Is virginia southern?

[Blimp]

Having lived in different parts of Virginia for nearly 30 years (but not anymore) I can say that Virginia is unquestionably a "border state" and a Mid-Atlantic state. It's not quite Southern, but it's a little more Southern than it is Northern.

Virginia Beach, Charlottesville, and Northern Virginia are not Southern at all. The first is distinctly "Coastal" in culture, and the other two are very much Mid-Atlantic but leaning more Northern than Southern.

Richmond is increasingly a progressive city, but nearly as much as progressive Atlanta, remains Southern in identity. Winchester is hardly progressive at all, but only about 1% more Southern than Charlottesville.

The rural and suburban parts of the state that are not near Virginia Beach or Northern Virginia are pretty darned Southern. The exception may be Roanoke and the Southwest, which is more (Northern / West Virginian) Appalachian than Southern.

[JayJayCB]

Originally Posted by Blimp

Having lived in different parts of Virginia for nearly 30 years (but not anymore) I can say that Virginia is unquestionably a "border state" and a Mid-Atlantic state. It's not quite Southern, but it's a little more Southern than it is Northern.

Virginia Beach, Charlottesville, and Northern Virginia are not Southern at all. The first is distinctly "Coastal" in culture, and the other two are very much Mid-Atlantic but leaning more Northern than Southern.

Richmond is increasingly a progressive city, but nearly as much as progressive Atlanta, remains Southern in identity. Winchester is hardly progressive at all, but only about 1% more Southern than Charlottesville.

The rural and suburban parts of the state that are not near Virginia Beach or Northern Virginia are pretty darned Southern. The exception may be Roanoke and the Southwest, which is more (Northern / West Virginian) Appalachian than Southern.

What would you say about North Carolina? Just out of curiosity.

[Blimp]

Originally Posted by JayJayCB

What would you say about North Carolina? Just out of curiosity.

I haven't been to NC as much and never lived there even for a day, but my impression of North Carolina is that everything is just a bit more Southern than its Virginia counterpart. Durham-Chapel Hill is slightly more Southern than Charlottesville. Charlotte, slightly more Southern than Richmond. And the beach areas like Wilmington are a bit more Southern than Virginia Beach. Additionally, North Carolina is definitely a lot more into NASCAR than Virginia is, a taste which I associate to some degree with "Southernness". At the same time, it's not much into college football and much more into college basketball, something I associate as relatively un-Southern.

My overall impression is that Virginia is a 5 on a Southern scale of 1 to 10, while North Carolina is a 6+ and South Carolina is a 9.

[JayJayCB]

Originally Posted by Blimp

I haven't been to NC as much and never lived there even for a day, but my impression of North Carolina is that everything is just a bit more Southern than its Virginia counterpart. Durham-Chapel Hill is slightly more Southern than Charlottesville. Charlotte, slightly more Southern than Richmond. And the beach areas like Wilmington are a bit more Southern than Virginia Beach. Additionally, North Carolina is definitely a lot more into NASCAR than Virginia is, a taste which I associate to some degree with "Southernness". At the same time, it's not much into college football and much more into college basketball, something I associate as relatively un-Southern.

My overall impression is that Virginia is a 5 on a Southern scale of 1 to 10, while North Carolina is a 6+ and South Carolina is a 9.

College basketball is more of an Upper South thing (i.e. North Carolina, Kentucky, Virginia) while college football is king in the Deep South (i.e. Alabama, Georgia, Mississippi). Around Raleigh/Durham, college basketball is obviously huge but not so much NASCAR. I'm from Raleigh, but I can honestly say I didn't know anyone big into NASCAR growing up. I'm sure it's a different story in Charlotte, though. North Carolina is known as the "birthplace of NASCAR" after all.

I'd say you're pretty accurate, yes. Virginia and North Carolina are similar states, but North Carolina feels more southern to me. Just drive from Raleigh to Greensboro and compare it with driving from Richmond to Charlottesville or maybe Norfolk. You'll notice, just by looking at the billboards and your surroundings, that North Carolina is just a little more southern. In a very general way, North Carolina is becoming more suburban as transplants continue to flood the state, but head into rural areas away from the major metros and it'll be very southern (especially Eastern NC). Some areas like the Research Triangle are probably more similar to the Virginia major metros, though. I always thought Raleigh/Durham, Richmond, and the outer Northern Virginia suburbs felt similar. However, I'd still say Raleigh/Durham feels more southern than any Virginia metro despite all the transplants.

Virginia is basically a transition zone between the South and Mid-Atlantic, while North Carolina is more so comfortably in the South. Some people will say "Oh, Raleigh isn't the South anymore" but I think Raleigh is comfortably in the South, as thing start to get iffy north of Richmond (probably 3 hours from Raleigh).

[Blimp]

Originally Posted by virginia33

Take Charlottesville, for example. Why would a place that doesn't consider itself Southern be referred to as Southern by magazines, historians, restaurants and music venues?

Wayside Chicken - Breakfast, Takeout, Dine In and Catering; Ole Virginia Fried Chicken, Fried Chicken,UVA, Jefferson Park Avenue - "Wayside Takeout & Catering, featuring Ole Virginia Fried Chicken...Listed in Southern Living’s
“Best of the South”..."

http://www.virginianrestaurant.com/thevirginian/ - "The Virginian Restaurant is lauded as “one of the south’s most famous eateries” in Coy Barefoot’s book, The Corner..." Coy Barefoot is a local historian.

The Southern Cafe & Music Hall :: Home - Small music venue

C-VILLE Weekly - Charlottesville News and ArtsC-VILLE Weekly - About Bluegrass Grill and Bakery, a good ol' Southern breakfast joint. (End edit)

Long time Charlottesvillian and current New Yorker here.

I've eaten at all four of those restaurants (or taken out in the case of Wayside), and they are delicious. They are not, however, indicative of local recipes, cuisine, or culture.

They are each purposely a lot more Southern than Charlottesville is ("The Southern" being an exception, as it's just a meaningless name for a very Mid-Atlantic feeling venue that is little changed from "The Gravity Lounge" before it) so that transplants from the true South or people who are just hankering for real Southern food will come on by since they can't get anything resembling Southern food at about 90% of eating establishments in Charlottesville.

It's much the same in New York City, where some of the best Southern food I have ever eaten is in the East Village.

Another local example of "what's in a name, not much" is Shenandoah Joe, the most popular coffee in Charlottesville. It's named 'Shenandoah' and yet no one would claim C-ville is actually in the Shenandoah Valley.

[Babe_Ruth]

Originally Posted by Blimp

I can say that Virginia is unquestionably a "border state'...

Yeah, you can say that.. but it's neither geographically, or historically, accurate.

Maryland, Delaware, Missouri, and Kentucky are the Border States. Virginia was/is Old South. peace.