethered to reality. For example, if you're an authoritarian/literalist / inerrantist / fundamentalist, you might say that correct self-knowledge is that you are a vile sinner, hell-bound for eternity unless you repent. If you are a liberal Christian you might say either that god is too god to condemn you, or that man is too good for god to condemn.

Even within just those two groups of theists, how you regard yourself once you've signed onto the belief-system varies tremendously. For example, within fundamentalism, you're going to think very different things about yourself if you're part of the holiness tradition vs not (for example, whether you can lose your "salvation"), whether or not you're a dominionist/ triumphalist/prosperity gospel type or not (whether god is just bursting at the seams to make you healthy, wealthy and wise or just waiting for you to screw up so that he can smite you). And so on.

In my personal experience in fundamentalism for what it's worth, I had basically zero accurate self-knowledge and self-awareness that came from my religious beliefs. From what I can see, liberal Christianity just puts a patina of "theology" over the top of an amalgam of pop psychology and actual psychology. So I think any thoughtful, intelligent person can probably accomplish more by reflecting on their own experiences and emotions, illuminated by some basic knowledge of psychology, and get far more self-awareness and better adjusted than by over-committing to any system of either therapy OR religious instruction. I see actual therapy and psychological medication as for people who are persistently "stuck" with their issues or who have debilitating psychological symptoms. Or for people who lack the discipline to work things out without some guidance and mentoring.
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Old 12-25-2017, 06:11 PM
Status: "BAGA - Be a Great American: Expose far-right lies daily" (set 15 hours ago)
 
Location: Middle America
11,280 posts, read 7,322,738 times
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What about Christians - and people of other faiths - who do not attend church, or other organized places? What about those who belief what they believe for the intrinsic value to them (intellectually), free of emotions and emotional drama. There's no therapy going on there with them.

The thread subject might apply to some, but it doesn't apply to all religions and belief systems.

On the other hand, maybe other areas of life are much more significant as therapy, that people aren't even thinking of. Going to Starbucks, watching their favorite show on TV, engorging themself with food, etc.
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Old 12-25-2017, 06:39 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
20,278 posts, read 13,671,748 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thoreau424 View Post
What about Christians - and people of other faiths - who do not attend church, or other organized places? What about those who belief what they believe for the intrinsic value to them (intellectually), free of emotions and emotional drama. There's no therapy going on there with them.

The thread subject might apply to some, but it doesn't apply to all religions and belief systems.

On the other hand, maybe other areas of life are much more significant as therapy, that people aren't even thinking of. Going to Starbucks, watching their favorite show on TV, engorging themself with food, etc.
Lol. Yeah, food, used to be my last reliable source of instant gratification until diabetes took that away too.

I agree that so many things can be therapeutic and connection to religion or other woo is not mandatory. I personally find my daily walk to be quite centering. I occasionally get out of the office and work at a local coffee emporium, just for the change of scenery. My first morning coffee is a strict ritual to gentle that transition from sleep to waking. In all honesty, these kinds of experience are as good as any I ever got from religious ritual. Best of all, is the rush of being "in the zone" writing code. Now THAT, for someone like me, is a religious experience.
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Old 12-30-2017, 06:45 PM
 
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It can be, but even prayer as well as bible study can be seen as therapy. Even Non Christian religions are like therapy as well.
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