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I am with you 100%. We live our lives at eye level for the most part, so any historic streetscapes we can preserve is a good thing. I am glad to hear that not only is extra retail being added, but multi tiered at that. I have noticed that Toronto's restaurant and bar options are getting better and better every visit, and this will help to continue that much needed trend.
Well i'm glad you are noticing that and I think you are right and it'll only continue naturally as more and more people of all persuasions join us
From the footage I have seen of this "event", Doug Ford is more than a little accurate. If the goal of the Pride Parade is to garner more acceptance for homosexuals, they are completely going about it the wrong way. I know gays that would prefer if it were cancelled, as they feel the antics of the more flamboyant members of their community reinforce negative stereotypes rather than promoting positive ones.
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Uggh - you used the word 'homosexuals' to describe our community - that is soooo redneck!
The pride week event is a time for us to shake our booty, celebrate and have fun and be proud of who and what we are.... As a 'homosexual' - I personally don't need to garner support or acceptance from anyone who feels I need to garner it on that basis, it simply should be awarded by default! I am tolerant and accepting of the straight community by default warts and all, so homosexuality by default is non sequitur and is as legitimate a form of sexuality as heterosexuality!
I feel the need to garner respect from others for my character and how I treat people, not because of what I am in terms of my sexuality or my choice to let loose once a year in pride week festivities... Anyway, if you or others don't want to have fun in the pride week festivities and want to take it all seriously than don't partake. Also if you or others have the need for us to beg for your acceptance because you think it gives us meaning in our lives to know that our straight brethren accept us if only we behave in a conformist manner - than I say balllsss on that!!.. we don't need or want that at all... I ain't gonna be a prunish ninny for you - sorry!
Year after year millions attend Pride and in 2014 Toronto will host the world pride festivities bringing in over 1.5 million visitors and pumping hundreds of millions of dollars into the local economy, supporting jobs for lots of people across the sexuality spectrum. Other large scale festivals in the world don't need to have a deep and meaningul message for them to be well attended or enjoyed by straight or gays alike - its about having FUNNNNNNNN, letting loose and celebrating being a living, breathing person who is free to enjoy life and not being a stuck up prune in a regressive state......
Toronto is lucky to host such a large scale event like this along with a host of other festivals that are well attended and more than regional in scope reflecting the fact that we are a global city. If you want to generalize all of Toronto's festivals just don't partake, there are plenty of others who do and enjoy them for what they are and those are the individuals we want to attend - people who want to be there and a part of it!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Annuvin
Many cities have a vibe... Chicago has a vibe. Las Vegas has a vibe. Hell, even Detroit has a vibe. However, do any of these compare to the vibe in NYC? Not in the least, I'm afraid.
I'm aware that every city has its own vibe... the point I along with others are making is as Toronto's core becomes more dense with those who choose to live in it - the more vibrant and active the place will become... More people attending events, eating out, going to the theatre, opera, symphony etc which will encourage development of more of these entities - so the place becomes increasingly alive! Toronto is absolutely a standout city for increased densification in the Canadian/American context.... That is what i'm talking about in terms of vibe. More often than not - dense urban centres are at the heart of a more vibrant and exciting 'vibe' than those that are more sparse and run down...
I'm aware that every city has its own vibe... the point I along with others are making is as Toronto's core becomes more dense with those who choose to live in it - the more vibrant and active the place will become... More people attending events, eating out, going to the theatre, opera, symphony etc which will encourage development of more of these entities - so the place becomes increasingly alive! Toronto is absolutely a standout city for increased densification in the Canadian/American context.... That is what i'm talking about in terms of vibe. More often than not - dense urban centres are at the heart of a more vibrant and exciting 'vibe' than those that are more sparse and run down...
Toronto definitely has some vibe, but IMO hardly enough of it given its large population.
The issue I have with downtown Toronto is that it is still too residential. There are not many places where people can go to have fun. Too many streets in the core are nothing but residential - not even mixed use, but 90-95% residential, which is frustrating.
Downtown from Lakeshore to Bloor, from Parliament to Bathurst seems pretty big, but how many of the streets actually have things going on on a regular basis? Let's see...
Bathurst is pretty much a dead street except near King or Queen. It is more like the suburbs than downtown with nothing but two storey houses;
Spadina has residential only between Queen and College. the rest is pretty quiet with few retailers.
John st, hardly much. Many people don't even know its existence believe it or not
University ave - a wide street with zero street life
Bay st - wall of condos. nothing interesting whatseover. cars pass by comfortably though.
Church is only interesting near front and near the Village
Jarvis - like university, a wide boulevard for cars to swoop by
Sherbourne - dead north of Adelaide
Anything else - dead small village like quiet
The east west streets are slightly better, mostly located south of Dundas. To the north of Dundas, hardly anything remotely interesting. And there is hardly anything east of Yonge st except on King east.
And I am appalled by the lack of patio restaurants/cafes in Toronto. Front st E in St Lawrence market seems to be the only street I can think of with multiple restaurants allowing people to eat outside. In a better city, streets like Jarvis and Spadina would be lined with tables and chairs on the sidewalk, we have absolutely nothing.
The vibe? Where is the vibe? People have nowhere to go except Yonge and Queen year after year. Our vibe is more appropriate for a metro of 2-3M, not 6M.
I honestly don't know why downtown Toronto has to be so residential - houses houses house, condos, condos, condos.
The vibe? Where is the vibe? People have nowhere to go except Yonge and Queen year after year. Our vibe is more appropriate for a metro of 2-3M, not 6M.
I honestly don't know why downtown Toronto has to be so residential - houses houses house, condos, condos, condos.
Well on the one hand, thousands of people may theoretically move into the city over the next couple of years due to the condo boom. This should help improve things as people will need places to eat and entertain themselves. Mathematically, there needs to be more amenities for more people to survive. I've personally noticed that Toronto restaurants have improve significantly in the last few years compared to the past. Growing up, the choices were pathetic compared to what you can find today. I would expect even more choices in the future.
On the other hand, more condos could create a more residential feeling which you do not like. For e.g. Vancouver is crawling with condos for a mid-sized city but it's nightlife is weak. I'm sure Montreal has way fewer condos but most would agree that's more lively than Vancouver and Toronto. Another e.g. is that downtown TO had a much more vibrant bar/club scene 10 years ago but most of them were shut down by condo developments. So I guess it all depends who is moving in these new units and what they want to do. If they are skewed towards young people, then I think you'll feel more liveliness on the streets. If they are an older/mature demographic, then you can't expect as much as they will value quieter residential neighborhoods.
Last edited by johnathanc; 02-11-2014 at 08:08 PM..
I am also looking forward to rapidly increasing population to downtown over the next 2-4 years. More and more people desire to live in the core - this is how a well functional city should be.
I am not upset about more residential units, but rather the lack of retail on the residential streets. If you visit Paris or New York, Buenos Aires, or all the lively cities we compare to, most streets are mixed use, with residential units on the higher level and all sorts of bars, restaurants, boutique stores, creating pedestrian footprints all over the city. Yet in Toronto, many pockets of the city are nothing BUT residential (Bathurst and Jarvis are good example, so is Bay st). And this really disappoints me.
St Lawrence Market, King East between Church and Parliament as well as Yorkville are good examples of lively streets. University Ave, Bay st, College st, Queen st east are horrible examples. I live downtown, but too often I can't think of a place to go during the weekends. I can hardly find a place where you can sit with your friends outside sipping coffee enjoying the urbanity of the city.
I agree that restaurant scene is improving. Even an ultra boring Dundas is seeing some new restaurants. And in terms of shopping, we are seriously lacking too. It is Eaton Centre, or Queen West, and they largely overlap - And Yonge north of Dundas is such a disaster. You can hardly compare it with New York or Chicago, or LA. It is more in the league of Washington DC/Boston.
I visit various parts of downtown often and many parts have busy pedestrian traffic/vibrancy at night. The thing you have to take into consideration is that (as you say), you went the week of the biggest holiday of the year, and in the winter.
This year has been a really snowy and cold winter, and also there was a big ice storm that struck hundreds of thousands of people in the Toronto which resulted in power outages for as long as up to a week and a bit for some people. It was a big news story here. These things should have "taken away" some vibrancy in some parts.
But throughout the rest of the year when things are normal and the weather is better, for the most part there is tons of vibrancy which is getting better all the time. Especially west of downtown (King West, Queen West, Kensington, Ossington, Bloor W Village etc.) whenever I visit there I have rarely ever seen it "dead".
There are some new businesses, restaurants etc popping up here and there in the downtown area, but it varies depending where you go.
I definitely need to take into account the season and time of year, and it was considerably better in the Summer, but it still was quite tough finding something great to eat late at night. There are some great places popping up and I have been impressed with the quality of the new restaurants especially, but it still seems like the majority of them shut down pretty early for a city over 6m plus.
And I am appalled by the lack of patio restaurants/cafes in Toronto. Front st E in St Lawrence market seems to be the only street I can think of with multiple restaurants allowing people to eat outside. In a better city, streets like Jarvis and Spadina would be lined with tables and chairs on the sidewalk, we have absolutely nothing.
I agree about the lack of outdoor seating around the city. People underestimate how ****ty Toronto's city council and permitting departments are though. Have you seen the process that restaurants have to go through to secure food and liquor permits for outdoor cafes/restaurants? The neighborhoods that have a strong concentration of outdoor options for drinking and eating are vibrant and fun, so I have no idea why there is such push-back against having outdoor seating throughout much of the city.
In my opinion once you get a liquor and food service license you should also in the same process be granted an outdoor operation permit as well. It is such a no brainer and would liven up the city in a major way.
I visited Montreal quite a few times, and part of the reason the city is a lot more vibrant although with 2/3 the size is that outdoor seating for restaurants is much more popular. In the Latin quarter for example, there are several streets full of chairs and tables with people dining outside, creating a very vibrant urban feel. We don't have anything close to that.
IMO, Montreal has a much better NYC vibe than Toronto, far better. Even in our famous restaurant row on King west, there is hardly any patio seating. Nor does Elm St, which seems a perfect street to have those. Baldwin does have but it is a quite short stretch.
I have no idea why this city wants to be so boring.
Another reason for the lack of urban vibe is the utter absence of any decent size public squares. Manhattan literally has tons of them. We have close to zero - Nathan Philips Square is cold and uninviting with all the concrete and hardly any green or seating. Dundas Square is simply --- commercial. For some reason, Toronto's parks are very uninviting, and fail miserably in attracting people to gather - Queen's Park is another example.
Where in Toronto do we see this kind of vibrancy? Is it so hard to establish some chairs, fountains and some street food to allow people to enjoy the city outside?
I visited Montreal quite a few times, and part of the reason the city is a lot more vibrant although with 2/3 the size is that outdoor seating for restaurants is much more popular. In the Latin quarter for example, there are several streets full of chairs and tables with people dining outside, creating a very vibrant urban feel. We don't have anything close to that.
IMO, Montreal has a much better NYC vibe than Toronto, far better. Even in our famous restaurant row on King west, there is hardly any patio seating. Nor does Elm St, which seems a perfect street to have those. Baldwin does have but it is a quite short stretch.
I have no idea why this city wants to be so boring.
Oooh now you're gonna be in trouble.
But you're in trouble all the time so it doesn't really matter I guess...
But you're in trouble all the time so it doesn't really matter I guess...
LOL. it doesn't.
I mentioned many times that Montreal more strikes people like a big city, with a big city vibe than Toronto. Even as a tourist, St Catherine, St Laurent simply can't be matched by Yonge st and Queen West.
Toronto may look good on paper with all the "festivals", "neighbourhoods" and "diversity", but when you actually live here, you realise that the city doesn't seem to have outgrown its small/medium city mentality. Despite all the highrises burgeoning downtown, most people still prefer the oakville type so-called "quaint town" lifestyle. Outside Yonge st, Queen st and Bloor st, the city IS pretty much a quaint town.
Toronto is so afraid of change that even the possibility of a Loblaw's at College/Spadina scares people who started campaigns in order to stop it. Unfathomable.
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