Bexar County Appraisals for 2008 Are Out (San Antonio, Anton: gated, property tax rates, exemptions)

[tekka-maki]

Originally Posted by winst0n

what about if you are a couple? how much state income tax if you combine both? for sure you still pay the same property tax...

the one thing that i can think of is, even if i have a huge income, i can choose not to purchase an expensive house, which means less property tax. but for a huge income that has a state income tax, there is no escape...

Using 3% flat, it would be 3% regardless so just do the math. I don't know what you mean when you say 'same property tax', as this thread is every indication that property tax is never the same.

I never stated there weren't exceptions to the rule (e.g. a handful of fat cats who live in 50k condos). But I would surmise that the majority of homeowners would save, simply based on San Antonio's median family income.

On another note, 300k isn't even a really expensive house in this day and age. But rest assured, you'd be paying a really expensive property tax for that home, to the tune of 8k a year! That's a pretty heft bill, particularly if you're retired.

Maybe if Bexar County lowered the assessed value to a lower value it would not be so bad.

Single family residences are assessed at16% in IL as one example.

[winst0n]

Originally Posted by tekka-maki

Using 3% flat, it would be 3% regardless so just do the math. I don't know what you mean when you say 'same property tax', as this thread is every indication that property tax is never the same.

well what i was trying to say was, in your example, that if a person's gross is 52K, the state income tax is 1560 at 3%. But if he/she is married and say having the same gross income, so that's another 1560 for a total of 3120 for state income tax, plus the property tax of 1500, for a grand total of 4620.
As compared to an almost 4K of property tax for a 150K home in SA.

Also, for SA standards, a 300K house is considered expensive as it is way beyond the median price in SA which is 150.

[tekka-maki]

Originally Posted by winst0n

well what i was trying to say was, in your example, that if a person's gross is 52K, the state income tax is 1560 at 3%. But if he/she is married and say having the same gross income, so that's another 1560 for a total of 3120 for state income tax, plus the property tax of 1500, for a grand total of 4620.
As compared to an almost 4K of property tax for a 150K home in SA.

Yes, I suppose you'd lose a little in that case. Also I kept saying net, when I meant gross. I don't know why I always do that; doh!

I s'pose it just seems more rational than not to me that most (not all) homeowner couples making far more than than the median family income (i.e. 104k) in San Anton are living in homes that exceed 150k in appraised value. Heck knows there are at least a few in this forum (if not many more).

Originally Posted by winst0n

Also, for SA standards, a 300K house is considered expensive as it is way beyond the median price in SA which is 150.

Do you have a cite for the median home price. I'm inclined to believe it's higher (i.e. around 180k) but you may certainly be right. It's just that my wife and I had a difficult time finding the 'right home' in that price range. But then, then, inside the inner loop, e. side and s. side is chock full of sub 100k homes so that may bring the median down...

Despite this, home values will continue to go up; there are a great many homes in S.A. that cost more than 150k (practically in subdiv in N or NW) and most of the new home stock will cost at least as much. For that reason alone, I think it's in the best interest of the majority to consider either a revamping of the prop tax code or a supplement tax to bring it down, because at the end of the day, no income tax but a high prop. tax (or vice versa) is just smoke and mirrors. I'm just looking for the best hand.

my 2c

[smitty12]

Originally Posted by tekka-maki

I think it's in the best interest of the majority to consider either a revamping of the prop tax code or a supplement tax to bring it down, because at the end of the day, no income tax but a high prop. tax (or vice versa) is just smoke and mirrors. I'm just looking for the best hand.

my 2c

The same amount of money will need to be squeezed out of the populace either way. An income tax would just change the winners and losers.... No tax is completely fair. In my case we would probably pay $3000 more in a state income tax at 3%. But then we "choose" to live well below what we could afford (i.e. qualify for) in housing. An income tax would negate that choice. I guess you could choose less income, but that would have many more negative effects.

It seems pretty simple to me, If you want to pay less property tax buy less valuable property.... Not everyone needs a 3000 sf home. We do quite nicely in our 1500 sf.

[tekka-maki]

Originally Posted by smitty12

The same amount of money will need to be squeezed out of the populace either way. An income tax would just change the winners and losers.... No tax is completely fair.

Precisely what I was getting at in my last post. I'd just prefer median family income and unemployed to be on the better end... just an opinion... must be my liberal tendencies. I have a couple in me, but ultimately, I choose no prop or state income tax whatsoever.

Originally Posted by smitty12

I guess you could choose less income, but that would have many more negative effects.

Hehehe, are you joking? 3% income tax would not make me wanna go out and make less money. However, the current property tax rate would certainly make me consider a smaller home. But have you seen which neighborhoods a sub 100k house will get you in S.A.?

BTW, I'm no stranger to living within my means. I've been living on my own in ever smaller apartments since the age of 18. My last apartment was probably 650-700 sqft.

Originally Posted by smitty12

It seems pretty simple to me, If you want to pay less property tax buy less valuable property.... Not everyone needs a 3000 sf home. We do quite nicely in our 1500 sf.

You are missing my point. I never stated that 300 sf equals the point at which property tax is too much. Fundamentally, I think a 2 1/2 to 3% property tax rate coupled with an aggressive tax authority and yearly appeals is egregious, at any value level. I also think a 1% capped prop tax or a smaller percentage of FMV tax appraised value coupled with a 3% flat income tax would benefit more people financially than not.

[smitty12]

Originally Posted by tekka-maki

Precisely what I was getting at in my last post. I'd just prefer median family income and unemployed to be on the better end... just an opinion... must be my liberal tendencies. I have a couple in me, but ultimately, I choose no prop or state income tax whatsoever.

That would only be revenue positive for home owning median/low income.

Those who rent, especially in apartment buildings would get hit harder with an income tax. Due to the way the tax appraisals work, Apartments end up paying less in property taxes so less property tax is figured into the rent... Also when a theoretical change over happens do you actually think apartment complexes/landlords will lower their rates? It will take a few years to even out hurting the lower classes.

I don't have good numbers in front of me, but I would be willing to bet that there are more renters than owners in the lower/median income bracket.

[tekka-maki]

Originally Posted by smitty12

That would only be revenue positive for home owning median/low income.

Or 52k crowd with a 150k home, or the 104k crowd year with a home over 200k, or the the unemployed, or 'home owning median' and anyone slightly over or under a 10-20k margin. You may think a 150k home is on the higher end i.e. exorbitant, but it's not in SA. It's on the lower end of most subdivisions, despite the ramshackle homes that pepper much of SA and skew the numbers. When I was looking for a home in the multitude of subdivs on W,NW, and N sides which had either been here for awhile or were brand new, nary a home for much less than 150k (after options and such).

To tell you the truth, I'm not fond of the apartment dwellers in SA (more than I've ever seen anywhere) getting a free ride on school tax, particularly those that have children. But hey, I'm not saying income tax shouldn't be reduced for working-poor.

Before I hear the the bugle from anyone else, yes I know (as smitty has stated) that it's factored in the rent, but we've had this talk in this very same thread and it is known that considerably less tax is factored into the rent as rental companies don't pay as much in prop tax (i.e. incommensurate with what the homeowner pays) and thus do not really pass the buck. I think that when prop tax for a modest home is half (or more) than what someone is paying in rent for a decent apartment, there's something wrong and is why the rental community here is so HUGE.

[rd2007]

seems like a couple of lame guesses and some probably not true numbers is all it takes to get your appraisal lowered..
Property Tax Favoritism? | WOAI.COM: San Antonio News

gotta love corruption..

[sinsativ]

Actually, according to the median sales statistics, his house is in the ok area, his is rated at @ $123 per square ft, and the selling median for his neighborhood is @ $111, so really, no big to do. Just his went down.

[mastercone]

This has been a wonderful thread BUT no where does anyone identify the real problem with property taxes and that is that GOVERNMENT SPENDING IS OUT OF CONTROL. If this electorate were, which thus far it has proven that it isn't, capable of sending a signal to the officials responsible for this growing mess we would all see lower taxes. Arguments concerning property taxes versus income taxes versus sales taxes, etc. are worthless if you can't stop appeasing the ones who have unchecked authority to spend your money as they please. Until this is addressed, all of these arguments over percentages and the preferred types of taxation are fruitless.