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Old 11-29-2016, 11:00 PM
 
37,371 posts, read 60,178,482 times
Reputation: 25420

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pappjohn View Post

I believe it but with kiosks you will not earn a penny. Don't pretend the $15/hr isn't responsible in some way for the disappearance of jobs.


[b]Your comment about Ford is just wrong..Trump has lied about that repeatedly and Ford has said it was not true...[b]

The US has shipped out thousands of good paying jobs overseas and replaced them with low-paying service sector jobs the last 10 years. For Example, Ford is moving all small car production to Mexico and if Trump doesn't persuade them otherwise, they will move production there eventually. Why should an American icon like Ford have to move outside the US?
This is the chicken and egg conundrum...
People want cheaper things...ergo the rise of WalMart over the past 4 decades...
And companies have stopped paying higher wages to the mass of workers whether they are blue collar, unskilled, or white collar-clerical...wage growth is going to fewer people in a company -the higher eschilon staff. So these working people have to buy cheaper things to sustain a decent way of life...

IF companies had been willing to pay higher wages to more workers vs the few, employees would have had more money in their pockets and could have afforded to buy more expensive products...thus supporting American based mfg...
But companies made a choice NOT to increase wages on a large scale...
Wage growth for CEOs and other high admin staff has grown at much larger exponent than wages for regular employees...
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Old 11-29-2016, 11:04 PM
 
320 posts, read 355,901 times
Reputation: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by loves2read View Post
This is the chicken and egg conundrum...
People want cheaper things...ergo the rise of WalMart over the past 4 decades...
And companies have stopped paying higher wages to the mass of workers whether they are blue collar, unskilled, or white collar-clerical...wage growth is going to fewer people in a company -the higher eschilon staff. So these working people have to buy cheaper things to sustain a decent way of life...

IF companies had been willing to pay higher wages to more workers vs the few, employees would have had more money in their pockets and could have afforded to buy more expensive products...thus supporting American based mfg...
But companies made a choice NOT to increase wages on a large scale...
Wage growth for CEOs and other high admin staff has grown at much larger exponent than wages for regular employees...
Not to mention those extortionate bonuses...
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Old 11-29-2016, 11:06 PM
 
13,176 posts, read 21,225,578 times
Reputation: 21569
Quote:
Originally Posted by MongooseHugger View Post
Carrier also didn't like what the EPA was doing. While Obama has been going around speaking about climate change this and climate change that and we need more regulations, bla bla bla, Trump has said that he's going to cut back on the outrageous stuff the EPA is doing. That might have had something to do with it.
Actually, Carrier and UT have no issues with the EPA. Everything the EPA has required of them is stuff they are willing to do or expected to be held accountable for. Here is the exact wording from their 10-K:

" We do not anticipate that compliance with current provisions relating to the protection of the environment or that any payments we may be required to make for cleanup liabilities will have a material adverse effect upon our cash flows, competitive position, financial condition or results of operations."

Sounds to me like they don't see the EPA or any environmental regulations as having any negative impact on their business or finances. Just curious where you got the idea they had an issue with the EPA?
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Old 11-29-2016, 11:54 PM
 
Location: U.S.A., Earth
5,488 posts, read 4,507,775 times
Reputation: 5775
Quote:
Originally Posted by FeelinLow View Post
Another reason not to go to McDonalds. Their food sucks anyway and who needs to look at a strobing menu?
I'll cook up my own burgers at home!
I will confess I still go to them every now and then. $3 to take a stroll down memory lane via the McRib. Also used an app promo for buy one get one free premium burgers.. for their craft sandwiches where you get to customize the components. Actually, that was twice within the past 6 months.




I did go to them more often to bum off their wifi while studying for stuff. Could still do this, but spend only $1 or so. But yeah, if nothing else, I still have plenty of food at home, whether if it's cooked or just heated.
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Old 11-30-2016, 01:08 AM
 
4,366 posts, read 4,604,692 times
Reputation: 2957
Like many people, I was a low wage crew member at a local McDonald's in high school. My advice is learn to cook at home. Almost every item is deep fried in a bath of hot grease. It doesn't normally take only 30 seconds to cook a burger, but at McDonald's it does. Plus, assuming they are all alike, they treat their workers like dirt. You're replaceable; they know it. You aren't even allowed to sit down if you don't have work to do; you still have to make yourself busy by cleaning floors and tables. It's like working there is some kind of weird punishment. Also, they'll find excuses to not pay you for the hours you worked, and, unless I'm wrong about this, you're paid less for training. They make you sit and play with a computer program that takes hours to finish before you are allowed to do anything (the training game is really effective, though. I'm thinking McDonald's could get involved in another unlikely industry--Education--and have a lot of success.)

Really, I think certain practices should be made illegal in the United States, but there are two ways to look at it. Unfair wages and policies that can leave an employee feeling like a mistreated animal are bad things, but they are also factors that may mean those jobs are easier to get because few people would want them if they could have something better. I guess in this respect it's a two-sided coin. Relax labor laws and even allow companies to pay a little below minimum wage (or keep minimum wage low) and there's a chance that more people will be hired because it won't hurt a company's profit margin. Artificially raise minimum wage to keep up with inflation when it wasn't prior practice, and companies will suffer a small loss and will attempt to regulate the situation by cutting back on the people they hire.

Is that a bad thing? I don't think so. What I think isn't so great is companies have so many "outs," to keep paying their employees more or less the same. There should be a heavy tax on outsourcing, in my opinion. When you introduce things like automation, perhaps you at least create more jobs for the people operating the machines; when you outsource, though, aren't you effectively giving jobs that could have gone to people in the U.S. to people in other countries? I think this is the gripe people repeat when they say that foreigners are "taking our jobs." "American-made" products that are made in other countries should come with a tax to keep labor in the U.S. Innovators are smart; they can figure out other loopholes, but even those loopholes would employ American workers.
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Old 11-30-2016, 02:16 AM
 
Location: Amelia Island/Rhode Island
5,289 posts, read 6,247,239 times
Reputation: 6420
They have had these kiosks in Europe for a while from what I have seen over the past couple of years.

We have had to snatch some wifi and used them to get a drink or snack at the time and the places that had them were packed with plenty of employees.

In the places that were real busy it does seem to go faster than standing behind several people who have no clue what they want to eat.

They also brought the food to the table.
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Old 11-30-2016, 03:17 AM
 
Location: Tucson/Nogales
23,409 posts, read 29,302,020 times
Reputation: 32759
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kophi View Post
If they want to replace everyone with machines, that's fine, as long as they don't complain
when it turns out no one can use them; it's hard to have consumers if no one can afford to
consume.


-
Many of these corporations are overlooking the excess time some of these unemployed people will have on their hands, and many can be extremely talented in hacking computers, software systems. Engineering is a double edged sword!

The military has gone head over heels with robotics, and overlooking the fact that there are some brilliant, talented insurgents who are capable of hacking, jamming the system.

It happened in Iraq. A military robot was scouting out IED's, roadside bombs, and these insurgents hacked into the system, and led the robot off into a ditch, falling head over heels!

They might hack into one of these kiosks, and when the customer presses no ketchup or mustard, it's instructed for lots of ketchup and mustard.
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Old 11-30-2016, 04:27 AM
 
1,594 posts, read 1,202,802 times
Reputation: 6768
Quote:
Originally Posted by pappjohn View Post
Huh? Saving good paying jobs is a good deal and it only took a phone call.

Obama spent the last 8 years sending US jobs overseas, now Trump is starting to do just the opposite.
Your naivete is cute- don't let the reality of what just happened ruin your outlook. You'd turn into a realist, and that would suck.
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Old 11-30-2016, 04:38 AM
 
14,221 posts, read 7,009,500 times
Reputation: 6059
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post

Federal min wage of $15 is a crazy pipe dream for now and rightfully so considering what it costs to live in a small town in Iowa, but it's already a reality in urban ceters (or close enough)
Whats the price of child care, prescription drug costs, hospitalization costs, college tuition fees, airfares, car insurance etc in a small town in Iowa? Whats the public transit like in a small town in Iowa?

People are seriously overestimating the cost of living disparities in America. Its not like you can live a decent life anywhere in America on a paltry $7.25 minimum wage.

In cities like SF and NYC, it should be at least $20 an hour by 2020, not $15. But $15 should definitely be the federal minimum by 2020.
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Old 11-30-2016, 04:46 AM
 
10,073 posts, read 7,603,698 times
Reputation: 15505
Quote:
Its not like you can live a decent life anywhere in America on a paltry $7.25 minimum wage.
why should the minimum wage be providing a decent life? Why should minimum wage be used to support anyone beyond the person working, IE why do people try to support a family on it.

Minimum wage isn't set to a living standard, and unless the people who argue that it should, they need to define what their standards are. A 100 sq living space shared with roommates is still decent "living" conditions. If someone disagrees, then let them justify why it should be bigger for someone at the bottom rungs of the economy. To me, most of the things that make life "decent" are luxuries... and minimum wage workers just haven't the skills to warrant earning them to me. learn some skills, then buy the luxuries with the paycheck.
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