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Old 07-02-2018, 06:59 PM
 
5,455 posts, read 3,411,327 times
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I didn't realize this is a real problem. I just assumed that people generally follow social etiquette as a guide to appropriate behavior.
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Old 07-02-2018, 07:56 PM
 
13,011 posts, read 13,090,190 times
Reputation: 21914
I got curious and decided to dig up some facts.

Mechaman claims involuntary bump rates in excess of 1%, which would equate to something greater than 1000 people out of every 100,000 passengers.

In fact, the involuntary bump rate is only 6 out of every 100,000 flyers, or 6/1000 of 1%. Mechaman everestimated frequency by a factor of 170x or more.

Thinking about it, 1% simply makes no sense. Two of the most commonly used planes on domestic routes are the 737 and the A330. They carry about 180 and 220 passengers respectively. For the OP to be correct, that means every flight would have two people bumped from them. Considering not all flights are full, it means that you would frequently see 4+ people bumped per flight.

I don’t see anything close to that happening.

As other posters have said, comport yourself like a decent human being, you won6 have a problem.
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Old 07-02-2018, 08:45 PM
 
Location: Niceville, FL
13,258 posts, read 22,911,217 times
Reputation: 16418
Quote:
Originally Posted by hertfordshire View Post
I'd be curious to see if anyone has actually ever seen one of these being used. I haven't.
I've seen them used to help tag which passengers/seats were going to get special meals for meal service on international flights.(There's a sticker that gets placed on the top of the seat so the meal gets correctly matched to the passenger) And have also seen FAs generally messing with them when I've found myself sitting near one of their occupied jump seats.
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Old 07-03-2018, 03:12 AM
 
Location: Tricity, PL
61,972 posts, read 87,635,027 times
Reputation: 132057
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW-type-gal View Post
That isn't true, the steward & gate agent have the passenger list and it has passenger names, flyer status and affiliations on it. Flyer status does carry a slight bit of weight, they will bump a non-member over a member..
Quote:
Originally Posted by hertfordshire View Post
They may have a list, but when they are interacting with you in the cabin, they do not know who you are or what your status is. They deal with too many flights each day to be able to recall from memory that the passenger in 8C is Premier Gold and works for IBM.

I do agree that they will bump a non-member over a member in the case of overbooking, but that's not the flight attendants doing that.
Selection isn't random, and is based on a series of criteria.
According to United Airlines' Contract of Carriage (Delta and American both operate under similar policies) passengers with disabilities and unaccompanied minors are the least likely to be bumped from a flight.

For everyone else, the contract states that the airline made the decision based a passenger's frequent flyer status, the layout of his or her itinerary (whether the passenger has a connecting flight), the fare class of the ticket, and the time he or she checked into the flight.

This means passengers who have more expensive tickets, higher frequent flyer status, and checked in early are less likely to be bumped.

Customers do agree to a Contract of Carriage when they purchase a ticket.
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Old 07-03-2018, 05:04 AM
 
14,994 posts, read 23,952,341 times
Reputation: 26540
Quote:
Originally Posted by kitty61 View Post
I didn't realize this is a real problem. I just assumed that people generally follow social etiquette as a guide to appropriate behavior.
It's not a problem. The OP described a solution to a problem that does not exist and it should generally be ignored (particularly the part about bribing flight attendants).

How this got to 7 pages is quite mysterious but looks like this has branched off into related topics like frequent flyer status, etc.
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Old 07-03-2018, 05:06 AM
 
16,433 posts, read 12,587,152 times
Reputation: 59727
Quote:
Originally Posted by beachmouse View Post
I've seen them used to help tag which passengers/seats were going to get special meals for meal service on international flights.(There's a sticker that gets placed on the top of the seat so the meal gets correctly matched to the passenger) And have also seen FAs generally messing with them when I've found myself sitting near one of their occupied jump seats.
Well United wasn’t using them last spring when I went to Japan. I had no sticker for my gluten free meal. Just a steward walking over with his paper manifest to speak with me and confirm my meals.
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Old 07-03-2018, 11:55 AM
 
47,035 posts, read 26,122,834 times
Reputation: 29512
Quote:
Originally Posted by MechaMan View Post
I tend to err more on the side of caution. Some are saying this is less than 1% of flight experiences. However, in my mind these news events could be the TIP OF THE ICEBERG - In that's the ones that made the news. From my perspective I would be willing to wager this happens MORE OFTEN THAN IS REPORTED. ... Things have definitely gotten worse.
Better, actually. People keep stats on these things. In 2016, there were 0.62 involuntary bumps per 10,000 travelers.

https://www.transportation.gov/sites...march-atcr.pdf

In 2018, we're tracking at 0.12 for the first 3 months.

https://www.transportation.gov/sites...-june-atcr.pdf

Not worse. Also way better than the comparable 2017 timeframe.

Quote:
The guy from the Young Turks documented just a regular ordinary trip he was stuck somewhere for 24 hours no hotel no nothing everything was on his dime when they decided no more planes for the day. I think it was SFO but not sure about a year or two ago.
"when they decided"? Airlines really do not cancel flights on a whim. It messes up a delicate and highly professional planning effort - planes are in the wrong spot, crews are in the wrong spot, it can take days to straighten out. If an entire airport closes down, there's a damn good reason, most likely having to do with safety of passengers and aircraft.

Thing is, if airlines didn't overbook, they'd be flying with empty seats on almost every flight. That is costly and inefficient and would have to be paid for by us, the flying public.
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