the most objective and skeptical professionals, physicians and scientist, believe in a creator. how? (churches, Islam)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
it is generally assumed that the less educated tend to be more conducive to beliefs of god or a creator
but contrary to popular belief, the most objective professionals, scientist and doctors, also believe in a god, creator or an afterlife.
given the objectivity of their professions, i wonder how such skeptics can make time to subjectively believe in a god or creator.
a uchicago study found that 76% of physicians believe in god,
another study found that two thirds of the worlds scientist believe in god or a creator.
another study found that more scientist believed in a god or creator than what was originally assumed. the study also found that the scientific community saw no real conflict between science and belief
It's noticeable that you have to go shopping for evidence of belief. So near 80% of doctors believe in a god. In the US, that is, where they are spoonfed religion and are not taught science, just how to heal people.
Science? The chicago tribune says this - "These results were not anticipated. Religious belief tends to decrease as education and income levels increase, yet doctors are highly educated and, on average, well compensated. The finding also differs radically from 90 years of studies showing that only a minority of scientists (excluding physicians) believes in God or an afterlife."
It is surprising that doctors seem to follow popular trends of belief in the US rather than belief -trends in science. There's a bit of rummaging around the world, and I'm rather persuaded that religion or just theism is based on culture rather than individual study.
As I said before, irreligion knows that it has a job of work to do, and especially in the US where the link between religious Faith and patriotism, is particularly strong. Indeed, I'm convinced that religious belief is an instinct evolved to underpin tribal cohesion.
However, as in the rather interesting talk ("Stanley") I was reference here, the rise of the "Nones" isn't because people are attracted by atheism, but because they are put off by organised religion.
That's fine; we'll take that. Hopefully we would then have at least a dialogue and people listening to the arguments, instead of shutting us out as religion tends to do.
We do become aware, however of irreligious Theists (those who believe in a god but do not do religion) can argue just as fiercely for this sorta-god and are just as hostile to atheists as they were when they attended church.
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 10-20-2018 at 08:25 AM..
it is generally assumed that the less educated tend to be more conducive to beliefs of god or a creator
but contrary to popular belief, the most objective professionals, scientist and doctors, also believe in a god, creator or an afterlife.
given the objectivity of their professions, i wonder how such skeptics can make time to subjectively believe in a god or creator.
a uchicago study found that 76% of physicians believe in god,
another study found that two thirds of the worlds scientist believe in god or a creator.
another study found that more scientist believed in a god or creator than what was originally assumed. the study also found that the scientific community saw no real conflict between science and belief
How does believing in a creator correspond to believing that a corpse came back to life and flew away? Or that hordes of dead people came up out of their graves and wandered the streets of Jerusalem? Or that Joshua stopped the Earth's rotation to allow his men to finish slaughtering his enemies, right down to the last babe in arms?
Joshua 10:
[12] Then spake Joshua to the LORD in the day when the LORD delivered up the Amorites before the children of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel, Sun, stand thou still upon Gibeon; and thou, Moon, in the valley of Ajalon.
[13] And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.
Numbers 31
[15] And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive?
[16] Behold, these caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to commit trespass against the LORD in the matter of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the LORD.
[17] Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.
[18] But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
Joshua 6
[20] So the people shouted when the priests blew with the trumpets: and it came to pass, when the people heard the sound of the trumpet, and the people shouted with a great shout, that the wall fell down flat, so that the people went up into the city, every man straight before him, and they took the city.
[21] And they utterly destroyed all that was in the city, both man and woman, young and old, and ox, and sheep, and ass, with the edge of the sword.
Joshua 11:
19 Except for the Hivites living in Gibeon, not one city made a treaty of peace with the Israelites, who took them all in battle. 20 For it was the Lord himself who hardened their hearts to wage war against Israel, so that he might destroy them totally, exterminating them without mercy, as the Lord had commanded Moses.
Ezekiel 9
[4] And the LORD said unto him, Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and set a mark upon the foreheads of the men that sigh and that cry for all the abominations that be done in the midst thereof.
[5] And to the others he said in mine hearing, Go ye after him through the city, and smite: let not your eye spare, neither have ye pity:
[6] Slay utterly old and young, both maids, and little children, and women: but come not near any man upon whom is the mark; and begin at my sanctuary. Then they began at the ancient men which were before the house.
[7] And he said unto them, Defile the house, and fill the courts with the slain: go ye forth. And they went forth, and slew in the city.
Samuel 1 15:
[2] Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.
[3] Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
What sort of a creator do you believe in? And WHY!
Last edited by Tired of the Nonsense; 10-20-2018 at 09:09 AM..
It's noticeable that you have to go shopping for evidence of belief. So near 80% of doctors believe in a god. In the US, that is, where they are spoonfed religion and are not taught science, just how to heal people.
Science? The chicago tribune says this - "These results were not anticipated. Religious belief tends to decrease as education and income levels increase, yet doctors are highly educated and, on average, well compensated. The finding also differs radically from 90 years of studies showing that only a minority of scientists (excluding physicians) believes in God or an afterlife."
It is surprising that doctors seem to follow popular trends of belief in the US rather than belief -trends in science. There's a bit of rummaging around the world, and I'm rather persuaded that religion or just theism is based on culture rather than individual study.
As I said before, irreligion knows that it has a job of work to do, and especially in the US where the link between religious Faith and patriotism, is particularly strong. Indeed, I'm convinced that religious belief is an instinct evolved to underpin tribal cohesion.
However, as in the rather interesting talk ("Stanley") I was reference here, the rise of the "Nones" isn't because people are attracted by atheism, but because they are put off by organised religion.
That's fine; we'll take that. Hopefully we would then have at least a dialogue and people listening to the arguments, instead of shutting us out as religion tends to do.
We do become aware, however of irreligious Theists (those who believe in a god but do not do religion) can argue just as fiercely for this sorta-god and are just as hostile to atheists as they were when they attended church.
so you are aguing that religion is the sole reason for division--not politics or ignorant secular ideology.
one of the most cruelest secularist, hitler, would agree with your above assertion. now, i dont agree with cruel dictators like hitler or stalin. i dont agree with hitler so i dont agree with your assertion.
tribal cohesion can be undermined by factors othen than religion. religion is very broad. also, religion can create commonality and cohesion of different cultures and socioeconomic classes, not that i am apologist for organizef religion or a theocracy. i dont agree with your generalization of religion that solely pinns it as the force of oppression and division. it is simply not true that religion is a bad force that oppresses and divides.
note: many charities provide food and assistance to many people regardless of their culture and belief
it is generally assumed that the less educated tend to be more conducive to beliefs of god or a creator
but contrary to popular belief, the most objective professionals, scientist and doctors, also believe in a god, creator or an afterlife.
given the objectivity of their professions, i wonder how such skeptics can make time to subjectively believe in a god or creator.
a uchicago study found that 76% of physicians believe in god,
another study found that two thirds of the worlds scientist believe in god or a creator.
another study found that more scientist believed in a god or creator than what was originally assumed. the study also found that the scientific community saw no real conflict between science and belief
Survey on physicians’ religious beliefs shows majority faithful
By John Easton
Medical Center Public Affairs
July 14, 2005
Inquiries into the religious beliefs, or the lack of them, among U.S. scientists date back to a landmark 1916 survey by psychologist James Leuba that documented widespread disbelief. Leuba found that only 40 percent of scientists believed in a personal God, 15 percent were uncertain and 45 percent disbelieved.
Surveys published in Nature in 1997 and 1998 showed little change since 1916, with only 39 percent of all scientists declaring a personal belief in God. Belief among “leading” scientists, however—defined in this case as members of the National Academy of Sciences—was far lower: only 7 percent in 1998. Curiously, among scientists, mathematicians were the most likely to believe in God and biologists the least likely. Survey on physicians’ religious beliefs shows majority faithful
"The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this. These subtilised interpretations are highly manifold according to their nature and have almost nothing to do with the original text. For me the Jewish religion like all other religions is an incarnation of the most childish superstitions." -- Albert Einstein, written in 1954 to Jewish philosopher Erik Gutkind. Think Einstein believed in God? You probably haven’t read this letter he wrote in 1954 – DeadState
"I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it." (Albert Einstein, 1954) https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/967...you-read-about
so you are aguing that religion is the sole reason for division--not politics or ignorant secular ideology.
one of the most cruelest secularist, hitler, would agree with your above assertion. now, i dont agree with cruel dictators like hitler or stalin. i dont agree with hitler so i dont agree with your assertion.
tribal cohesion can be undermined by factors othen than religion. religion is very broad. also, religion can create commonality and cohesion of different cultures and socioeconomic classes, not that i am apologist for organizef religion or a theocracy. i dont agree with your generalization of religion that solely pinns it as the force of oppression and division. it is simply not true that religion is a bad force that oppresses and divides.
note: many charities provide food and assistance to many people regardless of their culture and belief
excuse unedited cell grammar
I'm not arguing that at all. Politics and patriotism, (and I am seeing that as a development of tribal cohesion-instinct) is the basis. I just see the evolutionary purpose of religion as underpinning it.
And you are playing the Hitler -card. Very well, Hitler and indeed Stalin and a number of similar tough leaders saw the value of, in the absence of using religion, replacing religion with an ideology of their own, and making themselves the object of reverence rather than a god. I doubt that either of us are very enthusiastic about that idea. So you attempt to smear me with an accusation approval of Dictators is likely to discredit your case rather than mine.
I'm not so much generalising about religion or patriotism, but seeing the basics of it (it's a hypothesis) and detecting the way that one can support the other. It's also true that religion can cause division. Wehave seen this in a number of civil wars about religion as well as between different nations.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
it is a horrifying fact that about HALF the population are less than the average in income, education and intelligence. 
Very well, Hitler and indeed Stalin and a number of similar tough leaders saw the value of, in the absence of using religion, replacing religion with an ideology of their own, and making themselves the object of reverence rather than a god. I doubt that either of us are very enthusiastic about that idea. So you attempt to smear me with an accusation approval of Dictators is likely to discredit your case rather than mine. 
