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Old 04-03-2020, 09:46 PM
 
Location: Northern Maine
5,466 posts, read 3,065,768 times
Reputation: 8011

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Quote:
Originally Posted by iLoveFashion View Post
If more dense housing is supposed to be built to lower prices than why are builders only building for the higher up folks?


I figured this would be mainly a NYC thing but it’s a trend across the nation.
They're the only fools who are buying MacMansions.
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Old 04-03-2020, 10:51 PM
 
Location: Taos NM
5,362 posts, read 5,136,516 times
Reputation: 6786
Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA101 View Post
New housing is always, throughout history, for upper income folks. Then the older housing filters down to lower income folks. This is how it has always worked. The new housing makes overall housing more affordable by adding to the supply and decreasing demand on the existing housing.

You're seriously asking why a brand new 50-floor tower in Manhattan isn't built for the poor?
I don't get why people don't understand this: housing depreciates its way down the income ladder. As my apartment wears out, it makes more sense to not replace everything and just charge a lower rate. It's just like how they don't build $6000 starter cars. It takes X amount of dollars to build a decent new housing unit and it is going to depreciate in value to a point where renovation costs more than just dropping rent / sale prices. If things are built affordably (cheaply) to begin with, they'll quickly depreciate to the point where they'll have to be torn down, which is more environmentally and economically taxing than just building something with quality, or in some people dictionary, luxurious, the first time.
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Old 04-03-2020, 10:58 PM
 
Location: Beautiful and sanitary DC
2,504 posts, read 3,544,526 times
Reputation: 3280
Houses are expensive to build. Just the bricks and mortar cost a few hundred thousand dollars, even for detached houses in the South... high-rises in Manhattan or Brooklyn often cost $1M per apartment just in "hard costs" (i.e., what the general contractor gets paid).

Then you add the costs of architects and lawyers and bank loans (another 20-30%), then the cost of land (varies), then the payouts to investors for their money, and building permit fees and whatever else local government demands, and all of that's if any construction is allowed at all!

And meanwhile, there ISN'T much new housing being built, in the grand scheme of things. The US averaged about one million housing starts a year in the 2010s. That's half as many as in the 1970s... for a population that's 50% bigger! That means the rate of housing construction per capita has fallen by two-thirds since the 1970s. More people are bidding for fewer new homes.
The Major Challenge of Inadequate US Housing Supply - Freddie Mac
A Decade of Home Building: The Long Recovery of the 2010s | Eye On Housing

Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA101 View Post
New housing is always, throughout history, for upper income folks.
^ Just in general, shiny and new things are always expensive. Only 1% of Americans moves into a newly built house every year. Of course those new houses are scarce and special.
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Old 04-04-2020, 05:40 AM
 
Location: Colorado
143 posts, read 177,992 times
Reputation: 369
Default ZPG would help

Quote:
Originally Posted by iLoveFashion View Post
Is there a method to lowering prices that you believe in?
I believe in zero population growth and a steady-state economy (for many reasons besides housing costs).

Supply vs. demand drives all sorts of resource price increases but many shortsighted, money-minded people want to keep profiting from growth, even though it's really depletion.

https://www.google.com/search?&q=zer...+state+economy
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Old 04-04-2020, 06:22 AM
 
18,549 posts, read 15,590,462 times
Reputation: 16235
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLoveFashion View Post
If more dense housing is supposed to be built to lower prices than why are builders only building for the higher up folks?


I figured this would be mainly a NYC thing but it’s a trend across the nation.
The problem is that fixed costs make up such a large percentage of construction costs that low cost construction is not profitable any more.

(Land, utility hookups, regulatory and legal, etc.)
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Old 04-04-2020, 08:16 AM
 
Location: annandale, va & slidell, la
9,267 posts, read 5,121,245 times
Reputation: 8471
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLoveFashion View Post
If more dense housing is supposed to be built to lower prices than why are builders only building for the higher up folks?


I figured this would be mainly a NYC thing but it’s a trend across the nation.
Who do you want to pay for these homes? I would guess the ones with available funds and the ability to repay a mortgage.
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Old 04-04-2020, 01:53 PM
 
Location: Holly Neighborhood, Austin, Texas
3,981 posts, read 6,737,895 times
Reputation: 2882
The OP should be looking to buy in the green and yellow states:


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Old 04-04-2020, 03:27 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
142 posts, read 86,446 times
Reputation: 85
The realities of the last few decades. Are more homes built less affordable to lower incomes today ? Yes. But in early 20th century of massive growing cities like in the North. There were no old-stock homes in large numbers. Builders had to and did build cheaper housing then. Still in colder weather cities. Building codes arrose and needing to endure more the climate demanded.

You take a city as Philly. Its kinda motto was all could own a rowhome there. The mill worker to the banker. With more craftsmanship to weathier builds and many times more green-space. Other cities not quite the same motto. But clearly had homes built for its modest common working-classes too as new-builds. Just a Chicago to a LA. Did not adhear to attached housing in the large degrees as some Eastern cities. Nor mass multi-residential builds as tenement-styles of NYC. Most were not restricted by being a island either.

But clearly affordable housing did get built and endured many decades thru to today. Also the steady rising of a Middle-Class. Made increasing wealth add to booming cities housing that isn't just poor-grade homes then getting built then by the 1920s thru the 20th century. Well built single-homes still stood the test and interior upgrades and necessary exterior care. Kept them valued today as not merely housing for a poorer classes today. But still pricey upgrades get done to them.

Heck why we had this resurgence in our inner-cities by young professionals for older urban bones areas, especially in and near the city's core. But to build for a increasingly poorer working-class of needing assistance, more and more insurance cost, higher education, cost of needing a vehicle and spending of a material-based economy and adding less frugality of other generations in lifestyles. Altered living modestly. add TV over once free radio and cheap movies to see, internet, phone and other streaming cost taking much more ones income. We have different realities.

Few affordable housing gets built without subsidies today by builders and also to those living in these so-called lower-income new-builds. Then add a lack of having skills to do ones own work in repairs and upkeep and less desire to maintain it by letting enjoyment take presidence. Add profits and construction cost. We have more new-builds needing a higher-income, to much more of a two incomes a must. Leads us to today.

This is more a North American perspective.
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Old 04-04-2020, 03:46 PM
 
Location: Saint John, IN
11,582 posts, read 6,738,871 times
Reputation: 14786
It's not the case everywhere!

Where I live cost of living is a lot cheaper than living in neighboring Illinois. Most people drive to Chicago (about an hour away) to make a great living, but live here because taxes and housing is cheaper.
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Old 04-04-2020, 04:40 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn, NY
700 posts, read 422,416 times
Reputation: 491
Quote:
Originally Posted by verybadgnome View Post
The OP should be looking to buy in the green and yellow states:

I would never live in any of these states overall. I’m pretty sure the ATL and Charleston, SC metros are also not yellow or green when you separate them from their respective state. With that being said I would never live anywhere in GA outside of ATL and anywhere in SC outside of Charleston.


I’m also extremely surprised Texas (a state I’ve considered) is more on the higher end.
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