anyone have advise to a parent considering homeschooling? (Erick, Howe: public school, university)

[J double R]

Originally Posted by dekes1969

j double r


simple answer i have a master degree and am working on my phd in history but in no way am I qualified to teach art, music, physics, advanced math, etc.... the point being we go to experts for most things in life why is it that people refuse to use experts for education, no one can honestly say that they are expert enough to properly and correctly teach all the required subjects needed for a good education

not even teachers?

I don't see anywhere that the OP claimed to have/not have or had teaching credentials..

For that matter.. There are MANY MANY great teachers in the school system (some of which i was privileged to study under), but nowadays, curriculum and policy is king.. the teacher is merely a paid (albeit UNDERpaid) peon with the skills and education to teach well, and hardly the tools and berth needed to utilize said skills, usually through no fault of their own. I've seen many a great teacher be ostracized, shunned, or outright booted from the system because they refused to conform to the textbook mold in which public K12 systems are these days.

My point is, that though teachers may be experts in their field, the school system is going to be a severe limiting factor in many cases, especially with programs like "no child left behind" (which in my opinion, pushes students ahead of their learning level blindly, instead of properly bringing them up to their peers' level). Thus, calling the education received in the public school system (of course this varies by region) expert, is likely giving said education a little too much credit. Useful, yes. Valuable, absolutely. Expert? not always.

[BigOkie]

Originally Posted by dekes1969

j double r


simple answer i have a master degree and am working on my phd in history but in no way am I qualified to teach art, music, physics, advanced math, etc.... the point being we go to experts for most things in life why is it that people refuse to use experts for education, no one can honestly say that they are expert enough to properly and correctly teach all the required subjects needed for a good education

that's pretty obvious: most of the teachers I had in school were idiots to the nth degree. I probably would have done better being homeschooled but most of my learning came outside the classroom.

Once Oklahoma starts paying teachers what they're worth, then the cream of the crop will stop moving out of the state for better paying jobs.

[karibear]

Originally Posted by dekes1969

j double r


simple answer i have a master degree and am working on my phd in history but in no way am I qualified to teach art, music, physics, advanced math, etc.... the point being we go to experts for most things in life why is it that people refuse to use experts for education, no one can honestly say that they are expert enough to properly and correctly teach all the required subjects needed for a good education

The so-called 'experts' in education aren't necessarily so. School boards and administrators are frequently more involved with politics of one kind or another and jockeying for funding. One high school I worked in hired a teacher to teach Russian, but after that person got tenure, they were assigned to teach American lit, while the Russian class was taught - via videotapes - by an American History teacher. Where's the expertise in that?

[okpondlady]

Anyone that can read a book can teach what they have read. It isn't rocket science, although the Oklahoma Teacher's Union would like you to think it is. I can teach someone to use a recipe, assemble the necessary ingredients and utensils, mix it properly, bake it properly, and set the table nice so we can eat it. Throw in some kitchen safety...we are all good. What is the difference in that and Chemistry? You have ALOT of great resources to teach/learn things than books even though they are a great start. And yes.. I said ALOT...

[HeatherDawn]

Look at you bein' all gutsy and usin' "ALOT" instead of "a lot"...

[karibear]

Originally Posted by HeatherDawn

Look at you bein' all gutsy and usin' "ALOT" instead of "a lot"...

I wasn't going to mention that. Common usage changes so often, I thought maybe I missed it when "a lot" became one word instead of two. *shrug* It is one of the things that makes me cringe, though, just like people who write "ladys" or "lady's" when they mean "ladies."

[okpondlady]

Originally Posted by HeatherDawn

Look at you bein' all gutsy and usin' "ALOT" instead of "a lot"...

You know how there are some people that get a thrill from being "different"? There are a couple of things I like to do. I like to say ALOT and I sometimes I even cuss a bit and say AIN'T.
I am 42 and still get a dig or two in at my mother when I say ALOT and AIN'T. She just shivers like someone scratched the chalk board.

[karibear]

Originally Posted by okpondlady

You know how there are some people that get a thrill from being "different"? There are a couple of things I like to do. I like to say ALOT and I sometimes I even cuss a bit and say AIN'T.
I am 42 and still get a dig or two in at my mother when I say ALOT and AIN'T. She just shivers like someone scratched the chalk board.

It's not the SAYING, it's the SPELLING. I've got 20 years on you and I say 'ain't' also - but it's not so much slang anymore, it's in the dictionary now. Has been for a long time... that was one of my mother's blackest days, I think, finding out that all of a sudden one day it was acceptable English. But no matter how you say it, and I do say it a lot, "A LOT" is still two words -"A LOT"

The change in usage that boggled me the most was around 1990, when 'said' was expanded/replaced, to include 'all' 'like' and 'go' - as in "He's all 'Let's go to the beach,' and she goes 'When?' and I'm like 'Why not today?'"

[momof4kidlets]

Originally Posted by dekes1969

my take on homeschooling


do you go to a mechanic to get braces for your childs teeth ?? no you go to the orthodontist

do you go to to the hardware store clerk for drawing up your will to protect you childs future ? you go to your attorney

do you see the dairy farmer if you child has the flu ? you visit your doctor

do you have your child go to the hair stylist when he/she needs to get medications filled ? no you visit the pharmacist

do you let the sanitation engineer protect/rid your streets of crime to keep your children safe ? no we have law enforcement

do you let a chef build/design the bridges/roads you child drives/rides on ? no you have a civil engineer do it

bottom line is when you need to do something you go to the best licensed/ certified/trained professional in that field.... would not do the same thing when it comes to educating your child ????

Although the original question was posted here quite a while ago, I feel compelled to chime in. I'll let a couple "licensed/certified/trained professional(s)" answer your question:

"Dr. Sam Peavey, professor emeritus of the School of Education at the University of Louisville, earned advance education degrees from Harvard (Master of Arts) and Columbia (Doctor of Education) and was involved in the preparation of thousands of prospective teachers for state certification. He has served on numerous committees and commissions dealing with the accreditation of schools and colleges. On September 30, 1988, Dr. Peavey testified before the Compulsory Education Study Committee of the Iowa Legislature on the subject of teacher qualifications, citing numerous studies. He stated:

May I say that I have spent a long career in developing and administering programs for teacher certification. I wish I could tell you that those thousands of certificates contributed significantly to the quality of children’s learning, but I cannot.... After fifty years of research, we have found no significant correlation between the requirements for teacher certification and the quality of student achievement.

Later in his testimony, Dr. Peavey explained that he has found only one valid way of identifying a good teacher:

However, in spite of years of frustration, I am pleased to report to you there has been discovered one valid, legal, honest, professional, common sense way to identify a good teacher. As far as I know there is only one way, and it is about time for legislators to recognize it and write it into school law. It involves a simple process. Step one is to stop looking at the teachers and start looking at the students. Step two is to determine how well students are learning what they are supposed to be learning. The quality of learning provides the only valid measure of the quality of teaching we have yet discovered [emphasis added].

Dr. Peavey concluded his testimony with practical examples of excellent student achievement results by students who were being taught by their parents, most without degrees or certificates. He explained that many studies demonstrate that homeschooled children “commonly score a year or more above their peers in regular schools on standard measures of achievement."

Another expert, Dr, Donald Ericksen, professor of education for the University of California at Los Angeles, stated in a recent interview:

Some of the worst teachers I’ve ever seen are highly certified. Look at our public schools. They’re full of certified teachers. What kind of magic is that accomplishing? But I can take you to the best teachers I’ve ever seen, and most of them are uncertified.... We don’t have evidence at all that what we do in schools of education makes much difference in teacher competence [emphasis added]."


The above referenced material (in bold type) is quoted from The Myth of Teacher Qualifications written by Chris Klicka, Senior Counsel for Home School Legal Defense Association. Read more here http://www.hslda.org/docs/nche/000002/00000214.asp

“Some of the worst teachers I’ve ever seen are highly certified. Look at our public schools. They’re full of certified teachers. What kind of magic is that accomplishing? But I can take you to the best teachers I’ve ever seen, and most of them are uncertified.... We don’t have evidence at all that what we do in schools of education makes much difference in teacher competence.”
—Dr. Donald Ericksen, UCLA --“The ABC’s of Reform: Give Parents a Choice,” Insight, 24 September 1990, 13.

[gea12345]

Originally Posted by msmason8

I have a 11 year old girl that is bright and has always been in gifted and talented classes. Now she is consumed by her friends, boys, and makeup. I am seriously considering pulling her out of public school and home schooling her. Any suggestions?
Thanks
Mom Mason

She sounds absolutely normal to me. Leave her alone. Celebrate her social skills. They are 70 percent of holding down a job! or getting ahead!

If you really feel driven to exploit her talents send her off to camp to meet special friends. I went to an arts camp, and I loved it!!

Many gifted, talented people are insular, which may be great for thinking creatively, but can lead to depression.

So, celebrate her ability to be generous, support her friends, and ability to exude confidence, despite the competition!

Or if you are really desperate, take her abroad for 2 weeks and get to know each other and learn about the world.

Or do an exploratory ship cruise where you learn about sea animals, waste and bacterai and hot springs, and sedimentation.

This means taking 2 weeks off from your busy life to enjoy the bigger world.

These kind of experiences will change her and set her apart from the normal routine of life.

good luck!

p.s. but let her learn, and don't lead her about by the nose. People learn better when they trip over things, then dragged to things. Or when they find things on their own!