[Djuna]

VHFA still have loans available. We have recently bought a house with no deposit. We do have a good income and credit, but it annoys me when people continue saying Vermont is completely unaffordable. Our mortgage is less than out rent was. It isn't in Chittenden County but still, I work in Burlington and the commute isn't that bad.

[68vette]

Originally Posted by Djuna

VHFA still have loans available. We have recently bought a house with no deposit. We do have a good income and credit, but it annoys me when people continue saying Vermont is completely unaffordable. Our mortgage is less than out rent was. It isn't in Chittenden County but still, I work in Burlington and the commute isn't that bad.

I'm not saying that Vermont is completely unaffordable. For slightly less than 50% of the states population, Vermont can be lived in without putting most of your paycheck into rent or a mortgage. The point VHFA, the state of Vermont and various other agencies are pointing out is, Vermont is no longer an affordable place to live. Not Chittenden county, but the state of Vermont. Less than 50% of the population is able to make ends meet. This is a horrible number. You can go back a decade and a half and without a doubt, Vermont was most likely one of the most affordable places in the country.
Mortgages for the most part will be less than rent, but you need to tack on taxes, insurance, maintenance and for some, utilities or heat.
Housing costs are the number one reason Vermonts homeless population is getting out of control. This is the recent data that was released on the "housing wage" for each county in the NEK or Northern Vermont. Lamoille $15.33, Orleans $12.21, Essex $14.79, Caledonia $13.67 and Washington $16.15. This is what a person needs to earn in order to pay less than the 30% for housing. Looking at most of these hourly incomes, it looks like anyone could afford to live on a low income, but 7 of the ten jobs that employ most people in Vermont pay less than the hourly wage for each of these counties. It is great that people can get assistance with heat and utilities, but if incomes and housing were more realistic we wouldn't need this added expense in our economy. The sad thing is the state knows what the issues are, but they do nothing to fix or correct the problems. Housing can play a key role in creating a sustainable economy in Vermont.
There is clearly a need for new housing construction to meet the modest
growth expected in the coming years for Vermont. That being said, the state
needs to learn its lessons from the run up in homeownership prices preceding
the recession and from the growing numbers of cost burdened households
to ensure that the market is balanced and creates all kinds of housing. Local
market conditions vary dramatically around the state and should be a driving
factor in creating new units.
Housing construction is a great economic engine with a high multiplier effect.
For example, building 25 modest single family homes in Vermont in 2005 created $6.3 million in additional income for Vermont businesses and
61 Vermont jobs, paying just more than $2 million in wages. Similarly, every
dollar spent building apartments is likely to create at least another $1.10 in
total economic activity across the state. The state needs to revise Act 250 or this could be just the begining of a huge downturn in the state. As mentioned, the state knows this, I'm not pulling this out of a hat and saying I know the solution. Vermont did it's homework, but what is being done now? Nothing!

[Logs and Dogs]

Good old Act 250……….here’s my personal experience with it………….

I do some number crunching on the side for a group of friends who invest in commercial & residential real estate and occasionally I get involved with the rehab by doing some work. A year or so ago we looked at the feasibility of two projects to answer the “affordable housing” need in the NEK. One was a small housing development with detached single family houses and the second was an apartment building in one of the more “urban” areas.

After all was said and done, all the screw job development taxes, permitting etc. and with the inclusion of every government program we could include (energy related, affordable housing related etc.) we couldn’t rent let alone sell these projects for our costs. The income level in the area wouldn’t support the $800-1000/mo we would need for rent or the $150-180K the single family houses would require. The risk of sitting on a money pit was way too great.

VT is a classic example of a state talking out of both sides of their mouth.

[arctichomesteader]

I think everyone here could figure out what the main problem is behind the lack of jobs and price of housing if they wanted to admit it, but a large percentage won't. It's pure politics and we all know what kind...but the state may well go bankrupt and die off before everyone wakes up.

[Logs and Dogs]

Originally Posted by arctichomesteader

I think everyone here could figure out what the main problem is behind the lack of jobs and price of housing if they wanted to admit it, but a large percentage won't. It's pure politics and we all know what kind...but the state may well go bankrupt and die off before everyone wakes up.

At the high level I agree with you on this one…………

Unfortunately the politicians like the ones responsible for the current situation and past 25+ years are like locusts………the will just find another host state when they suck up all the resources and political capital etc. from VT.

[j_jimerino]

Vermont never paid high wages...but it used to at least be a cheap place to live so it didn't matter so much.

[Anon_vt1]

Originally Posted by Djuna

VHFA still have loans available. We have recently bought a house with no deposit. We do have a good income and credit, but it annoys me when people continue saying Vermont is completely unaffordable. Our mortgage is less than out rent was. It isn't in Chittenden County but still, I work in Burlington and the commute isn't that bad.

What condition is your house in? Most people look at the cost of the mortgage and say - "hey, this is less than renting, so I'm good". However, maintenance is a phantom cost that most professionsals factor in and most homeowners do not.

Add 2-5% of your purchase price per year for maintenance or 10% if it's in need of extensive repair and tell me what your numbers look like. Also, add on your hourly earning rate or Federal mileage rates for your commute. That's a real housing cost, too. I think you'll find you've either just matched or exceeded rent.

We had a house outside of Chittenden County that was "affordable" and the commute "wasn't bad". Our mortgage with taxes hovered around $700 per month (15 year mortgage). However, we spent so much on deferred mainentance that over 7 years, the actual monthly cost was $1100.

That does not include the time we'll never get back from working on the house and commuting and higher commuting costs.

The reality is for the same money elsewhere you could have gotten either a larger home, less commute, or much better condition.

[Anon_vt1]

Originally Posted by 68vette

.... Vermont was most likely one of the most affordable places in the country.
Mortgages for the most part will be less than rent, but you need to tack on taxes, insurance, maintenance and for some, utilities or heat.
Housing costs are the number one reason Vermonts homeless population is getting out of control. ..... The state needs to revise Act 250 or this could be just the begining of a huge downturn in the state. As mentioned, the state knows this, I'm not pulling this out of a hat and saying I know the solution. Vermont did it's homework, but what is being done now? Nothing!

Vermont was a very affordable place. My father bought a mobile home and then a brand new single family home in the early 70's. He describes the experience as "easy" and it cost him $28K.

Even as late as 2000, it was possible to buy a house for $55K in Lamoille County. It was in need of extensive work but I actually saw it and thought about buying it.

And now? You can't even get a mobile home on owned land for that inflation adjusted pricing. Many VT homeowners could not afford to rebuy their homes today.

And yes, the one the reasons we are leaving is that Act 250 reform is not even on the radar screen. I'm including here the more conservative political bodies who would be more naturally open to such arguments. The current campaign is all about jobs while still preserving the environment. Lofty goals, but I personally believe that the state can't do much directly about job creation. The state, might, however, create an environment that significantly reduces building costs.

[j_jimerino]

I had a plan when I was first house shopping to buy a mobile home for $30-40K, pay it off fast and then resell it for use as a down payment on a house. I scraped the plan when I found out that mobile homes hadn't cost that little in years. This was years ago and a mobile home with land in this area started at $150K. The ones in the parks are less I think, but in addition to not wanting to live there the cost was still to high.