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As this forum is so American centered and focused, real happenings anywhere else are rarely on anyone's radar screen, and probably get a "meh" from most on here.
The Orthodox Church Moscow rages as an independent Ukrainian church becomes more likely
Decisions taken in Istanbul could have serious ramifications for religious and geopolitical relations in eastern Europe
Essentially, the Orthodox bishops in Istanbul advised the group in Moscow that Ukraine is not their domain, and Ukraine is free to form their own semi-Patriarchate.
In another challenge to Moscow, the Istanbul-based Patriarchate of Constantinople formally withdrew the 1686 decision which gave Moscow some authority over the metropolitan see of Kiev.
This could have far reaching real consequences, but then, it is "over there", so who cares, right?
As this forum is so American centered and focused, real happenings anywhere else are rarely on anyone's radar screen, and probably get a "meh" from most on here.
The Orthodox Church Moscow rages as an independent Ukrainian church becomes more likely
Decisions taken in Istanbul could have serious ramifications for religious and geopolitical relations in eastern Europe
Essentially, the Orthodox bishops in Istanbul advised the group in Moscow that Ukraine is not their domain, and Ukraine is free to form their own semi-Patriarchate.
In another challenge to Moscow, the Istanbul-based Patriarchate of Constantinople formally withdrew the 1686 decision which gave Moscow some authority over the metropolitan see of Kiev.
This could have far reaching real consequences, but then, it is "over there", so who cares, right?
I rather care about events in the Ukraine - and Russia. It must suit the Ukranians to get a handle on their Church so Russia loses yet another weapon to impose it's will on the Ukraine (sorry, It's a Habit like calling Handel's "Messiah" THE Messiah), and don't think I dislike Russia. I just wish it's potential for democracy is vanishing.
Not surprising, that the USA-centric crowd has nothing to say about one of the largest religious stories out there.
To be fair, the vast majority of American Christians are Roman Catholic, evangelical Protestant, or mainline Protestant so this will have little direct impact on them, but from a world religions standpoint, this is history in the making.
I actually find this fascinating and potentially one of the most impactful moments in modern Christian history, but there needs to be more developments before any commentary can be made.
Let 'em schism all they want. Set up a slip-and-slide and throw in some adult beverages. Orthodox anything is already going to far. It's all man's stuff; buildings, rules, membership lists, etc. No one will find God in that mess.
Let 'em schism all they want. Set up a slip-and-slide and throw in some adult beverages. Orthodox anything is already going to far. It's all man's stuff; buildings, rules, membership lists, etc. No one will find God in that mess.
Yes, indeed. Not sure why there would be violence. Let the Patriach fume.
Not surprising, that the USA-centric crowd has nothing to say about one of the largest religious stories out there.
Well, for one, it strikes me as two different factions of leprechauns arguing over who is greenest. I'm hard-pressed to care.
Two, I doubt Russians would much care about, say, some controversy embroiling American Baptists.
Third, the schism - if it even happens - won't be the cause of anything significant in a geopolitical sense. It might provide a Russian excuse for something, but the last five years have shown that Russia needs no excuses to advance Putin's domestic standing by picking feeble fights with weak neighbors that offend Russia by no longer being dominated by them.
The Ukraine is divided between people who want an independent Ukraine and those who are pro Russian. This is possibly petrol on a smouldering fire.
While she is Polish, a friend of mine has Ukrainian relatives. And this just adds to the growing potential for trouble with Russia.
I would not be so dismissive if I was wearing your shoes.
Absolutely. In my area, we have a significant population that has relatives in the Ukraine, or are a recent expatriate, and am aware of how this is a huge geo-political issue, wrapped once again in a religious manner.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hulsker 1856
Well, for one, it strikes me as two different factions of leprechauns arguing over who is greenest. I'm hard-pressed to care.
Two, I doubt Russians would much care about, say, some controversy embroiling American Baptists.
Third, the schism - if it even happens - won't be the cause of anything significant in a geopolitical sense. It might provide a Russian excuse for something, but the last five years have shown that Russia needs no excuses to advance Putin's domestic standing by picking feeble fights with weak neighbors that offend Russia by no longer being dominated by them.
Oh trust me, the Russians care. Putin has made it a priority to make the Orthodox Church in Russia an ally and a promulgator of his legitimacy. Trump is attempting to do the same with his co-opting of the religious right, except the religious right in the USA is declining in impact, where as in Russia you need to remember that even Stalin needed the churches acquiescence. He revived the Russian Orthodox Church to intensify patriotic support for the war effort and presented Russia as a defender of Christian civilization, because he saw the church had an ability to arouse the people in a way that the party could not and because he wanted western help.
So, this split is of immense significance, and to dismiss it as a nothing burger is a mistake by western observers. You can bet your bottom dollar that the Russian Patriarchy will be stirring Putin up about the move, and once again, Ukraine will be unstabilized.
It disgusts me how much impact religion has on the lives of people, and that so many people bow to it. But then that is why I am first of all a humanist, and secondly, a loud and proud atheist.
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Yes, indeed. Not sure why there would be violence. Let the Patriach fume.
