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Excluding the parts of Hong Kong that are mainly rural (much of the new territories, Lantau island , etc) which place feels more urban, vibrant, and overwhelming?
Manhattan Island is roughly 23 Sq Mi, and has a population of 1.629 Million
The closest grouping of that in Hong Kong would be these 5 Central Districts:
-Kowloon City
-Yau Tsim Mong
-Sham Shui Po
-Wan Chai
-Central and Western
According at least to the population and size numbers I could find, these (5) probably are the most centrally located of Hong Kong Districts, are roughly 18 Sq Mi, and have a population of 1.564 Million.
However, that is where it becomes somewhat more difficult, because there is still another 6M in Hong Kong unaccounted for. Hong Kong is 426 Sq Mi, however 12 is water, and approximately 40% of Hong Kong territory is entirely unsettled park space, so by my estimation, that leaves around 244 Sq Mi of settled land for the 7.4 Million. That leaves a population density among the settled miles of about 30,000 PSQM. That is roughly 4,000 PSQM denser than NYC right there, but that doesn't even take into account the many less sparsely populated areas throughout the island that aren't necessarily "park space". I would guess that 85% or more of Hong Kong's population are within 100 of those square miles... so crazy level density to be sure, almost on an unmatched scale outside places like township slums, etc.
That being said, some observations for both.
NYC
1. New York City (I believe) is more connected and continuous at street level than Hong Kong is. Therefore, there is more of a continuous ability to walk around and see crowds. Even the densest parts of Hong Kong can feel relatively quiet at street level in my experience.
2. I don't exactly know, but my assumption, even in spite of rapid changes is that New York City would overall see more daytime visitors for work, etc. coming into Manhattan, and that while I think Hong Kong ranks highest on international overnight visitors, NYC still might have more "visitors" overall when considering domestic numbers.
3. While Hong Kong has a number of vibrant areas, I'm not sure any are quite as vibrant/overwhelming to the senses in the bright neon, urban canyon format as Midtown/Times Square can be. That being said, I did not actually go to Causeway Bay, which I suppose is "that place" for Hong Kong more than anywhere, so I can't be sure.
HK
1. With that being said, those numbers I posted above speak for themselves. HK's skyline is just absolutely incredible, at a level I don't think NYC or any other can match. I also consider with HK that is surrounded by places like Shenzhen, etc. that have a similar incredible urban feel. HK is more dense, and at least in certain ways.. you can tell.
2. I would guess that crowds in HK are more consistent throughout the year. NYC is going to peaked at certain times.. but then at the same time Manhattan can probably feel relatively quiet at certain other times of the week/year. HK meanwhile I don't think has similar ebbs and flows. I will also say that as things continue to change with borders being opened up, the number of visitors (and if international overnight doesn't reflect Chinese nationals, then my assumptions are VERY wrong), people passing thru HK will probably go up more than down.
3. The peak pedestrian intensity in a few places (in particular, I'm gonna note the Mong Kok area... which has a population density of 340,000 per square mile and currently holding down the Guinness Book of World Records title for busiest district in the world... it really is incredible there and while it doesn't have the bright neon feel of NYC... there's also nothing quite like it in NYC or hardly anywhere else in the world for that matter. I sound like I'm contradicting the statement in my last post.. but let me explain... Times Square is probably more overwhelming for senses on the visual level... but I'm convinced that the pedestrian volume, etc. in Mong Kok is much more regular and intense. I will also say this, and it's a comment I heard elsewhere too... but while NYC's public spaces may be better acclaimed for their design, HK's are more used, also more quirky and interesting for people watching.. at least from what I saw while there.
Huge chunks of Manhattan empty out after people go home from work. At 10 pm on a weekday you can literally walk around large parts of Manhattan and feel like you have the place to yourself.
I lived around 2nd avenue briefly, and I remember how empty it would get after 9pm. You would see people, but literally four or five every block. Plus stores would shut down and while you have a 24/7 bodega here and there, you actually feel like the city is ready to go to bed.
Hong Kong on the other hand does not stop. You can walk around Hong Kong at 2am and still see thousands of people around, cars jamming the streets, Hong Kong is like Time Square all over the city. *excluding rural parts*
I stayed around Mong Kok, my god, I recall looking down the street at 3:48AM, it was Tuesday and seeing stores open, and thousands of people walking around like ants music etc.
Thanks for posting about the Kowloon Walled City, BNW! It's a general source of fascination to me as an urbanist as I'm sure it is to you. In Kawasaki, Japan, there is a video game arcade that is actually partial recreation of what it would've looked like inside. Of course, I'm sure there are certain places in HK that would give somewhat (though not fully) that feel too, but I didn't go to the Chungking Mansions either, or some of the other more photogenic apartments on account of their density, either... I know.. did I even really actually go to HK? Lol...
xiloponeums: So, I will say this: And maybe it's to help out the taxi industry in these cities in part as much as things quieting down? But, I noticed that in Mexico City, Beijing, Tokyo in particular... things, crazy intense as they were in the day, started quieting at about 10, and were quite quiet at midnight. Now, in HK, I think it was more of a round the clock city than those others, and perhaps (along with New Orleans actually-no... really!, the most 24-7 place I've spent a solid amount of time in). That said... even in HK, we caught the last train back to our station (not Mong Kok, but the one that is a few blocks to the west of there?), and that was at 1 AM. Our walk back to our place was also pretty quiet, though I did notice 7/11 was still open of course lol. But, NYC, you always hear about 24/7 everything (metro, food, people, etc.). Is that not all true? Would we have encountered more of a 24/7 population had we been walking around in say, LKF around that time?
Just wondering. Anyways, I think the poll reflects what is probably overall the reality. There are ways in which NYC is more vibrant... but overall I think HK would qualify more here, though I really need to spend a few days in NYC to determine.
My vote goes to Manhattan. I don't even look at the figures, I hate Hong Kong. First time in my life I want to leave. Utterly expensive for nothing except Chinese golden boys. I do like Americans, but bars in HK felt America to me, only foreigners. Just buildings buildings skyscrapers. This city has no soul. Yes you can have more nature if you take the bus 1hour. But I m not going to Hong Kong to avoid the city even if that 's a plus for it.
Screw the rankings, statistics and instagram, it's just a good place to catalyze Chinese money on the global market.
Sorry, I hated these place good to throw money in the air -I had a Rbnb in Yau ma tei- that I m incredibly biased. Metro was amazing.
Two of my favorite cities in the world! This is a very tough question to answer. Cavsfan did a great job of explaining the complexities, but basically Manhattan is a tiny slice of HK so it's hard to properly compare, especially since these comparisons are so hard any way.
I can be convinced either direction depending on the memories I'm thinking about lol. Curious to hear FactsKillRhetoric's thoughts
Quote:
Originally Posted by cavsfan137
1. New York City (I believe) is more connected and continuous at street level than Hong Kong is. Therefore, there is more of a continuous ability to walk around and see crowds. Even the densest parts of Hong Kong can feel relatively quiet at street level in my experience.
Hmm, I don't agree. Not with NYC being more connected, but that there is much in the way of "relative quiet at street level" in the core of HK.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cavsfan137
2. I don't exactly know, but my assumption, even in spite of rapid changes is that New York City would overall see more daytime visitors for work, etc. coming into Manhattan, and that while I think Hong Kong ranks highest on international overnight visitors, NYC still might have more "visitors" overall when considering domestic numbers.
Hard to say, but don't forget that there are quite a lot of folks commuting from outer regions of HK into the core "Manhattan" parallel areas. Plus international commuters from Shenzhen, Macau and Zhuhai.
Hong Kong
Central and Western 244,600 12.44 sq.km
Eastern 574,500 18.56 sq.km
Wan Chai 150,900 9.83 sq.km
Kowloon City 405,400 10.02 sq.km
Yau Tsim Mong 318,100 6.99 sq.km
Total 1,693,500 57.84 sq/km
Manhattan 1,628,701 59.1 sq/km
Manhattan is the more vibrant & busier place. In terms of which one feels more overbearing... They're both so massive, any difference a first timer would experience would be negligible.
Where Manhattan beats HK at is its substantially more urban. Its geographically one place and feels substantially bigger (because it is) and it's geography doesn't inhibit development. What Manhattan lacks in raw skyscrapers (first time saying that one).. it makes up for in its structural density/urban form that to this day is still unmatched by any city on the planet.
Where HK gaps Manhattan is the picturesque of its core. To this day, wether you are looking at Central from Kowloon or gazing the city from Victoria Peak... it's the most visually stunning city I've every been to.
I've been to both (have immediate family in Manhattan). They are both incredible cities but in the context of the criteria for this thread, NYC would take it imho
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