When is Enough, Enough? (Miller: legal, statistics, vehicle)

[ryanfze55]

Originally Posted by mjtinmemphis

If you are wanting to only listen to a White Supremacist agenda.

Some aren't trying to hear anything but what they want.

Basically this.

People don't want to think critically anymore. They don't want to see or hear difficult things. Most Americans are not overtly racist, but they are also incapable of discussing racial topics without getting defensive. I can't tell you how many times I've heard someone say, "Sports and politics don't mix! I don't want to see players protesting when I'm trying to enjoy a game." Sports is just one of the many things that people use to escape the reality of daily living for a brief while. I suppose escape might be healthy, but I think it has more to do with people just not wanting to confront uncomfortable ideas. It's unfortunate, because pondering the great philosophical questions of our time is part of the zest of life. You see this on the other side, too, as certain universities and their students try to silence free speech.

[1grin_g0]

Originally Posted by mjtinmemphis

If you are wanting to only listen to a White Supremacist agenda.

Some aren't trying to hear anything but what they want.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwfvRbAK2IM


I don't think this guy is a white supremacist, but he has a shaved head so I could be wrong. Like he said, if people would just COMPLY with the POLICE we wouldn't have a problem with suspects getting shot. It's not hard to do unless you are looking for a problem.

[TheProf]

Originally Posted by gg

True. People seem to love to play the victim these days. We just had a black president for 8 years. The doors are all wide open to be successful with countless programs for minorities and Affirmative Action, but one would have to take advantage of the programs and that takes some work, yet it would be much cheaper and easier to get ahead if you are a non-Asian minority due to all the programs and laws for protection.

I feel for St. Louis. Sure seems like an angry place.

Yeah, Black people just loved slavery, Jim Crow, lynchings, race riots (group lynching, when white mobs burned down entire black neighborhoods and cities -- see Tulsa, East St. Louis, Springfield, Detroit, etc, etc, prior to WWII), and, today, cops willy-nilly gunning down unarmed Black men and women with zero consequence at all; not to mention such niceties as red lining, lead paint, experimentation on men and women (the Tuskegee Experiment is the tip of the iceberg) , pollution and hazardous chemical dumps put in Black areas -- and yeah, I just learned recently in my beloved Cleveland that, during the 1940s run-up to the Manhattan Project, Little Boy and, ultimately, Hiroshima and Nagasaki, down in the industrial Flats a company was secretly enriching uranium and in the areas of the sealed off (to most people) part of the plant where there was close contact with the radioactive material, ... you guessed it, there was FULL EMPLOYMENT for Black men (and only Black men) there...

... I can't make this stuff up. But I guess all this, and much, much more, fits your paradigm that any sane people would go through all of this, just to play 'the victim' ... right .

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by 1grin_g0

I don't think this guy is a white supremacist, but he has a shaved head so I could be wrong. Like he said, if people would just COMPLY with the POLICE we wouldn't have a problem with suspects getting shot. It's not hard to do unless you are looking for a problem.

Except for the cases where people did comply and got shot anyway, or were shot within seconds of police arriving who had no chance to comply, or were handcuffed, arrested and killed inside the police vehicle. Somehow there are very few convictions even with ample video evidence demonstrating exactly what happened. Blaming the victims for not complying with police is just laughably, willfully ignorant.

[1grin_g0]

Originally Posted by FrankMiller

Except for the cases where people did comply and got shot anyway, or were shot within seconds of police arriving who had no chance to comply, or were handcuffed, arrested and killed inside the police vehicle. Somehow there are very few convictions even with ample video evidence demonstrating exactly what happened. Blaming the victims for not complying with police is just laughably, willfully ignorant.

Every case should be looked at individually. The police are not perfect obviously, nobody is, but you greatly reduce the chances of getting shot if you just comply and do what you are told. That's the point that the guy was making in the video, but perhaps you didn't watch it. If all these pro athletes really cared about police shootings and reducing fatalities, then they should be holding camps and training their young fans to comply with the police. Instead, it seems that many are sending the message that the police are their oppressors. I don't think you are doing anybody any favors by raising kids up that way. In fact, by making Michael Brown and other non-compliant individuals out to be victims, the streets become less safe because police officers are scared that they will become the next Darren Wilson, and have their life totally ruined simply for doing their job. In the Stockley case, the guy was a heroin dealer who did not comply.

The other thing to consider is the fact that when a black officer shoots a black suspect, or a black officer shoots a non-black suspect, or any time a white male suspect is shot, those cases get little to no media attention, especially compared to Michael Brown and Trayvon Martin. One case recently that did get a little attention was when the black Somali officer in Minnesota shot an unarmed white Australian woman, but that story died in like a week. It didn't get wall to wall coverage and go on and on for months like Michael Brown. Have you ever wondered why these cases aren't covered by the media? Have you ever heard of Emanuel Kidega Samson? You probably have no idea who he is, but we all know who Dylann Roof is. Why is that? It's because the media profits from fueling race wars.

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by 1grin_g0

Every case should be looked at individually. The police are not perfect obviously, nobody is, but you greatly reduce the chances of getting shot if you just comply and do what you are told.

You can probably reduce your chance of being raped if you walk around in a mumu, that doesn't mean rapists should go unpunished.

For the record, nobody is saying you shouldn't comply with police; they're saying compliance isn't a solution and it doesn't absolve the justice system of guilt.

Originally Posted by 1grin_g0

The other thing to consider is the fact that when a black officer shoots a black suspect, or a black officer shoots a non-black suspect, or any time a white male suspect is shot, those cases get little to no media attention, especially compared to Michael Brown and Trayvon Martin. One case recently that did get a little attention was when the black Somali officer in Minnesota shot an unarmed white Australian woman, but that story died in like a week. It didn't get wall to wall coverage and go on and on for months like Michael Brown. Have you ever wondered why these cases aren't covered by the media?

Hm, yes, why aren't white people up in arms over the trend of police unlawfully shooting a white person? It's such a mystery, I guess the only possible explanation is the media pulling the strings to fuel a race war. It couldn't possibly be because white people as a group rightfully aren't afraid of the police, and black people rightfully are.

[1grin_g0]

Originally Posted by FrankMiller

You can probably reduce your chance of being raped if you walk around in a mumu, that doesn't mean rapists should go unpunished.

For the record, nobody is saying you shouldn't comply with police; they're saying compliance isn't a solution and it doesn't absolve the justice system of guilt.



Hm, yes, why aren't white people up in arms over the trend of police unlawfully shooting a white person? It's such a mystery, I guess the only possible explanation is the media pulling the strings to fuel a race war. It couldn't possibly be because white people as a group rightfully aren't afraid of the police, and black people rightfully are.

Compliance is the solution in 99.99999999% of contacts with the police. That's a great place to start.

You don't need to be afraid of the police if you are obeying the law, and are compliant during police stops. You have a much greater chance of getting struck by lighting than a compliant person has of being shot by the police. Are you going to stay indoors for the rest of your life every time you see a cloud in the sky? If not, then it's also irrational to be afraid of the police. Cops that break the law are criminals and need to be punished, but there has to be sufficient evidence. Nobody is saying that criminal cops shouldn't be locked up, but you have to prove it.


And just maybe, white people (I'm not sure why you had to limit it to just white people) aren't rioting over white suspects being shot because that's not a lie the media is selling? Why would you try to sell something that's not profitable? I sure wouldn't buy it.

The mainstream media is not covering police shootings of black males because people are up in arms, people are up in arms because the media keeps fueling it and profiting off the lie.

[MUTGR]

Originally Posted by FrankMiller

For the record, nobody is saying you shouldn't comply with police; they're saying compliance isn't a solution and it doesn't absolve the justice system of guilt.

Compliance would have been a solution for the two high profile cases in St. Louis causing sometimes violent protests.

Compliance would have been a solution for Michael Brown; instead, he rather poorly, chose to assault a police officer and died as a result.

Compliance would have been a solution for Anthony Smith in the parking lot of Church's Fried Chicken on December 20, 2011. He almost certainly would have lived that evening, but he would have been arrested.

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by 1grin_g0

Cops that break the law are criminals and need to be punished, but there has to be sufficient evidence. Nobody is saying that criminal cops shouldn't be locked up, but you have to prove it.

I'm glad to see you agree with me and BLM in principle, but there have been multiple cases of cops not even prosecuted despite ample evidence. And many cases where police claimed there was no evidence of wrongdoing and turned out to have lied or filed false reports. So it's clear why police don't get the benefit of the doubt in all these he-said, she-said cases.

[1grin_g0]

Originally Posted by FrankMiller

I'm glad to see you agree with me and BLM in principle, but there have been multiple cases of cops not even prosecuted despite ample evidence. And many cases where police claimed there was no evidence of wrongdoing and turned out to have lied or filed false reports. So it's clear why police don't get the benefit of the doubt in all these he-said, she-said cases.

If that's what BLM stands for, I think it's safe to say they have a major communication problem. I don't know the details of all the cases, but with what limited information is reported, I almost always side with the cops. The Eric Garner case was really sad. Why the hell were the cops tasked with enforcing cigarette tax laws? Still, if he just would have complied he would have been okay. Sure there is usually a better way to handle something, but hindsight is 20/20. There is a very high bar to convict a cop, and that's probably how it should be in my opinion. I don't think the streets would be any safer if cops are out there worried about being prosecuted. They already have an impossible job and they don't get compensated nearly enough for what they do.