St. Charles County Ordinance question? {fencing} (St. Louis, Rea: city hall, how much, house)

[Khalus]

Been searching the web for hours and can't find any answer to my question, so hopefully someone here may know or where to direct me.

I want to build a fence in my front yard in St. Charles County, I started it recently and then an inspector drove by and warned me I should stop and that it wasn't to county ordinance. Turns out I was looking at the city which allows fences in front yard, but not the county.{backwards much?} However upon looking at the city zoning lines, turns out my neighborhood is surrounded by the city, they never annexed us, placing us in the county. Kinda silly I say.

Why I want the fence is because I have dogs and the intersection off my street is very dangerous, its a blind curvy hill and I enjoy having my dogs outside with me and while they are trained decently, sometimes other residents will walk by with their dog and mine go bolting towards that intersection, sometimes they stop, but not always and I don't want my dogs to die or anyone else to get hurt should a vehicle come barreling over that blind hill.

Anyway, what I'm trying to figure out, if I continue building the fence what can the county do to me, force me to take it down, fine me, arrest me if I refuse, any info would be great as they wouldn't answer these questions during my conversation with them earlier. Probably shouldn't have alerted them to my wanting to build a fence to begin with. Its my property, surely there must be something I can do!?

Also, while it probably won't matter, my house is in an unincorporated zone, and on a private dead end street. Is there anything I can do to fight this should the city take action? I was told I could file for a variance and write a letter of hardship to go along with it, but that doesn't make much sense in regards to a fence. plus they want $250{highway robbery} for the variance fee and no guarantee the board will ok my proposal.

BS is all I have left to say for now...lol

[glamatomic]

I can totally understand you wanting to protect your dogs! As far as ordinances in St. Charles, I'm sorry that I'm not familiar with them. However, if they're anything like the St. Louis side, they will fine you and demand that you remove the fence.

With that said though, is there any way of just fencing the back yard of your property? Generally, this seems to be more accepted by city / county codes and ordinances than front yard fencing. Obviously your dogs won't have as much room to run around if only your back yard is fenced, but at least they'll be safe and at least you won't be lumbered with any fines!

[Khalus]

Rear yard is already fenced in, and while most would say thats enough, I'm really close with my dogs and would love for them to have the full yard and able to be near me at all times and know they're safe too. Problem is they like to bark if they can't get near me or are confined and can see me {separation anxiety} I do believe. Generally doesn't last long and I can tolerate it some, but I also don't want to disturb the neighbors.

When you say fines, do know if its a one time fine, or will they continue to fine me? {how much generally?} Upon demanding that the fence be removed, what if I refuse, more fines? Would I be arrested? etc etc?

What would St. Louis do, probably similar legal actions? In the end if I refuse to remove the fence, could they eventually do it themselves, although doubt the county would pay for that, and being on a private road they refuse to service. Have been told multiple times by workers if county equipment were seen on my street they'd get in trouble.

Anyway, thanks for any further input you or anyone else post.

[glamatomic]

From what I've heard at least (I'm sure it's different in other parts of the county) .. in my city, at least in theory, if an inspector notices a violation, you first of all receive a warning letter or a fine (depending on the type of violation) and a certain number of days to comply. After that time period, the property is re-inspected and the home owner again receives a 2nd warning letter/ fine with a compliance time frame. If, after the time frame the code / ordinance is still violated for a 2nd time, apparently the city will remove the offending structure or do the relevant clean up or whatever it is and then bill the home owner for all costs involved.

I'm hoping someone from St. Charles County though can chime in regarding the procedure there!

[CSD610]

Contact St Charles version of City Hall and ask them who you should talk to about this issue. I bet there is an ordinance on the books that can give you details and help make your decision to proceed or not.

[Hunter2013]

See if this ordinance helps. It looks like front yard fences are prohibited in the county if I am reading it right.

Fence Permit

[jribe]

I don't know about St Charles, so i can't comment on their ordinances but what about putting up an electric fence? That way no one would "see" the fence and hopefully yours dogs would stay within the bounds. May be worth checking out at least. good luck!

[Khalus]

I've been in contact with the County and asked about the fence and they just say no. Won't give me an explanation as to why I can't. At the bottom of the ordinance page it says any fences built prior to Jan 1st 2010 are ok, so what changed then and who decided this? Why won't they tell me? Surely it wasn't a vote by the citizens or I would have heard about it, can they do that, just say no without a vote?

One thing that stands out about the fence ordinance is at the very top and I quote:
"Required front yards in all districts shall be devoted to landscaping, ingress and egress driveways, fences, sidewalks, and exceptions as further provided herein."

Says right there that front yards are to be devoted to and including "fences" then further down says required front yard fences are prohibited ~ contradicting much?

Am planning on contacting the city on Mon and see what they say considering I'm in all technicality in the city boundary, just non-annexed so I'm considered county. It just doesn't make any sense!

I don't like electric fences, and they don't really keep big dogs in, and mine are all big dogs. Then of course they'd all have to wear collars, which I've never had my dogs do, don't like em and they're happy without them.

I just want my entire yard fenced in so my dogs can roam everywhere with me, and be safe. Is that so much to ask!? I'm planning on going to the next County/City Community Meeting to voice my opinion and concerns and hopefully there will be many other residents there that may feel the same way as I or that didn't know of these restrictions and suddenly back me.

[glamatomic]

I agree with not wanting to go with an electric fence. I personally think they're inhumane... but I've been accused of being overly sensitive when it comes to animals in the past. I just know that I wouldn't like to wear a shock collar, so I wouldn't put it on my pets either!

Good luck with your phone call to the council on Monday. Let us know how it goes.

[Khalus]

Originally Posted by glamatomic

I agree with not wanting to go with an electric fence. I personally think they're inhumane... but I've been accused of being overly sensitive when it comes to animals in the past. I just know that I wouldn't like to wear a shock collar, so I wouldn't put it on my pets either!

Precisely, I feel the same way!

Interesting, may have found a slight way to help further my cause using my dogs! Was just reading through the County Ordinances regarding Dogs, and it says that proper containment of dogs must be maintained. My rear yard fence is broken down and failing on both sides of my yard, that which I planned to replace anyway along with this front yard. However, I have a 4-way mud room between my house and garage and sometimes my dogs escape when leaving the house, thus not properly contained once they get out the front...hrmmm

Now I mean they don't go running off and disappear, they generally stay near me or run down along the street towards new smells, but if a neighbor were outside or they see another dog being walked along the cross road {which has happened a few times} they tend to bolt towards them. They're peaceful and loving Yellow Labs and wouldn't hurt anyone intentionally and sometimes listen when I tell them to stop and return, but not always. Wonder if I can use this towards my plight to obtain a front yard fence...hrmmm