SF rental market is insane (San Francisco, Daly City: middle-class, for sale, city hall)

[Radio Flyer]

Another thing...

If you do move 50-70 miles out of the city, be a part of that community, physically and mentally. I've seen so many people reluctantly move out of a desired area because of finances, kids, schools, etc. and they're never really happy...I saw it in the bay area and I've seen it on the east coast too. They're in denial and have convinced themselves that the distance isn't really that bad. After awhile reality sets in.

If you have the freedom to do so, doesn't it make more sense to find an area where you can really put down roots instead kidding yourself that you still live in S.F., Boston, etc.

[uptown_urbanist]

Originally Posted by dmode

Really? LA? Boston? Neither of them have the similar high paying jobs. You have no clue you are talking about. LA has jobs that pay much lower than the bay area. I know, I went to school there. Yes, NYC has higher paying jobs and that's reflected in Manhattan rents. DC has high paying jobs and no, it doesn't have lower cost of living. I have lived in Silver Spring where rents were comparable to many peninsula towns. I think you need to get out of the "Bay Area Hate" bubble and re-evaluate your information.

For what it's worth, it's cheaper and easier to rent in Manhattan these days than in the city of SF. (I speak from recent personal experience). We're back in SF because of my husband's job, but we ended up living outside of the city itself -- couldn't find a place in our old neighborhood thanks to the crazy rental market. I like where we are and it's no hardship, but in NYC we were able to rent a decent 2-BR on a very convenient block in the East Village; fast-forward two months to SF, same salary, same budget, and there was no way we'd find anything in an equivalently convenient/fun neighborhood (and pickings were slim even in our preferred neighborhoods like the Richmond, which I think in NYC would be more like the equivalent of somewhere like Astoria but with higher rents), and when we DID find things to apply to, there were about 100 other people with the same or higher incomes and credit ratings putting in applications.

I love San Francisco, and am currently loving exploring the East Bay, and are here because it's where the job is, but the rental market is truly crazy. The salaries and rental housing prices are not in alignment in San Francisco these days. I remember seeing some recent reports showing that this was the most expensive rental market in the country (I think one compared median rental prices to median household income and compared cities in that way), and I believe it. There are many reasons to move here, but low cost of living is clearly not one of them. For most people, the higher wages aren't enough higher to compensate for the MUCH higher housing costs.

[ssmaster]

if San francisco rents continue to increase a lot of peole will have to make some tough choices.continue to live in SF where the $65- $75,000 income gives them the same lifestyle as someone making $25-35,000 in another city.unable to afford a car, no international vacations ,having roomates ,no fine dining.
an urban upper middle class lifestyle so far away they can't even see it.
some peope will leave. others will adjust to having less discretionary money.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by Radio Flyer

Another thing...

If you do move 50-70 miles out of the city, be a part of that community, physically and mentally. I've seen so many people reluctantly move out of a desired area because of finances, kids, schools, etc. and they're never really happy...I saw it in the bay area and I've seen it on the east coast too. They're in denial and have convinced themselves that the distance isn't really that bad. After awhile reality sets in.

If you have the freedom to do so, doesn't it make more sense to find an area where you can really put down roots instead kidding yourself that you still live in S.F., Boston, etc.

My brother's neighbors met and married in San Francisco... after their child was born, they moved to a nice home/neighborhood in Pleasant Hill near BART.

He really liked living there and she deeply regretted it.

So, after a lot of upgrades to the home and her still wanting to be in SF... they sold at a loss and moved to a two bedroom in San Francisco...

The problem is she no longer likes SF... says it has changed and misses the home they sold 2 years ago in Pleasant Hill... most of her single friends married and left the city too... not to mention they are looking at another rent increase.

The problem is it would cost a lot more to buy their same house back... just a little over 2 years later because the area has had strong sales...

Sometimes... you really can't go back...

[dmode]

Originally Posted by Azmordean

Actually he is right about DC and New York. Do a search for richest counties and you will see the list is dominated entirely by counties around DC (Northern VA and suburban MD) and NYC / NJ. Bay area isn't even in the top 15.

Http://money.msn.com/family-money/th...ies-in-america

Problem is the bay area has a lot of high earners and a huge underclass of people who can't afford anything approaching reasonable housing. I love the bay area but salaries alone do not come close to justifying the cost of living. There is something more systematic at work.

These studies on "richest counties" are deeply flawed because they are not scaled by population. Most of the 15 counties in this list do not even feature in the 100 most populous counties in the US.

List of the most populous counties in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Take for example, the number 1 on that list - Loudon County in Virginia has a population of roughly 300k. Compare that to Santa Clara county with a population of ~ 2 million. If I carved out Atherton and made it county, it will also rank in the top 5. The fact that Santa Clara county with over 2 mn people still has a median household income of over $85K tells you all you need to know about rents in the Bay Are.

[andyadhi01]

Originally Posted by dmode

These studies on "richest counties" are deeply flawed because they are not scaled by population. Most of the 15 counties in this list do not even feature in the 100 most populous counties in the US.

List of the most populous counties in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Take for example, the number 1 on that list - Loudon County in Virginia has a population of roughly 300k. Compare that to Santa Clara county with a population of ~ 2 million. If I carved out Atherton and made it county, it will also rank in the top 5. The fact that Santa Clara county with over 2 mn people still has a median household income of over $85K tells you all you need to know about rents in the Bay Are.

Are you really that illiterate? Why is the sample size i.e population important when you are comparing median income? I guess with this kind of math skill its no wonder you fail to realize that bay area is grossly overpriced with poor quality of life. Other than natural scenery name me one aspect in which bay area is ahead of DC area?

[andyadhi01]

Originally Posted by ssmaster

if San francisco rents continue to increase a lot of peole will have to make some tough choices.continue to live in SF where the $65- $75,000 income gives them the same lifestyle as someone making $25-35,000 in another city.unable to afford a car, no international vacations ,having roomates ,no fine dining.
an urban upper middle class lifestyle so far away they can't even see it.
some peope will leave. others will adjust to having less discretionary money.

In a normal functioning market driven economy this will trigger a building boom, increase supply and prices will be in control. SF has vast swaths of unused or underused land, very little high rise structures out of downtown and grossly inadequate road and public transit infrastructure to support growth. Yet nobody is building anything here.. CA in general and SF in particular have become dysfunctional! They are too busy patting each others back because a handful of the people make too much money and the rest live in depressing living environment.

[bigdumbgod]

Originally Posted by andyadhi01

SF has vast swaths of unused or underused land.

Really? Where?

We still wonder why you (anybody, really) continue to live in SF if you hate it so much. It's been years of posts bemoaning the awfulness of the place, yet no move.

[jupiler]

Originally Posted by 7x7er

Ehh, roommate situation hasn't been the best. I posted a different thread about it, but I wasn't getting along with my roommate for a brief period so she was trying to force me out. We worked things out though, so I'm still there. Its amicable now but certainly not the most comfortable environment. I keep to my room and spend a lot of time out and about.

I should clarify though, I love it here and can't really complain, considering millions of others have it way worse than I do. Even if I get to live here only a couple more years, well, I'll take the experiences along with me the rest of my life.

I remember that thread. I'm glad it kinda worked out.

[jupiler]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

Sometimes... you really can't go back...

Truth be spoken.