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It always seems obvious when it's produced by Russia; Americans aren't able to recognize it easily (if at all) when it's produced by their own slick salespeople. The West has had the psychology profession as a resource in devising its propaganda for generations now, which is an advantage Russia hasn't had.
Right. That's why Putin hired Western companies for his PR purposes, which in turn made the West fuming - how dare you))))
Maybe this is enough for now, but MalaMan and others, please think again before you say "there is Western propaganda and Russian propaganda". You are comparing a flu to lung cancer.
The beauty of Western propaganda is that we don't even notice it's propaganda.
I see propaganda against Brazil being done even in British media outlets that claim to be "progressive", like The Guardian.
You would absorb the propaganda against Brazil in "The Guardian" without even noticing it is propaganda.
And all this propaganda against Brazil started to get worse after Brazil joined Russia, India and China in the BRICS economic cooperation block.
I will not mention the anti-Brazil propaganda in "The Economist" because I think it's pretty obvious to anyone... Before the BRICS started to have high-level meetings of the heads of state, "The Economist" praised Brazil. After those high-level meetings started to happen every year, "The Economist" started to bash Brazil in all possible ways.
I notice that the anti-Brazil propaganda is stronger in British media than in American media. It's not clear to me what is the problem that British media has with Brazil...
The beauty of Western propaganda is that we don't even notice it's propaganda.
I see propaganda against Brazil being done even in British media outlets that claim to be "progressive", like The Guardian.
You would absorb the propaganda against Brazil in "The Guardian" without even noticing it is propaganda.
And all this propaganda against Brazil started to get worse after Brazil joined Russia, India and China in the BRICS economic cooperation block.
I will not mention the anti-Brazil propaganda in "The Economist" because I think it's pretty obvious to anyone... Before the BRICS started to have high-level meetings of the heads of state, "The Economist" praised Brazil. After those high-level meetings started to happen every year, "The Economist" started to bash Brazil in all possible ways.
I notice that the anti-Brazil propaganda is stronger in British media than in American media. It's not clear to me what is the problem that British media has with Brazil...
I might give you a clue - see, I'll post it one more time - "The service sector dominates the UK economy, contributing around 78% of GDP; the financial services industry is particularly important and London is the world's largest financial centre (tied with New York)"
I might give you a clue - see, I'll post it one more time - "The service sector dominates the UK economy, contributing around 78% of GDP; the financial services industry is particularly important and London is the world's largest financial centre (tied with New York)"
American and British propaganda can be seen in movies, TV shows, fiction books, music... I don't think it's much different of Russian propaganda....
Then I think you have a pretty foolish perspective.
Yes, everyone and everything is propaganda, to an extent, because everyone has their viewpoint. But there is absolutely no equivalent between the Kremlin propaganda machine and free, independent media in Western nations.
Most of you have absolutely no idea how the Russian propaganda machine works, how Russian media works, or how the Russian mentality works. I can't say I know much about Russia, because I don't, but I know something. Why I'm interested in this is that I'm very worried about this propaganda, as my country is a target for this and we share a 1000 km border with Russia.
Russian media or propaganda isn't like FOX news or other particular Western biased medias. Russian propaganda is all over the society and involves all factors of the social life.
Sure, other great powers like the US, Britain, France and others have international news sources aiming to show their countries in a favourable view. But that is not propaganda, that is just news sources having a certain bias. Just like hunting magazines unlikely would have a very anti-gun stance. In any case, in our pluralistic societies there are always alternative sources which you can read, and critisism always gets trough. Like I could create an Anti-Gun Weekly -magazine and give my viewpoint, or any established media can always critisise what a supposedly biased media says. And now when social media is huge anybody can start a blog or post something on twitter. The situation is maybe not ideal, but we can just switch channels and go to Top 10 Reasons Why America Sucks. All Western countries still have free and independent media, however you want twist it.
In Russia this is not possible. The government have for the last 15 years been shutting all independent TV-channels, most of the anti-government newspapers are gone, and if I remember correctly, the city of Moscow has one independent anti-government radio station which is in constant danger. One. In Europe's largest city. The Russian propaganda spews their message 24/7 in radio, newspaper, internet and especially TV, which is a much bigger influence than it is in Europe or the US. We have multiple independent TV channels, high-speed internet, streaming services, and we are generally net-savvy by now. The Babushka in Omsk Oblast still only have her TV and radio. It is also worth to point out that 90% of the Russian populace don't know any other languages than former USSR ones. They have no access to an alternative viewpoint and cannot read any foreign languages to get that info from. And why doesn't Russians use Facebook, but their own almost identical VKontakte? Maybe there is no agenda, but VKontakte is at least a hell lot easier to control, as it is Russian.
Partly for these reasons YLE (the Finnish BBC) created Novosti YLE, which offers news in Russian so that Russian expats or Russians living in Finland don't have to rely on Russian propaganda about what's happening in the world and especially Finland. High-ranking Estonian and Latvian politicians even toyed with the idea that the Baltic States or even the whole of EU should create a counter-propaganda machine to battle this neverending Russian propaganda. Of course nobody wasn't really interested, as this is quite against our fundamentals of free and independent speech. But even these considerations show that the Russian propaganda machine is something exremely powerful. Ukraine really took radical action and shut off all Russian TV channels.
And this is not everything. The Russian establishment understands how powerful social media is. They have government agencies where the workers pose as normal citizens, spreading their own small piece of the propaganda. Some of you have probably heard of this. They create blogs, but mostly spam comments online - newspapers' comment boxes and internet forums. The aim of these is to spread disinformation, insult and silence other commenters, manipulate the way the discussion is going and so on. Also on C-D. I am very confident that this member is a paid so-called Putin-troll. For example the largest discussion forum for Russian expats and Russian-Finns is Russian.fi, and the admin has told the media that there are so many of these that when you ban one, one new appears. Look at The Guardian's online comments in any news regarding Russia. Quickly there are scores of 'commentators' saying "blyat go to a mental hospital you wrong" or similar. Formerly these trolls were small-scale operations mainly targeted for domestic purposes, but since 2013 they have turned international and have created so-called 'troll factories'. Anyone who has an adequate knowledge of the English language and know how to operate on the web can join, it's not some CIA-James Bond-spy-sh*t. One of the 'factories', valiantly revealed by the Finnish and Swedish media is located in ulitsa Savushkina 55, Saint Petersburg.
What makes it even worse is that Russians have absolutely no history of free speech and democracy. The government has always been oppressive, and the tradition to openly and loudly question the establishment isn't just there. I think the Russians have a saying which translates to something like "lay low as the grass". Meaning that don't stick your head up or you will lose it, so keep your opinions for yourself. It was a bit more free during the Yeltsin era, but now the noose has tightened again. Those brave who defy this are again in constant danger. Small-ball players are maybe beaten and their families threatened, the too powerful are imprisioned (Hodorkovsky), and those who don't stop are murdered (Litvinenko, Politkovskaya, Nemtsov...) In these days it is very dangerous to step up, even if you are a nobody. I listened to a radio interview just few days ago with Finnish actor Ville Haapasalo who has lived in Moscow for the last 20 years and is very famous there. He has made travel/adventure programmes in Russia for Finnish television, as is extremely careful that no politics are involved. He said that the all-involving propaganda isn't all there is, but that the self-censorship is extremely prevalent. Stay low as the grass. And a direct quote: "we had to cut a lot of material, because... I already knew while filming that we cannot show this. I can't take the risk that I ring a person I met few months ago just to learn that he has disappeared". And his shows are targeted for the Finnish audience and not even shown in Russia!
Regarding the news channel Russia Today, that is propaganda tailored and targeted for the international audience. It's propaganda disguised as independent news and presented in the way we Westerners are used to. I wouldn't say it's a wolf in sheep's clothing, but maybe a wolf in dog's clothing. But it is still a canis lupus in there. Russians don't watch RT, and it's not what Russian television is. They watch channels like Rossiya24 and others only broadcasting in Russian targeted only for the domestic audience, and they don't have to pretend anything like RT does. What goes on there is for us quite... unfathomable. For example they have said that Finnish-Russian babies are kidnapped by our authorities and sent to KZ-lagers to be "finnicised", and that in Europe men are f**king stray dogs, as in this pro homo-lesbian environment it's becoming impossible to find a hetero partner. And that the EU might legalise pedophilia, as the ever-growing gay population are also pedophiles. Then there's the 'normal' things like depicting Obama as a monkey, how the NATO is after Russia and how strong Russia is and so on. All this is nothing I just made up, all this has actually been said on Russian television. And people believe it.
Maybe this is enough for now, but MalaMan and others, please think again before you say "there is Western propaganda and Russian propaganda". You are comparing a flu to lung cancer.
For all the reasons you stated is why most of the Jews left Russia and why a lot of Russians still leave Moscow for NYC.
Then I think you have a pretty foolish perspective.
Yes, everyone and everything is propaganda, to an extent, because everyone has their viewpoint. But there is absolutely no equivalent between the Kremlin propaganda machine and free, independent media in Western nations.
If they were really "free and independent" they wouldn't be all spreading the exact same stereotypes and distortions....
For all the reasons you stated is why most of the Jews left Russia and why a lot of Russians still leave Moscow for NYC.
No, Russians prefer to leave Moscow for London rather than New-York.
London attracts the most vial part of them for some interesting reason or the other)))
New-York - that's more point of destination for immigrating Russian Jews I'd think)))
No, Russians prefer to leave Moscow for London rather than New-York.
London attracts the most vial part of them for some interesting reason or the other)))
New-York - that's more point of destination for immigrating Russian Jews I'd think)))
I was just in Brooklyn and most of the Russians I met were not even Jewish. The Russian Jews left Russia in mass exodus in the 80s and for Israel and lot of them were not even Jewish but said they were to leave Russia.
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