Saddleback, a church or a business empire? (churches, gospel, bible)
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I live a few miles from one of the largest independent "mega churches" in the USA called Saddleback Church. This church (and our city) got worldwide attention over the weekend as Rick Warren, the pastor of this church, hosted a political forum to interview Barak Obama and John McCain and this 2 hour program was broadcast live on CNN plus re-broadcast several times more later.
Rick Warren is famous for several best selling books, and I am sure he deserves the success and fortune his books have brought him. I have attended a couple of sermons at his church simply out of curiosity and proximity to where I live. I was not particularly taken with the whole grandiose style and "super sized" atmosphere of the place, and the super sized pastor wearing the baggy Hawaiian shirt hanging outside his pants. It seemed stale (even for Orange County), a kind of "McChurch Lite".
I find Rick Warren to be a curious sort of guy. He certainly likes the media attention, he seems to crave such attention on himself. He seems more interested in the business and media aspects of Saddleback Church than the original "purpose" of the church, which should be to spread the gospel, correct? He has turned his church into a multi million $$ business empire. I know they need money to run a church, but there is a lot more going on there than bible studies and sunday sermons. Has the "purpose" of Saddleback become more of a "business" than a "church"? Point of reference, a big sign outside the mega auditorium where church services are held says "worship center", just down the walkway from the "learning center" and the "business office".
I live a few miles from one of the largest independent "mega churches" in the USA called Saddleback Church. This church (and our city) got worldwide attention over the weekend as Rick Warren, the pastor of this church, hosted a political forum to interview Barak Obama and John McCain and this 2 hour program was broadcast live on CNN plus re-broadcast several times more later.
Rick Warren is famous for several best selling books, and I am sure he deserves the success and fortune his books have brought him. I have attended a couple of sermons at his church simply out of curiosity and proximity to where I live. I was not particularly taken with the whole grandiose style and "super sized" atmosphere of the place, and the super sized pastor wearing the baggy Hawaiian shirt hanging outside his pants. It seemed stale (even for Orange County), a kind of "McChurch Lite".
I find Rick Warren to be a curious sort of guy. He certainly likes the media attention, he seems to crave such attention on himself. He seems more interested in the business and media aspects of Saddleback Church than the original "purpose" of the church, which should be to spread the gospel, correct? He has turned his church into a multi million $$ business empire. I know they need money to run a church, but there is a lot more going on there than bible studies and sunday sermons. Has the "purpose" of Saddleback become more of a "business" than a "church"? Point of reference, a big sign outside the mega auditorium where church services are held says "worship center", just down the walkway from the "learning center" and the "business office".
Most of the Right Wing Socialist Churches do reside behind the "Orange Curtain" in Southern California. They use to have more power and influence than they do now. Some of that same mindset slips over down to San Diego county as well. I just read about his interview with Obama & McCain. The one thing that should be noted is the way these Most Right Reverends hobb knobb with politicians of all sorts, Jesus never did these things for political social standing or pursuit of obscene wealth. Things are far removed from what Jesus originally taught.
I am a little confused. Rick Warren has a Mega Church and you recycled say he should spread the gospel? Are you missing the forest for the trees? Rick Warren IS spreading the gospel! The problem I think is that he is successful and people seem to have a problem with anyone being successful. We'd rather terr a person down than for them to be promoted. Isn't that what Jesus was talking about when he said that John came neither eating or drinking and they said he had a devil, and Jesus came eating and drinking and they called him a drunk and friend of sinners? Should we not rather rejoice for our fellow christian we is successful in the ministry that God has given him. We should rejoice because God has blessed him and God who does not respect persons can bless us the same.
Rick Warren is a good man and we should pray for him that God will keep him faithful and not get sidetracked with the fame and money like so many of the good ministers who have come before yet have fallen into temptation.
I think the recent Saddleback forum was excellent. I think it exposed the candidates beliefs wide open. I think that the lines are clearer for Evengelical Christians to vote now that we know what the candidates believe. As Christians we want to see protection for the unborn child and prevention in our states from gay marriage becoming legalized. McCain who I thought was week has taken a stance on these issues. He is also sounding presidential, where Obama is not and is now the week one in my mind.
I used to go to "Harvest Christian Felowship".......the Riverside County 'McChurch'.....
mega church is not for me....too many 'lights camera....'
I understand the church to be evangelical.....they just had the 'Harvest Crusades'......
in OC....
I live a few miles from one of the largest independent "mega churches" in the USA called Saddleback Church. This church (and our city) got worldwide attention over the weekend as Rick Warren, the pastor of this church, hosted a political forum to interview Barak Obama and John McCain and this 2 hour program was broadcast live on CNN plus re-broadcast several times more later.
Rick Warren is famous for several best selling books, and I am sure he deserves the success and fortune his books have brought him. I have attended a couple of sermons at his church simply out of curiosity and proximity to where I live. I was not particularly taken with the whole grandiose style and "super sized" atmosphere of the place, and the super sized pastor wearing the baggy Hawaiian shirt hanging outside his pants. It seemed stale (even for Orange County), a kind of "McChurch Lite".
I find Rick Warren to be a curious sort of guy. He certainly likes the media attention, he seems to crave such attention on himself. He seems more interested in the business and media aspects of Saddleback Church than the original "purpose" of the church, which should be to spread the gospel, correct? He has turned his church into a multi million $$ business empire. I know they need money to run a church, but there is a lot more going on there than bible studies and sunday sermons. Has the "purpose" of Saddleback become more of a "business" than a "church"? Point of reference, a big sign outside the mega auditorium where church services are held says "worship center", just down the walkway from the "learning center" and the "business office".
do you think it 'business' cuz of the $$$ flow and size (multiple service times in am and such)??
do you think it 'business' cuz of the $$$ flow and size (multiple service times in am and such)??
or
cuz they became political????
curious.........
Maybe it would be more appropriate to take this discussion to the scriptures and see what and how Jesus Christ and the Apostles ran the early Christian ministry. How did they support themselves financially and how does that compare with the way ministries are run today ???
I believe that might have been the point of the original poster
Maybe it would be more appropriate to take this discussion to the scriptures and see what and how Jesus Christ and the Apostles ran the early Christian ministry. How did they support themselves financially and how does that compare with the way ministries are run today ???
I believe that might have been the point of the original poster
(there are alot of things I miss.....and I dont do politics...)
is the OP about church and politics??? getting $$$ from politics??? or giving $$$ to politics???
( be patient with me....I truely am s genious in my own right...just no tin math or polisci....)
(there are alot of things I miss.....and I dont do politics...)
is the OP about church and politics??? getting $$$ from politics??? or giving $$$ to politics???
( be patient with me....I truely am s genious in my own right...just no tin math or polisci....)
thanx
Actually I think you could answer YES YES YES to all three questions. Again the best comparison would be to answer from the bible. How was the early Christian ministry structured and how does it compare today.
It would have to be noted that Jesus Christ was a carpenter and the other Apostles had various other secular jobs to support themselves. Their purpose was never to put an expensive burden on the people. First and foremost was their ministry and then they did odd jobs to support their needs. As an example I believe Paul helped mend fishing nets to provide an extra income for his necessary expenses. But absolutely none of them are found to be living a life of obscene luxury as the sad examples we have today.
Also I have never found where they meddled in Politiking to over throw governments they did'nt agree with or influence any one particular governments laws for their own personal belief. First and foremost they considered themselves to be separated from the world in this respect. After the death of the Apostles the Great Apostasy was foretold to come in and change religion and that is where we are today.
Read the book of Jude
2 Peter 2:1,3
1 John 2:18,19
2 Thessalonians 2:1-3
Matthew 13:24-30
Acts 20:29,30
Last edited by bluepacific; 08-19-2008 at 09:42 AM..
Reason: spelling
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