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Is it for all those accused of violent crimes? Or just those that have a high potential of being dangerous, say those accused of being a serial killer. Norway is not known for being harsh to the accused or those convicted, but this guy didn't get bail:
Those who are accused of violent crimes and are deemed a threat to the public. I realize the justice system needs some flexibility, but enough innocent people have had their lives ruined or at least seriously derailed and this is only going to make it worse. I don't care if it's only one person who's impacted. One person too many.
I don't know about Norway's constitution or legal system so I can't really comment on it. All I can say is that anyone accused of a crime should be given the opportunity to post bail. Innocent until proven guilty. Not the other way around.
Is it for all those accused of violent crimes? Or just those that have a high potential of being dangerous, say those accused of being a serial killer. Norway is not known for being harsh to the accused or those convicted, but this guy didn't get bail:
Breivik is exactly the kind of person you really have to keep locked up. You can't release someone like that on bail. Totally deserves the death penalty, but unfortunately Norway is unable to execute him.
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Originally Posted by ilovemycomputer90
How do you define a clear threat to the community? This is a gray area. Someone could be accused of being a serial killer and turn out innocent. Or someone might not truly be a threat to the community. Innocent people have been thrown in jail for decades. My main issue with this new law is that innocent people will no longer have the right to post bail and end up sitting in jail for months if not longer. Even if they are found innocent, they were still locked up without the right to post bail; that is unacceptable IMO.
Legalized prostitution could be tightly regulated and protect prostitutes.
One more comment about prostitution, since you brought it up. You can regulate it all you want - it's still destructive to society and exploitative of women (and men). It's the nature of the beast. It's intrinsically exploitative. Same thing goes for pornography.
One more comment about prostitution, since you brought it up. You can regulate it all you want - it's still destructive to society and exploitative of women (and men). It's the nature of the beast. It's intrinsically exploitative. Same thing goes for pornography.
The criminalization of prostitution is destructive and exploitative. Prostitutes would be much safer and healthier if it were legalized and regulated. Two consenting adults should be allowed to engage in sexual activity, even if it's conducted in a business-like manner. I don't believe we should force others to follow a narrow view of morality. This is theoretically a free country. Of course it's not, but you know what I mean lol.
The criminalization of prostitution is destructive and exploitative. Prostitutes would be much safer and healthier if it were legalized and regulated. Two consenting adults should be allowed to engage in sexual activity, even if it's conducted in a business-like manner. I don't believe we should force others to follow a narrow view of morality. This is theoretically a free country. Of course it's not, but you know what I mean lol.
Legalizing it just encourages it. I don't care too much what others think about sexual morality. I don't think prostitution is a career choice someone would make if not for desperation or being involved with manipulative people who get them into it. Maybe an extremely small minority become prostitutes because they enjoy they enjoy it. (Even in those cases, I'd argue that's a result of the sick society we live in.) It's the business side of it and the legalization of an abhorrent form of exploitation that would be a blight on society.
I don't know about Norway's constitution or legal system so I can't really comment on it. All I can say is that anyone accused of a crime should be given the opportunity to post bail. Innocent until proven guilty. Not the other way around.
The Nordic nations don't have a bail system. The police keeps you locked up if you're a threat to the society, if the investigation is harmed by letting the suspect go, or if there's a threat the suspect will flee the country.
In Finland, Anneli Auer has been sitting in and out of jail since 2009 pending her neverending murder trial. If she's judged not guilty (unlikely), she will get a financial compensation for every day she's spent in prison.
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Originally Posted by snj90
Legalizing it just encourages it. I don't care too much what others think about sexual morality. I don't think prostitution is a career choice someone would make if not for desperation or being involved with manipulative people who get them into it. Maybe an extremely small minority become prostitutes because they enjoy they enjoy it. (Even in those cases, I'd argue that's a result of the sick society we live in.) It's the business side of it and the legalization of an abhorrent form of exploitation that would be a blight on society.
Prostitution is illegal in Sweden and Norway, but legal in Finland and Denmark, and I don't see us going down the drain and Sweden and Norway being morally superior societies compared to us.
Organised prostitution (pimping, brothels) is illegal here, but if you want to sell sex voluntarily, nobody stops you.
One more comment about prostitution, since you brought it up. You can regulate it all you want - it's still destructive to society and exploitative of women (and men). It's the nature of the beast. It's intrinsically exploitative. Same thing goes for pornography.
If pornography is 'intrinsically exploitative', then surely the logical route is to criminalize pornography as well, since the women involved are not there because they really want to, but out of 'sheer desperation'.
Whether the women are doing so because they really want to, or because they have no other choice, is irrelevant. Women, and men, are free to do whatever they want, and criminalizing prostitution will not prevent people selling sex in exchange for money. We should not be making laws on what some people consider to be morally right and wrong. It is absolutely none of your business.
But anyway, prostitution is legal here - as in, selling sex for money. Standing on the street corner, or pimping, is illegal. So if you're some college student who wants extra money, you can have sex with some old guy for £200. If that's what he/she wants to do, in order to gain extra money quickly, then fine. It is not degrading society or any similar conservative soundbites that morally righteous people like to trot out.
And, as an extra - I do not support for death penalty for anyone, ever. It is not a proven deterrent, as is evident by the ridiculous murder rate in the US (only developed country alongside Japan still using it), and the only real justification for it is vengeance - that person killed, so kill him! I don't think Norway will want to reinstate the death penalty, as it is a rather advanced society and is well past such barbaric nonsense.
Last edited by dunno what to put here; 11-07-2014 at 10:43 AM..
If pornography is 'intrinsically exploitative', then surely the logical route is to criminalize pornography as well, since the women involved are not there because they really want to, but out of 'sheer desperation'.
I would not be upset if it were made illegal. It certainly is harmful to those involved. You could visit this site for more details. https://www.thepinkcross.org/
I think the problem has been made far worse due to the abundance of internet pornography. If it were not as easily spread, it would be much less of a problem because the industry itself would be so much smaller.
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Originally Posted by dunno what to put here
But anyway, prostitution is legal here - as in, selling sex for money. Standing on the street corner, or pimping, is illegal. So if you're some college student who wants extra money, you can have sex with some old guy for £200.
I don't really care about whether individuals having sex in exchange for money is legal or not. It's illegal here. I wouldn't care if it became legal. What I do oppose is the institution of a legalized and regulated prostitution industry.
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Originally Posted by dunno what to put here
And, as an extra - I do not support for death penalty for anyone, ever. It is not a proven deterrent, as is evident by the ridiculous murder rate in the US (only developed country alongside Japan still using it)
I think the death penalty is definitely a deterrent. I also support its use in cases of murder, particularly if the victim's family is in favor of its use. You are looking at only one factor (legality of the death penalty) and trying to draw conclusions about its effect on crime rates when there are many more factors to consider. I could point to another factor that's more relevant, but it's something people try to avoid discussing. In the US, African-Americans commit a disproportionately large number of crimes. This is a fact, and facts have no biases. I'm not interested in debating what may be the cause of this and I'm not suggesting any particular cause of this phenomenon for the sake of this discussion. I'm only stating that it is a cause of our high crime rate and is a much better explanation than the legality of the death penalty as to why our crime rates are so high.
I would not be upset if it were made illegal. It certainly is harmful to those involved. You could visit this site for more details. https://www.thepinkcross.org/
I think the problem has been made far worse due to the abundance of internet pornography. If it were not as easily spread, it would be much less of a problem because the industry itself would be so much smaller.
It is none of your business, nor mine, what sexual activity consenting adults choose to engage in or view (pornography). The culture war raged by many conservatives in this country costs money, ruins lives, and restricts freedom of choice.
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Originally Posted by snj90
I don't really care about whether individuals having sex in exchange for money is legal or not. It's illegal here. I wouldn't care if it became legal. What I do oppose is the institution of a legalized and regulated prostitution industry.
That's contradictory. Legalized prostitution would cause it to be institutionalized, which would be a good thing IMO. It would be safer for those involved and it would be a statement of freedom.
Quote:
Originally Posted by snj90
I think the death penalty is definitely a deterrent. I also support its use in cases of murder, particularly if the victim's family is in favor of its use. You are looking at only one factor (legality of the death penalty) and trying to draw conclusions about its effect on crime rates when there are many more factors to consider. I could point to another factor that's more relevant, but it's something people try to avoid discussing. In the US, African-Americans commit a disproportionately large number of crimes. This is a fact, and facts have no biases. I'm not interested in debating what may be the cause of this and I'm not suggesting any particular cause of this phenomenon for the sake of this discussion. I'm only stating that it is a cause of our high crime rate and is a much better explanation than the legality of the death penalty as to why our crime rates are so high.
The death penalty has failed as a deterrent. We live in one of the most violent countries in the western world. Of course there are a variety of factors that contribute to it, i.e. easy access to guns, income inequality, unemployment, etc. The death penalty is barbaric. How on earth could you support the government killing its own citizens? Sickening. Two wrongs don't make a right. What's worse is that innocent people have been executed. That alone is reason enough to abolish the death penalty.
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