Virginia Professional Sports Teams????

[tantan1968]

Originally Posted by Babe_Ruth

After the Flames left Atlanta, the Caps were really representing all of the Southeast thru the 80s. There were no NHL teams in Florida yet (Panthers & Lightning came in early 90s), and no Carolina Hurricanes yet either.. There was a weak effort to bring the NHL to Hampton Roads years ago (proposed Hampton Roads Rhinos ) but..

I remember that failed attempt to bring the NHL to Hampton Roads. As I can recall ESPN had reported at the time that the three big things that went against Hampton Roads was lack of venue and the other two reasons had to do with local television. In that case at the time the Hampton Roads TV market was not only considered "too small" but also the market wasn't a metered one either meaning whenever Nielsen talks about those important overnight ratings they didn't at the time include Hampton Roads or Richmond either for that matter. Now today in 2016 both markets are indeed metered. Looking back I am not sure how Richmond became such a market but it was WGNT channel 27 that did it for Hampton Roads and oddly enough not channels 3, 10, 13, 33 and channel 43. Of course at the time I believe channel 27 was owned by Paramount/CBS which I am sure had played a BIG role in this. Similar to Raleigh-Durham, for years in their case I had been told it was WTVD channel 11 that made that happen of course it should be noted that WTVD was and still is owned by ABC/Disney and like Paramount/CBS they sure had that power to get Nielsen to make their markets metered.

OK today in 2016...A new arena is planned to be built in Virginia Beach ( if it does get built that takes care of the lack of venue issue for at least the NBA or NHL anyway ) and Hampton Roads is now a metered Nielsen market and being "too small" a market I would imagine an argument could be made about Jacksonville, Memphis, Oklahoma City, New Orleans and Buffalo having teams when they are actually smaller than the Hampton Roads TV market. It should be interesting "if" the arena does indeed get built would Virginia Beach get an NHL or NBA team and if that does happen would folks in other parts of Virginia excluding NOVA would even care at all.

[OutOfPlaceInDC]

Keep in mind that an NBA or even MLB franchise is easier to maintain than NFL. I have no idea why Jacksonville has an NFL team, but I'm assuming it has to do with someone that has more money than sense. Additionally, NO and Buffalo both had established franchises back when they were actual major cities rather than shells of their former self.

[Pyroninja42]

The arena's already been approved and they're going to break ground this year.

Virginia Beach City Council approves arena deal | Local Government | pilotonline.com

[slim04]

Originally Posted by OutOfPlaceInDC

Keep in mind that an NBA or even MLB franchise is easier to maintain than NFL. I have no idea why Jacksonville has an NFL team, but I'm assuming it has to do with someone that has more money than sense. Additionally, NO and Buffalo both had established franchises back when they were actual major cities rather than shells of their former self.

That isn't true at all.

NFL teams can survive with a small fanbase. They only need to fill a 65,000 seat stadium for 10 games (including preseason), and can mostly do it through season ticketholders. The value of the TV market isn't important because the TV rights are all nationalized and shared throughout the league. That's why you can have a NFL team in a tiny city like Green Bay. Or why small college towns like Knoxville or State College can fill up 90,000 seat stadiums easily. A NFL season ticket can be less than $500 per ticket, so a lot more people can afford it. But there is much more demand for NFL teams, so the NFL can be picky.

The NBA has about 46 games (including preseason) with a 20,000 seat arena. The MLB teams have 81 games with 40,000 seat stadiums. They can't fill out their stadiums with season ticket holders, because not enough people have the time to commit to that much sports. Also, NBA teams and MLB teams derive a lot of local TV revenue that they don't share. So the media market has to be attractive (i.e. lots of eyeballs).

[Babe_Ruth]

Originally Posted by tantan1968

I remember that failed attempt to bring the NHL to Hampton Roads. As I can recall ESPN had reported at the time that the three big things that went against Hampton Roads was lack of venue and the other two reasons with local television.. in 2016 A new arena is planned to be built in Virginia Beach..

Tantan, Yeah, and I thought a lame aspect of the failed NHL bid was the name Rhinos.. It had no regional connection, but was chosen for it's aliteration: Roads Rhinos. The whole effort seemed like a non-starter..
The new venue's a good step forward, but HR (unfortunately) is not an instinctive hockey market. I noticed when the Admirals were chasing down their Calder Cup a few seasons back, Scope was still half-empty. Not a good sign for a next level hockey market. HR (to me) is a typical, traditional SouthEastern sports market.. football & basketball. The Virginia Destroyers seemed to be popular when they were playing UFL football in VB. (remember them ?)

I know suburban DC/NoVA supports the Caps, but around Hampton Roads seems like most (but not all) of the hockey fans are military transplants.. (You'll see guys from Michigan & New England rocking Wings & Bruins gear etc) I would love to see an NHL team in Va Beach, but think the NBA will ultimately be a more realistic pursuit (if any) ? peace.

[OutOfPlaceInDC]

Originally Posted by slim04

That isn't true at all.

NFL teams can survive with a small fanbase. They only need to fill a 65,000 seat stadium for 10 games (including preseason), and can mostly do it through season ticketholders. The value of the TV market isn't important because the TV rights are all nationalized and shared throughout the league. That's why you can have a NFL team in a tiny city like Green Bay. Or why small college towns like Knoxville or State College can fill up 90,000 seat stadiums easily. A NFL season ticket can be less than $500 per ticket, so a lot more people can afford it. But there is much more demand for NFL teams, so the NFL can be picky.

The NBA has about 46 games (including preseason) with a 20,000 seat arena. The MLB teams have 81 games with 40,000 seat stadiums. They can't fill out their stadiums with season ticket holders, because not enough people have the time to commit to that much sports. Also, NBA teams and MLB teams derive a lot of local TV revenue that they don't share. So the media market has to be attractive (i.e. lots of eyeballs).

Greenbay is the only public NFL team there is, people own shares in it and it existed long before other major franchises. It's about the worst example you can cite because of how unique the situation is. Also, it's not about filling up a 65K stadium in a similar fashion as filling up a standard college stadium, it's about filling it up with enough high dollar payers to either finance the team, stadium or (hopefully) both. OFten times the poor taxpayers get stuck with a bill for the stadium which never makes a return and then the owner(s) can use all of that money on high dollar draft picks.

[jeff22152]

Originally Posted by Jayy24

Recently, the NFL just relocated the St. Louis Rams back to Los Angeles, where they originally started. I understand that this is where the rams began. But to me, this was a slap in the face to the loyal St. Louis fans. California already has 3 Pro Football teams(chargers, niners, raiders), 4 pro basketball teams (lakers,clippers,kings, warriors) and 4 Pro Baseball teams(dodgers, angels, athletics, giants). I understand it might be a money situation and a bigger city/population, but why take away from a city that only had one NFL team to give to a state that already has 3? Or why not go to a state that has no professional sport teams like Virginia? People claim the Redskins are Virginia's team which is weird. Yes they train in Virginia, but their home stadium is in Landover, Maryland. Maryland also has another stadium that homes the Baltimore Ravens. So size of the state isn't a problem. Also, the Redskins are known as the Washington Redskins. How do they represent Virginia? They train in Virginia, have their games broadcasted locally in Virginia, but play home games in Maryland, while using the Washington D.C. Name. I know this is a pretty long thread, but I would like some good responses to help fulfill my curiosity. The only thing that comes to mind is population. What do you guys think?

I, for one, am glad that I live in a state that currently does not have to worry about forking over hundreds of millions of dollars every few years in order to sustain the empty prestige of hosting a major league franchise and keeping it happy. Virginia has enough historical, cultural, economic, and military assets to place it on the map, so to speak. As for the Redskins, they're headquartered here and they train here; that's enough. I'm not in favor of trying to facilitate the construction of a new stadium here because I believe the financial drawbacks will ultimately outweigh any perceived benefits.