Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
You stand around and supervise 75% of the time...15% at useless rear-end kissing activities...and 10% listening to grips...stop telling us that standing around and supervising and rear end kissing is work....really
You should know better than this. Good administrators put in some long and at times, very stressful, hours. Just like non-teachers are clueless of a teacher's job beyond seeing them standing in front of a class teaching, and therefore assume that's all they do, part of school level administrators' jobs are done away from watching teachers, staff, students, and parents eyes. Any district that values its fiscal safety will require an administrator to be in attendance whenever there are events involving more than a handful of students at school. Some require it if there is even one student on the grounds. Just like planning and grading are unseen but take up huge chunks of a teacher's time, meetings, committees, and reports eat up a great deal of an administrator's time. Also, it is worth noting that administrators generally do not have tenure, or they only retain tenure to return to the classroom.
Because we only see the public aspect of anyone else's job it is far too easy to compare it to our complete understanding of all the extras in our own job and conclude theirs must be easier.
__________________
When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
And I'm really - REALLY - wishing there was an alternative...
This past year, I moved to another system that pays much better than my previous one, but even the increase in pay almost isn't enough to compensate for the dread I face each morning. And it isn't the new environment as some might imagine. I was feeling this way 5-10 years previous. It's simply getting worse.
I started life - and my teaching career - out as an extrovert. But as I grow older, I find myself becoming more introverted. And this is completely counter to my teaching methods. Thus I find myself like an actor on stage, playing a role that is becoming increasing more uncomfortable to play with each passing year. And don't get me wrong, I'm very, very successful with developing a rapport with my students and garnering those coveted standardized scores. But the role I play is wearing me down. It's hard to do this day after day after day, when it's no longer who or what I am.
But it's not just me and my own personality changes. It's the changes I've faced over 2 decades of teaching.
With the increase emphasis on scores, and the shift of learning responsibilities from the student (the learner) to the teacher.
From the overwhelming increase of micromanagement from the central office and school-based administration to the generational differences of the parents (the older generation holding the student responsible for learning/behavior to the newer one holding the teacher responsible).
From the increased interference of business and industry into areas not of their expertise to the degraded reputation that society holds for a position once considered a "profession".
I could continue, but it would be pointless: those of you other teachers sharing my years and experience will already know and sympathize with me.
Those of you who have never taught in a public K-12 setting for any real length of time will never know and will not believe anything I say, or will chalk it up to "usual pissing and moaning by those ungrateful, under-worked, overpaid babysitters'.
This is how I feel after 27 years. Emotionally bankrupt. Actually this began much earlier when I began teaching in an urban school district. But...the kids I actually tolerate, it's the adults that work in and run the place.
At one time I was an extrovert, I think you have to be to be a good teacher, but as the years wore on and the job wore me down, I just lost it. I'd rather not talk to anyone. I just do what I have to do to accomplish my job. After that, just leave me alone.
Teachers develop a lot of skills that translate well to the business world. You have management, organizational motivational, planning and training skills.
Thus, you could move into any of these areas.
My probably soon to be SIL wants to get out of teaching. I helped him look into corporate training. At the company I work for they said they have hire teachers in the past and they did very well. They said starting pay would be in the realm of $50,000 - $65,000. It would help if they had background in the particular business (in our case Construction). I do not know how good the market is for such positions. We are a 1.5 billion/year company and we have 3 people in the training department. So, probably not a ton of such job, but if oyu are flexible, it might be possible to find one.
If you could get into it, a former teacher might o well in construction management. It is all about orgnaizing, planning, developing programs, and "herding cats" (subcontractors in this case). It might be hard to get into without going back for a degree, but it is possible. You would start in most companies as a PE (Project engineer - who is not really an engineer at all). A degree in construction management or engineering or architecture would be helpful, but not required. The last two PEs I dealt with, one was a chemistry major and the other economics. In our case, a Spanish fluent person might be helpful in our operations in Mexico. Of course in Construction management, you have to be prepared to move around a lot and to work long hours, but the pay is good and the work mostly exciting.
That is just one example. There are probably 50 places where you could use the skills you have developed.
You should know better than this. Good administrators put in some long and at times, very stressful, hours. Just like non-teachers are clueless of a teacher's job beyond seeing them standing in front of a class teaching, and therefore assume that's all they do, part of school level administrators' jobs are done away from watching teachers, staff, students, and parents eyes. Any district that values its fiscal safety will require an administrator to be in attendance whenever there are events involving more than a handful of students at school. Some require it if there is even one student on the grounds. Just like planning and grading are unseen but take up huge chunks of a teacher's time, meetings, committees, and reports eat up a great deal of an administrator's time. Also, it is worth noting that administrators generally do not have tenure, or they only retain tenure to return to the classroom.
Because we only see the public aspect of anyone else's job it is far too easy to compare it to our complete understanding of all the extras in our own job and conclude theirs must be easier.
Thank you for this.
You know, when I went from the classroom to a vice-principalship, I was stunned how little I knew about what a vice principal actually did, even though I had been teaching for 13 years.
When I went from vice-principal to principal, I wasn't "stunned", but I was surprised at how little I knew about what a principal did.
As you say, it's difficult to imagine the complexity of most jobs in a school. There's only one job in a school which I think is inherently "easy" compared to all the others, and even then how well the job is done varies greatly from school to school.
One thing that I occasionally reminded teachers about -- and something most of them didn't know -- was that if they were sued, the principal was almost always sued, too. If they screwed up or otherwise got into really hot water, I was in that hot water right along with them. Because ultimately, the principal is held responsible for just about anything that goes on in a school. And one thing that teachers almost never knew -- because I kept it confidential -- was how many times I saved teacher's butts. Saved them from angry parent confrontations. Saved them from law suits. Saved them from the press. And in few cases even saved them from getting canned.
But that's okay. Because I did their job for 13 years. They never did my job.
But I'm not complaining. I once got a compliment from my sped department chair for the brief daily visits I would make to special ed classes. I said, "No, don't praise me. I drop in. Chat with the kids, maybe sit down for a few minutes to help them. Check to see if the teacher needs anything. And then pop back out. But you and your teachers are the ones here for five 50 minute classes a day. You're the ones here when there's a special ed kid in meltdown. That's the hard work."
Just one question. What makes you think most modern business settings are any different?
To me, one indicator is a very large number of teachers leave teaching during their first 5 years. I think it is something like 40 or 50%. Could be off some, but that is the best of my recollection. However very few ever return to teaching. So, they are not getting out into the business world and saying this is no better, I may as well go back to teaching. Of course it could be just the money thing, but in my experience, teachers are nto the types who make life choices for money. If they were, they never would have become teachers.
To me, one indicator is a very large number of teachers leave teaching during their first 5 years. I think it is something like 40 or 50%. Could be off some, but that is the best of my recollection. However very few ever return to teaching. So, they are not getting out into the business world and saying this is no better, I may as well go back to teaching. Of course it could be just the money thing, but in my experience, teachers are nto the types who make life choices for money. If they were, they never would have become teachers.
Actually, newer research indicates it's less than 18%.
Actually, newer research indicates it's less than 18%.
What newer research is that? My university tracks our graduates for five years, that 50% is pretty accurate. We are averaging slightly less than 20% the first year. We are doing about the same as the rest of the programs in our consortium. Those numbers were significantly lower during the recession, but they have now picked back up to pre-2005 levels as the economy is improving. So, I am curious to know the years used in that study.
__________________
When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
What newer research is that? My university tracks our graduates for five years, that 50% is pretty accurate. We are averaging slightly less than 20% the first year. We are doing about the same as the rest of the programs in our consortium. Those numbers were significantly lower during the recession, but they have now picked back up to pre-2005 levels as the economy is improving. So, I am curious to know the years used in that study.
Maybe your info is newer, but I thought 2015 was quite new.
Nevertheless, teaching is -- in my view -- a stressful profession. It's not for everyone, and has only gotten tougher in the last 20 years. And, I don't see things getting better under our current political situation where public service jobs seem to be a target.
Maybe your info is newer, but I thought 2015 was quite new.
Nevertheless, teaching is -- in my view -- a stressful profession. It's not for everyone, and has only gotten tougher in the last 20 years. And, I don't see things getting better under our current political situation where public service jobs seem to be a target.
Research of this nature does not happen in a vacuum, outside events can have a real impact. It is not the year it was published that matters but the years studies. In this study they only looked at the five years of 2007-08 through 2011-12 - right in the heart of a recession that was long enough and severe enough to be often referred to as "the Great Recession" in financial articles. During this time period there was also a much smaller percentage of new teachers voluntarily leaving the profession in our program. A stressful, thankless job is always preferable to most people than no job, one precieved to provide job security is considered desirable even if it makes you miserable. I said repeatedly during this time that as soon as the economy improved there was going to be an exodus. If those charged with recruiting and retaining teachers think they can take this study to the bank went making policies related to teachers they are going to find themselves struggling to fill classrooms and wondering why.
Like I said, we are starting to see stats similar to pre-2005. The teacher glut is either over or heading that way and this time throwing money at teachers is not likely to fix it.
__________________
When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
...The teacher glut is either over or heading that way and this time throwing money at teachers is not likely to fix it.
I think you're right on target here. And education is just one of the victims.
The eroding respect for being well-educated.
The eroding respect for professions.
The eroding respect for public institutions.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
