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Well, let's assume that the "grid" as we know it today is suddenly going to be down for 18 for whatever reason. I think the effects would vary wildly according to location. I think that in many areas, there would be a lot of "improvising" going on to restore electricity on a smaller scale. Not all that long ago, there was no collectivized grid over the entire US. There were lots of regional grids. And before that, there were lots more local grids that were at times as small as just one city or town.
For instance, in my area, there are quite a number of huge wind turbines, no doubt connected to our collectivized national grid. But there is also a small hydro generator on our local river that, as far as I can determine, was the "grid" here at one time. It probably supplied the whole town and surrounding area. As far as I can tell, it's still operational and used to an extent. I hear the generator when I'm near it. I think in a bad situation, there would be a lot of local people in some areas re-establishing this sort of model for power (at least while the "big" grid is not functional). That's the way it used to be done and the folks that know how to run the power grids via the modern technology, I'm sure could figure ways to rig up the models of yesteryear in a pinch, at least in areas that have something left of that older technology or the resources to bring it back.
Of course, I think a lot of things would revert to "localized" in the event of some disruption on a grand scale. A grand-scale centralized/collectivized model doesn't work well in rough times. Historically this "localization" has happened time and time again in bad times.
In my state we are a power producer with hydro and coal primarily, but we have some big wind farms to that make a little power on good days.
Unless all the lines, transformers, switching stations were all taken out by some huge event, if the power went down in other states, theoretically, we could just cut the outside lines and produce for our state with little or no interruption.
I've seen times when the power lines were down for 3+ days when the weather was so bad it would knock out the lines and the repairmen couldn't get to the lines to fix them, but that doesn't happen often.
Many of the homes in my state already have generators that are used on a daily basis for work and serve as backup if the power goes out so I can't forsee a real serious event causing a huge distruption here that would last for more than a few days.
Thank you posters including Chris. Here in Wisconsin we have among the largest windmill farms running hundreds of square miles. I need to check with Wind Works and others to get first hand grid impact on wattage from windmill/turbines if its end
power station is compromised. Additionally, I'm sorry I didn't review the potenial
causes of an 18 month shut down the congressional subcommitee concluded (the
time it would take to power up) Yes the typical cause are solar flare, EMP, terrorists
or two high astmospheric nuclear bursts one over Southeast Tennesee one over zmWyoming for total shutdown . Not to be a be negatron the windmills are only pro viding supplemental electricity to a very segregated area in our state and only if
one has the latest solar,gas crank generator your relegated to a fw things I have
Ie, solar grill,shower,fire starters,a hundred chaffing burners,crank flashlights, radio.
We have 1000 emergency meals (25 year shelf) propane tanks ,water filters (20 pint
6 1 gal. (Seychelle) tools, and in Wisconsin thermo clothing hand and foot warmers
50 each. Pet emergency supplies.
Last edited by Inattentive; 09-17-2014 at 12:32 AM..
In the event of grid collapse Wind tower generators will be useless. Wind towers have to have electricity to start and run. They do NOT make reactive power on their own. As I mentioned before the grid can and has been operated in a very disconnected fashion.
Totally agree windmills would be a moot point as implied above. To cut to the chase
either prepared or based on severity or power up recovery be inconvenienced, be
subjected to an extended miserable sequestered survival period or die.
Totally agree windmills would be a moot point as implied above. To cut to the chase
either prepared or based on severity or power up recovery be inconvenienced, be
subjected to an extended miserable sequestered survival period or die.
Wind generators are as much a part of the grid as a line from the electric company. They require sophisticated parts that force the user to remain tied to the socio-industrial grid,
However, water windmills and compressed air windmills are very different. Using simpler technology, parts fabrication is relatively easy.
Why would anyone care if millions die as long as family, friends, and those providing necessities to same survive?
Wind generators are as much a part of the grid as a line from the electric company. They require sophisticated parts that force the user to remain tied to the socio-industrial grid,
However, water windmills and compressed air windmills are very different. Using simpler technology, parts fabrication is relatively easy.
Why would anyone care if millions die as long as family, friends, and those providing necessities to same survive?
Also all the people with off-grid solar setups would be just fine. I appreciate everyone who has a grid-tied solar system installed (still greener and better than the person who is simply using the dirty grid) but honestly, if you are going to go the solar route, go off grid. I know it is more expensive in the short run but in the long run you get to produce your energy AND be grid independent.
Also all the people with off-grid solar setups would be just fine. I appreciate everyone who has a grid-tied solar system installed (still greener and better than the person who is simply using the dirty grid) but honestly, if you are going to go the solar route, go off grid. I know it is more expensive in the short run but in the long run you get to produce your energy AND be grid independent.
Also all the people with off-grid solar setups would be just fine. I appreciate everyone who has a grid-tied solar system installed (still greener and better than the person who is simply using the dirty grid) but honestly, if you are going to go the solar route, go off grid. I know it is more expensive in the short run but in the long run you get to produce your energy AND be grid independent.
Just how much more expensive is it? I'd love to go completely off grid but.....
I am about to go with an on grid system of 5kW and that is going to run me $17,850 before any tax rebates. That is really pushing the limit for my finances since I am paying for this entirely out of pocket. I am not willing to take on any debt to do this. This system is likely to provide about 45 - 50% of my annual usage. I believe that I was told a 10kW on grid system would run me about $40 to 42 grand. It looks like it will take me about 10 to 12 years to recoup my post rebate investment and since I'm 65 years old I may not live long enough to even see that.
Getting sort of back to the original topic I can imagine a scenario where perhaps an influenza pandemic results in a significant loss of life (it was about 2% of the global pop. in 1918) as well as numerous people staying home for an extended amount of time, either because they themselves are sick or they have family members who are. This could lead to disruptions in many services, electrical, food transportation, fuel shortages, etc. simply because so many businesses and industries are very short staffed and those things alone would leave many people in rather difficult circumstances if it continued for months on end. Remember that the 1918 pandemic swept the globe three times over a period of more than a year before it finally came to an end.
Just how much more expensive is it? I'd love to go completely off grid but.....
I am about to go with an on grid system of 5kW and that is going to run me $17,850 before any tax rebates. That is really pushing the limit for my finances since I am paying for this entirely out of pocket. I am not willing to take on any debt to do this. This system is likely to provide about 45 - 50% of my annual usage. I believe that I was told a 10kW on grid system would run me about $40 to 42 grand. It looks like it will take me about 10 to 12 years to recoup my post rebate investment and since I'm 65 years old I may not live long enough to even see that.
Getting sort of back to the original topic I can imagine a scenario where perhaps an influenza pandemic results in a significant loss of life (it was about 2% of the global pop. in 1918) as well as numerous people staying home for an extended amount of time, either because they themselves are sick or they have family members who are. This could lead to disruptions in many services, electrical, food transportation, fuel shortages, etc. simply because so many businesses and industries are very short staffed and those things alone would leave many people in rather difficult circumstances if it continued for months on end. Remember that the 1918 pandemic swept the globe three times over a period of more than a year before it finally came to an end.
I would say you have a problem with energy usage, not the expense of the system.
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