Clayton is Booming (St. Louis, Columbia, Chesterfield: sales, 2013, credit)

[STL1980]

Downtown grew at over 7.6% last year. One of the fastest growing residential neighborhoods, if not THE fastest, in the region. I would like to see both a booming Clayton submarket and a booming Downtown market connected fully in between. I think the additional office development at Centene should help the demand for apartments in Clayton, but from what I've heard, they are not leasing up as fast as in the CWE, but perhaps that's not correct. Clayton really needs to work on their nightlife. After 8:00 PM Clayton is far more dead than Downtown St. Louis. Where people under 35 used to go out in Clayton, that is really no longer the case other than two or three bars, and even then the crowds aren't what they used to be. That crowd now goes to the Grove, the CWE, Downtown and Soulard. Clayton cops also over-policed the area, which didn't help.

[goat314]

Originally Posted by Koji7

Just recently got back from there, it does look kind of sad, it’s not just the sad look it’s a dead look. But also exciting too...once the powers that be start deciding to change that impression for good then I think St Louis will really prosper. You have to give people a reason to relocate there.

I agree, St. Louis has ridiculous potential. It's like an antique car that just needs some work and you really got something special. I think the slow population growth has created a really insular culture where leadership doesn't look outside the city for good ideas or inspiration.

[STL1980]

Armando, you gem! I love Pasadena Hills! Have you checked it out yet? Let's stick to Clayton on this thread though! xoxo

[Chicago76]

Originally Posted by STL1980

Downtown grew at over 7.6% last year. One of the fastest growing residential neighborhoods, if not THE fastest, in the region. I would like to see both a booming Clayton submarket and a booming Downtown market connected fully in between. I think the additional office development at Centene should help the demand for apartments in Clayton, but from what I've heard, they are not leasing up as fast as in the CWE, but perhaps that's not correct. Clayton really needs to work on their nightlife. After 8:00 PM Clayton is far more dead than Downtown St. Louis. Where people under 35 used to go out in Clayton, that is really no longer the case other than two or three bars, and even then the crowds aren't what they used to be. That crowd now goes to the Grove, the CWE, Downtown and Soulard. Clayton cops also over-policed the area, which didn't help.

Nightlife is really dependent upon how many young professions live and work in an area. Even if Clayton were to add apartments, it wouldn't make much of an impact because a) they will be too expensive for most young professionals and b) Clayton and most of the surrounding areas are aging and are too expensive.

College Educated 25-34 year olds 2000 vs. most recent estimate (2011-16 census):

Clayton + 6 nearest towns (Brentwood, Maplewood, Richmond Heights, U City, Ladue, Olivette):

Increase in young college grads from 10,600 to 11,400. All of that increase was due to Brentwood and Maplewood though. Without them, Clayton + the other 4 towns are flat to slightly down. Not coincidentally, we have seen a lot of options open up in Maplewood w/ a cheaper market and growing young professional set moving in.

Here's the city over the same time period: 14,400 in 2000 to 29,300 recently. 15,000 more. About 95% of that is in the Central Corridor and adjacent South City neighborhoods (Tower Grove neighborhoods to the West, Soulard to the East, Cherokee to the South). The rest of the city, net is pretty flat. Some areas have picked a few up, others have lost a few.

In order for Clayton to create any sort of after hours area, they'd probably need to construct a couple thousand units, which will never happen because NIMBYs. Most of those would probably get bought by higher income Boomers looking to downsize and eat at places like Herbies. New/refurbished multiunit 2BRs near downtown Clayton are 2K and up. You can get that for 1200-1500 in the CWE and 900-1300 Downtown. And even those that do fall into younger people's hands probably wouldn't make a huge difference because nearby areas are still losing and the nightlife options in nearby areas are more established (Grove, CWE, Delmar, Maplewood)

[pdm_ad]

Nice review on the 2017 developments in Clayton by the guy(s) at nextstl.com:

https://nextstl.com/2018/01/clayton-...t-review-2018/

As 2017 has come to an end it’s time to review what’s going on in downtown Clayton and what’s in the queue for 2018. Clayton may be a small city of just 16,500 residents condensed within a quaint 2.5 square miles but don’t let this those modest figures fool you. This county seat has more development going on per capita than anywhere in the midwest.

[1764]

My humble opinion downtown streets need a major upgrade in improvements there needs to be a smarter emphasis on better street scape and up keeping i think that what makes downtown look very dead.. Once JA RWE and few other developments begin rehab things will begin to change.

Remember downtown was left for dead its come a long ways and still has a long ways to go!

Other than that i do like Clayton though it doesn't have the history or historic stock that downtown does.

[1764]

I don't ever believe in downtown history it was clean even in classic pics its always looked dirty gritty and grungy

[glamatomic]

Originally Posted by 1764

I don't ever believe in downtown history it was clean even in classic pics its always looked dirty gritty and grungy

It was actually quite infamous in the earlier part of the 20th century for the amount of pollution- even Life magazine ran a pictorial on it around the 1930s. The infamy was followed by much stricter coal burning regulations being enforced.

[atractor49]

To me, St Louis is a sucker for gimcracks, the most obvious example being the arch itself. St Louis cleared out a viable commercial district, replete with antebellum architecture, to make way for it. I mean honestly, look at what you have; a prissy, 630 ft tall, look-at-me nose ring . Seeing as how it glorifies the near extermination of native peoples, it ought to be taken down.

[Mosep]

Originally Posted by atractor49

To me, St Louis is a sucker for gimcracks, the most obvious example being the arch itself. St Louis cleared out a viable commercial district, replete with antebellum architecture, to make way for it. I mean honestly, look at what you have; a prissy, 630 ft tall, look-at-me nose ring . Seeing as how it glorifies the near extermination of native peoples, it ought to be taken down.

Why do you think the pre-arch district was "viable"?

Most of it was already abandoned and decaying by the 1930s. Heck, Laclede's Landing has enough trouble trying to attract businesses, so how could we possibly utilize 50 some odd square blocks of additional 19th century buildings and warehouses. We could debate the artistic merits of the Arch all day, but like it or not, it has become synonymous with St. Louis worldwide.