Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
And when those Hispanics refuse or cant speak English and refuse to assimilate into the culture it is understandable they are assumed to be illegal. If legal immigrants dont want to be descriminated against or get that "look" then they should do everything necessary to assimilate. I do not see any other immigrants here in mid TN (Asian, Indian, German, Polish) that do not speak English or are not assimilating.
What an absurd, categorical assumption. What is "American culture," and why do we demand someone fit into it? Good God, we have 300 million people who share the American culture, and it doesn't look like we're going to be dying out anytime soon. Forgive the simple analogy, but this country has always been a salad bowl, not a melting pot. That's why we have lutefisk, pyrogies, Cajun, AAVE, Gullah-Geeche, countless Chinatowns and little Italys, etc. etc. etc. To demand or require that Hispanic persons, simply by their moving to this country, give up their culture in favour of some mythically-held cultural persuasion shared by the nuclear families of this country is more than a little prejudiced. The problem is with the people giving the "look," not the people receiving it.
Hmm, how many Polish immigrants you guys got down there in middle TN? I know many, many Asian, southeast Asian, middle eastern and European families here who have not assimilated, because it's damned difficult. Yep, their kids have - but they had the benefit of being raised, and sometimes even born, in the US. That's a huge jumpstart to "cultural assimilation" (that is a truly scary term, btw) and to knocking down language barriers. Again, if you want to be surrounded by people speaking only English, then go to KFC, not White Castle, okay?
---------
This whole argument (not just the post I responded to) makes me wonder why we are so afraid as a country. It's not secret that we're not exactly the highest achievers in the academic and intellectual departments... and taken in combination with our dependence on outdated and unproven ideologies which we hold so dear, I can't help but conclude that we, as a people, are challenging this cultural phenomenon so strongly because we're afraid. Afraid of broadening our horizons, opening our culture, because we're too afraid and too lazy to take a look at ourselves. Why would we want to, when we can get off work, drive our SUV to our McMansion (stopping at McDonalds on the way), and watch Law & Order and ER on TV before dropping into bed, doomed to repeat the same thing the next day and the next...
Afraid of broadening our horizons, opening our culture, because we're too afraid and too lazy to take a look at ourselves. Why would we want to, when we can get off work, drive our SUV to our McMansion
I am in no way afraid of broadening anything. I am afraid that my way of life. What I was raised with. The love of country, god and my own heritage is threatened. I mean. We are not even allowed to be Christian in some circumstances. Haven't you heard Christians are being discriminated against? It's all over the news, CNN, just about every station you can possibly turn to. It's not that I don't want them and their cultures here. I love the diversification. I don't love the ones that want to 1) take over and want to make me change within my own country, religion etc. 2) Fly another countries flag above the US flag. And demand we take care of them, financially support them. (any illegal) Not all do but those that do ruin it for those that want the American dream and are honestly willing to work for it.
Here's a "for instance" My BIL and SIL live in Romulus Michigan. They are moving back home to Sparta because the gang violence has gotten rediculous. Their home is in a sun division right across from Romulus Senior High School. Guess what? When I lived there 17 years ago, that was the newer homes with nice clean streets. Beautiful place. You wouldn't believe the pics I seen and saw for myself a year ago. It's utterly sickening. People are walking away from their homes. Robert is just walking away. Houses have bars on the windows, houses for sale have the glass broken out and tore up completely inside. It was ethnically mixed neighborhood and beautiful. Black, white, Asian and Hispanic. People of the ILLEGAL Hispanic culture have moved in and it's a complete nightmare.
And I love my SUV. I can afford it. AND it's used for the farm, work etc. We do not drive it just to look spiffy. It's our income. I have an F-150 I haul my chickens in and grocery shop. I don't think I could get the same use out of a tiny car thats great on gas. So then how useful is a small car for our lives? I also have a 1983 AMC Eagle that gets 33 mpg city. I use it when I can.
Last edited by Starwalker Fallen Angel; 11-14-2007 at 03:44 PM..
I agree with your observations, jabogitlu. Are you actually 80 yrs. old?
Jabogitlu, I am not sure of how old you are, but I feel that you are wise and insightful well beyond your years.
For those who read this thread and don't understand the "look" that a couple of us have pointed out, I can assure you that it is there and it hurts tremendously.
I have been out shopping with my beautiful Hispanic, US citizen, college educated daughter-in-law and my little grandson on more than one occasion when they have received the look. At the time, it feels like everybody is looking at them, and not with a smile on their faces. If we stand at a counter to purchase something or are ready to place our order at lunch, invariably the employee directs all conversation to me as though my d-in-l cannot speak English and order for herself. I feel ashamed to be an Anglo at those moments.
Case in point: Today I was shopping at a local Publix and was tailing behind a couple and their 2 toddlers who were conversing in French. People were stopping them in the aisles ooing and awing their children. Only the husband spoke any English. He told one a woman in our check out lane that they recently moved here from Montreal to benefit their children. At least 4 or 5 people in that line and the one beside it commented how wonderful that was and wished them welcome.
It struck me as so ironic that my son and daughter-in-law who both speak fluent English and Spanish, as does my grandson (all 10 words!) attract very different reactions when out in public. I have often heard them speak Spanish to each other or to Max in public because it is sometimes easier to communicate an idea or they just do without even thinking about which language they are using at the time. They have never received a smile or comment on their beautiful toddler as a result. And, my son doesn't look even remotely Hispanic! This in itself is a telling commentary on what so many deny is prejudice. One foreign language speaking couple is perceived as "charming" and another equally well-dressed and well-mannered foreign language speaking couple gets "the look" of disdain.
I am saddended by the whole misperception. I have taught children from Latin countries who are ashamed that they have Spanish names and accents. How sad. They should be made to feel proud of their heritage and their language. Instead, we, and I use that loosely, make them feel less valued because of their name, color, language and country of origin.
I buy my grandson tons of books. I only buy them in either Spanish or bi-lingual. I will always encourage him to speak Spanish every day to keep it alive in his heart and for his children. How sorry I am that I did not try harder to learn to speak German in my grandfather's house. I would listen to my relatives, including my father, speak to one another in German (actually Pa. Dutch - a little different), and ask my dad what they were talking about. If it didn't involve giving me a goodie to eat, I usually lost interest and went off to play. Now, I wish I would have hung close to my family during those times and learned the language of my ancestors.
So many proudly announce that their ancestors were French or English, Polish, Irish, or Russian. But, they don't speak of word of their native language and most wish they did. One to two generations away from immigration the native language is usually lost to them forever.
At least, let one or two generations of Hispanic immigrants who are legally here in the US on work or study visas or are now citizens, the honor of being able to speak their native language with pride - not shame.
I think the thread has gotten to the legals instead of what it supposed to be about.
Quote:
News, Illegal Immigration Now Costs Tennesseans More Than $285 Million a Year, Finds FAIR Study.
I have nothing, not one little smidge of anything against anyone here legally. Yes, it is a shame legals and Americans with Hispanic backgrounds are discriminated against. Illegals are breaking our laws, costing us money, space in our schools causing overcrowding. Not even to go into what it's costing everyone in health care. The influx is at a huge rate. It isn't going to get better until something is done. For us mixed American mutts and for American Hispanics. We all have to work together as Americans and stop the mass crossings on the border. Period.
I think the thread has gotten to the legals instead of what it supposed to be about.
I have nothing, not one little smidge of anything against anyone here legally. Yes, it is a shame legals and Americans with Hispanic backgrounds are discriminated against. Illegals are breaking our laws, costing us money, space in our schools causing overcrowding. Not even to go into what it's costing everyone in health care. The influx is at a huge rate. It isn't going to get better until something is done. For us mixed American mutts and for American Hispanics. We all have to work together as Americans and stop the mass crossings on the border. Period.
I'm proud to be an American, as should be all legal immigrants!
But...those who shouldn't be here, regardless of why they're here or what nation they come from, need to leave. We simply cannot afford to take care of ALL the world's poor; and we simply cannot risk taking in the world's terrorists to hide amongst us.
I fear Al Quaida has not been beaten; they are merely gathering their ranks and contemplating what they're going to do to us next--and many of them have arrived here through our perforated borders.
Shame on those who started this trend of looking the other way and not enforcing our laws and guarding our sovereignty.
I am in no way afraid of broadening anything. I am afraid that my way of life. What I was raised with. The love of country, god and my own heritage is threatened. I mean. We are not even allowed to be Christian in some circumstances. Haven't you heard Christians are being discriminated against? It's all over the news, CNN, just about every station you can possibly turn to. It's not that I don't want them and their cultures here. I love the diversification. I don't love the ones that want to 1) take over and want to make me change within my own country, religion etc. 2) Fly another countries flag above the US flag. And demand we take care of them, financially support them. (any illegal) Not all do but those that do ruin it for those that want the American dream and are honestly willing to work for it.
Here's a "for instance" My BIL and SIL live in Romulus Michigan. They are moving back home to Sparta because the gang violence has gotten rediculous. Their home is in a sun division right across from Romulus Senior High School. Guess what? When I lived there 17 years ago, that was the newer homes with nice clean streets. Beautiful place. You wouldn't believe the pics I seen and saw for myself a year ago. It's utterly sickening. People are walking away from their homes. Robert is just walking away. Houses have bars on the windows, houses for sale have the glass broken out and tore up completely inside. It was ethnically mixed neighborhood and beautiful. Black, white, Asian and Hispanic. People of the ILLEGAL Hispanic culture have moved in and it's a complete nightmare.
And I love my SUV. I can afford it. AND it's used for the farm, work etc. We do not drive it just to look spiffy. It's our income. I have an F-150 I haul my chickens in and grocery shop. I don't think I could get the same use out of a tiny car thats great on gas. So then how useful is a small car for our lives? I also have a 1983 AMC Eagle that gets 33 mpg city. I use it when I can.
I agree with you mostly (except about the persecuted, discriminated against Christians - try being an atheist, or gay), actually. I hope you didn't take my commentary too personally - I was mostly reacting to 2mares' post that we should feel justified in acting in a hostile manner towards Hispanic persons, regardless of our knowledge of their backgrounds and documentation status.
Sounds like you need your SUV. More power to you, hell, that's why we invented them. My family operates a dairy and tobacco farm, so I get the big honkin' trucks and all that. It's the people that don't actually do physical labour but still drive around that Hummer that grinds my gears.
But once again, here we go -- the illegal Hispanics ruined the neighbourhood. Ghettoization happens all the time (ever been to Memphis?). It is very unfortunate that the perpetrators were illegal to this country, but it's impossible to produce them as the standard under which all illegals operate.
Ooooh, karen. Are you sure you're a Jersey native???
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I know many, many Asian, southeast Asian, middle eastern and European families here who have not assimilated, because it's damned difficult. Yep, their kids have - but they had the benefit of being raised, and sometimes even born, in the US. That's a huge jumpstart to "cultural assimilation" (that is a truly scary term, btw) and to knocking down language barriers. Again, if you want to be surrounded by people speaking only English, then go to KFC, not White Castle, okay?
So then how useful is a small car for our lives? I also have a 1983 AMC Eagle that gets 33 mpg city. I use it when I can.
I agree with your observations, jabogitlu. Are you actually 80 yrs. old?
