Do Interviewers Want Dirt? (apply, job interview, employers, find a)

[MSchemist80]

I've often felt that a lot of interviewers try to trick you into saying something not optimal. I've long since given up try to understand what these interviewers are thinking with their lines of questioning (I am pretty sure nothing based on sound logic). I agree when you don't take their bait they then accuse you of being evasive. One just can't win.

I think quite a few interviewers go into an interview like it is an interrogation and they are trying to tear you down. That doesn't make someone a good interviewer. It makes them a self-superior @-hole. An interview should be more of a discussion and more centered around competence rather than trying to dissect someone psychologically.

[Never Quit]

Originally Posted by Hemlock140

As a hiring manager myself I would never bad-mouth either software or an interviewee's previous employer(s). If such questions are used they are more likely testing you to see how you respond, and whether you take the bait and make negative remarks to agree with the interviewer. I don't play games like that but some places do. This could even be a subtle way of doing corporte espionage, interviewing people for non-existent jobs to pick their brains. The appropriate way to answer would be to elaborate on how you did your best to work with the tools provided and got the job done, with good performance reviews, and that you look forward to using the programs they have.

This is a very interesting response and stuff I assumed to be the case. I especially like the corporate espionage aspect. I do think that many interviewers are gaining a lot from anything I tell them. I sort of expect this. Why not take an opportunity to get free ideas and advice? On the other hand, I am not being hired as a consultant to their company. It is especially interesting when I am being interviewed by the owner or lead manager of the company. It is a tough position because I have to tell them things that indicate that I am qualified and tell them things I would consider in my strategies. This all can be used for free by them.

There is an interesting quote I once read. I can't recall it exactly, but the person said that searching for people is like buying a shirt. If you can see all of it at the store, then you gained too much knowledge about the shirt, and then you decide you don't want it because you figure there is nothing more you want from it after you leave the store.

I feel like I have one better than the stock "I worked with the tools I was given." In some cases, I actually build the tools because the tools simply did not exist and I needed them. Is this better or does it make me look like a Prima Donna?

[wideworld]

Originally Posted by Never Quit

I've been looking for a new job and of course, that involves sending out resumes and going on interviewers. I've noticed a strange pattern.

I went a very long time without being able to find a job and deeply appreciate any employment that I've had over the past two years, even if I hated the job and hated the company. I do not dislike my current employer and I don't dislike my current job: the people are generally very nice, they pay on time, and my job has enough variety that no two days are the same and there is no way to predict what the day will bring when I arrive in the morning.

I bring all this up because the only reason I am looking for a new job is because I would like to lift myself out of poverty. I get paid *okay*, and in fact, my employer recently gave me a 20% raise. The only issue is that, even with said raise, I still can't afford a better place to live, a place closer to my job, nor I certainly can't afford to buy my own transportation.

I told my employer that I'm not actively looking for a job, though I do take shots at jobs that pay about 2x what they pay. I certainly would not drop this job for a job that pays $2 more per hour. The risk is too high for that.

With all of my bases covered, I sometime have an interview. This brings up some difficulty for me. The only reason I want to quit my job is because I am determined to reach something that is closer to middle class status. I have no other reason to be sitting in front of an interviewer, so I just tell them that the pay is too low where I work.

But it feels like a half-assed response. I don't want to get into the self-improvement kick, seeking a challenge, the desire to live a "normal" life or any of the other tangential reasons of why I am sitting there. On paper, I am highly uneducated with no practical work experience. It *does* feel good that I am getting calls for jobs that pay over $20/hour. This is only because of the projects that I've worked on. I simply do not know how to crack the code.

This all brings me back to the title of this post. Most interviewers that I've spoken with really want dirt. Or at least, I get that impression from the questions they ask me and how they phrase these questions. They seem wholly dissatisfied with what appears to be evasive answers. I try to keep things positive, and one thing that I simply refuse to do is talk ill about people and my prior employers.

For example, it would be more tame of them to ask something like: "What software do they use?" and then follow up with "How would you, or what did you do, to improve the situation that was caused by said software?" Instead, this question would be followed up with "That is trash, what kind of company uses that?" Then they want to lead me down roads where I would be forced to admit that the company I work for is unprofessional and led by morons. These are all routes I do not care to go down.

Other leading questions include: "That must be a frustrating job" or other snide comments. I don't know what they are trying to accomplish with all of it.

I've never been middle class, so I don't know the attitudes that is prevalent in that world, and I don't know if it is happen-stance that I am getting a strange set of questions or if there is some secret handshake or code I am missing out on.

So, I ask, is this really what I should expect when attempting to reach above $20/hour jobs? What should I do when faced with this kind of interviewer (and dare I say they are *all* like this?), and what sort of things should I say or expect as I try to rise up in this world?

This.

It's a test. Don't ever let them break you, not in the interview, not ever to someone in that company who could hold the key to your gainful employment or lack-thereof.

"This" should be expected if you are saying things in the interview that set them up. Don't give them the opportunity to lead you astray. Keep it positive from the get-go. Start the engine and move, move, move. On that note, I would definitely go for the "seeking better opportunities / to grow / learn / challenge myself" route rather than the paths you've been leading yourself down. Those are all legitimate neutral responses which you can elaborate on if they ask and paint a positive image of yourself.

[fishbrains]

Originally Posted by Never Quit

I have no other reason to be sitting in front of an interviewer, so I just tell them that the pay is too low where I work.

But it feels like a half-assed response. I don't want to get into the self-improvement kick, seeking a challenge, the desire to live a "normal" life or any of the other tangential reasons of why I am sitting there.

You need to get into those other "tangential" reasons. Part of interviewing is to establish technical qualifications. Part of it is to determine what kind of person you are. It is assumed that you are looking for more money, the interviewer wants to know what makes you tick. By simply stating money you are in effect dodging the question and giving the HM nothing to work with. Choose on or two of those tangential reasons and elaborate on them.

This all brings me back to the title of this post. Most interviewers that I've spoken with really want dirt. Or at least, I get that impression from the questions they ask me and how they phrase these questions. They seem wholly dissatisfied with what appears to be evasive answers. I try to keep things positive, and one thing that I simply refuse to do is talk ill about people and my prior employers.

Good move. Don't say anything bad. Talk about your previous employers strengths and what you learned by working there.

For example, it would be more tame of them to ask something like: "What software do they use?" and then follow up with "How would you, or what did you do, to improve the situation that was caused by said software?" Instead, this question would be followed up with "That is trash, what kind of company uses that?" Then they want to lead me down roads where I would be forced to admit that the company I work for is unprofessional and led by morons. These are all routes I do not care to go down.

Right. Don't go there. Tell them that you were not involved in the decision to use X, but X did have some positive, useful features such as...

This shows that you can be positive, evaluate differing products, and focus on benefits.

Other leading questions include: "That must be a frustrating job" or other snide comments. I don't know what they are trying to accomplish with all of it.

I would answer this by saying something like....All jobs have their frustrating aspects, but they have positive aspects too. Generally I am not bothered by the frustrating bits. After all, we all have to do dishes and laundry at home, and we all have to do (something frustrating) at work. No big deal. On the other hand, I get to do (something positive) which more than balances the frustrating bits.

I've never been middle class, so I don't know the attitudes that is prevalent in that world, and I don't know if it is happen-stance that I am getting a strange set of questions or if there is some secret handshake or code I am missing out on.

Being aware of the language codes used by different groups is a great start. I hope that I have helped you with some options on the above.

So, I ask, is this really what I should expect when attempting to reach above $20/hour jobs? What should I do when faced with this kind of interviewer (and dare I say they are *all* like this?), and what sort of things should I say or expect as I try to rise up in this world?

This is not standard. There are as many different ways of doing things as there are interviewers. Keep it positive, take the opportunity with every question to give them some response not only answering their strict question, but also giving them some info that makes you look good, or they might like to know.

[Never Quit]

Interesting answers, fishbrains. I also like everyone else answers. Certainly food for thought and valuable insight into how to prepare next time.

So, the incorrect answer -- as I sort of figured -- is not money. I tested it a few times but I agree that it felt like a dead-end. By luck, those two jobs were jobs I would have probably not taken even if I had an offer.

My current job seemed pretty up on hiring me before I walked in the door. I once read something that said "Once they call you, it is your job, you just have to not blow it." I know that isn't completely true, but I've seen the process and had the chance to sift resumes and sit in interviews. I know for certain that the chance of getting a phone call is about 1%, and often less. If that is the case for jobs that pay $10/hour, it must be much lower for jobs that pay twice as much.

There was one interview that offered me a test, and I passed with 90% flying colors. They kept on trying to lead me down the path of negative, but I laid the saccharine on them, almost to the point that I felt like I was over-doing it and appearing like Mr. Too-Cool. They even came at me like jerks at first, but became very friendly after I passed their test, even offering to close the window in an otherwise freezing room.

I simply was not sure what happened there, and there have been a few other situations where I wasn't sure what happened. I've found that there are a few interviewers who... Well, I'll describe it as "simulate stupidity," where after asking a few sideways questions, I realize they are actually much smarter and knowledgeable than they let on. I've been in a few interviews where they act like jerks then soften up 180 degrees. All of this feels like some high-level game I'm not sophisticated enough to win or think through.

I have a lot to think about. It's all interesting. For certain, one thing that doesn't feel like would work is canned responses, or at least, not preparing for some game of wits. I don't know, I must be over-thinking, although I'll let on that I am possibly getting more of this action because it is obvious from my resume that I'm likely under-qualified for the jobs I am applying to.

?

[AndTiggerToo]

Originally Posted by Never Quit

So, what reason should I give to that question?

Tell them you want a job with less of a commute if it is closer to home. Or one with more challenges. Leave off pay until you are at the offer stage.

Why would I want to quit a job I am generally happy at? This isn't a reason that I gave at all interviews. It was a reason I gave a few times. It is all testing and trying different strategies, not 100% I've tried A and stuck with A. As for the actual pay, I know what they pay before I walk in, thus partly why I applied in the first place.

Charlygal, please refrain from accusations about my personality. I don't "go around with a chip" on my shoulder.

Ummmm...your initial post absolutely sounds that way. You ask for opinions and then attack those who point out what they see. Looks like a chip to me too.

Unless you met me face-to-face, or happen to be one of the people who have interviewed me, I doubt you have much to say on this topic.

Chip here too.

Pay is never a reason to leave a job as the person interviewing you wonders if you will leave them for the same reason.

[jane_sm1th73]

Originally Posted by Never Quit

I've been looking for a new job and of course, that involves sending out resumes and going on interviewers. I've noticed a strange pattern.

....

Most interviewers that I've spoken with really want dirt. Or at least, I get that impression from the questions they ask me and how they phrase these questions. They seem wholly dissatisfied with what appears to be evasive answers. I try to keep things positive, and one thing that I simply refuse to do is talk ill about people and my prior employers.

....

Other leading questions include: "That must be a frustrating job" or other snide comments. I don't know what they are trying to accomplish with all of it.

I've never been middle class, so I don't know the attitudes that is prevalent in that world, and I don't know if it is happen-stance that I am getting a strange set of questions or if there is some secret handshake or code I am missing out on.

So, I ask, is this really what I should expect when attempting to reach above $20/hour jobs? What should I do when faced with this kind of interviewer (and dare I say they are *all* like this?), and what sort of things should I say or expect as I try to rise up in this world?

Congratulations to you, I am so glad you found something! That being said...

This interviewer tactic is an evolution of 'behavioral interviewing', where you are asked to supply circumstances, your understanding of the problems, and evidence of outcomes, for each of the capabilities you claim to have. They are asking for "proof" that you can actually do the things you claim you can do.

Under the circumstances you describe, the interviewer is testing your 'resiliency', 'emotional intelligence', capability to work 'as a team'. He is attempting to place you into a situation where your capability to maintain a 'professional demeanor' is stressed. You are correct in believing that he is assessing your propensity to lash out, behave defensively, or blame others. Your play here is to remain focused on the problem [profitability and team cohesion], not take the bait, stick to the facts, and support your conclusion [unless he has proven you wrong, in which case you say "I had not considered it from that angle - you may very well be right, and I'll need to re-examine my premises". Other ways to handle provocative questions and comments: "In your shoes, I'd believe exactly the same thing"; "That is the way it would appear. However, here are the remaining facts"; "That's a valid interpretation. However, the fact pattern suggests otherwise [cite previously undisclosed facts]". And comments of that nature.

You are right to believe that he is trying to rattle you. He is attempting to see how you react when people don't "like" you. Don't take the bait. In situations like this, you must be pleasant but factual; keep your eye on the ball; focus on the problem, and on the most likely road to a profitable outcome for the company. If you can demonstrate that you can keep your eye on the ball, that is what he is looking for.

Let's say that he correctly discerned that you had an unsustainable situation in your former company. When he challenges you about this or that [e.g., "Why would a rational person DO this or that??!!], you might consider looking at him square in the eye, with an expression of polite-but-respectful astonishment, while saying "Well, you know, I was being paid to do it!" (assuming that "it" was not illegal, etc.)

Or, you may have had your own reasons. "What you say is entirely correct. However, this was my opportunity to develop expertise in x, y or z. I valued that opportunity above everything else, and therefore I did whatever I needed to do in order to develop that capability". Capabilities are permanent. Situational discomfort is transient. As you have demonstrated, you can take your capabilities to the next place and use them to leverage a more favorable situation for yourself. Thereby, you left the transient unpleasantness, although you profited by living through it, by building your skills.

I suspect (and forgive me for reaching here) that these interviewers are poking at the circumstance you outlined on these boards previously: your ? girlfriend ? got you a legitimate job in a "real" company, and you quit because of "personal reasons". IIRC, in that circumstance you walked out into the cold, and had a period of years where you could not recover into even modest alternative employment. They are probing to see if you are a hothead, or otherwise a drama queen who will cause disruption in their work places. The last thing they want is somebody who will create problems and walk off in a huff.

Roll with the punches. You can maintain your dignity and integrity while under attack. Just don't attack back, stick to the facts and to the end goal. That's how the middle class does it. And you're right - these behaviors are excruciatingly difficult to learn from a book, it is much easier to see them modeled in order to get a sense of 'how it's done'.

Best of luck to you!

[beera]

I never thought higher pay was a bad response, but I wouldn't only cite that reason.

I usually said things like "I want to grow in my field/skill set and unfortunately I've reached a point at my current job where there isn't as much opportunity to do more and/or move up."

My last job I was honest, "I have more skills than what my current job is, and to be frank more money always helps." I think many employers realize that we could all always use more money!

[Roman77]

I recently had an interview( landed the job and just started this past week), and it took everything in my power to avoid speaking ill of my last employer. Family company, moving goalposts,favoritism, nepotism, cronyism, just the worst place I've ever been involved with. On this last interview, when asked why I was leaving I stated that upward mobility was limited due to its nature of being a family business, and I was looking for an organization that promotes professional development and offers a level playing field for advancement. That was about as nice as I could put it. Apparently they bought it, because I got the job.

General rule of thumb, no matter how much you have to bite your lip, don't badmouth your current or previous employer. The interviewer will assume that you'll do the same to them if you leave them. And don't bring up money, I never did and the topic didn't come up until they had selected me and the hiring manager raised the matter.

[va_lucky]

I always bring up money. If I am expected to work for the rest of my life I figure that I might as well get paid as much as I can with few exceptions.

I get about 25 emails/phone calls per day for work though, so I have to be up front about pay. Additionally, only about 5% of the positions that I am approached with pay more than I am making now so if I am not up front I will waste my entire day blabbing about jobs that represent a pay cut for me.