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It's interesting, this morning, I90 was closed from Sheridan clear down to Belvedere South Dakota. So I started looking at the Camera's along the Interstate. Sheridan showed roads clear and only wet in some spots. Piney Creek, usually has a environment all it's own, the road was clear and wet in spots. Buffalo, clear and wet in spots. Gillette, has some white on the road, but nothing of depth, only a light skiff of snow. Yet that road was all closed. Really not sure why.
This after noon, I talked with our Bountiful Baskets driver. Friday he drove right through Cheyenne, to Wheatland where he had about an hour delay and then continued on to Casper. Hmmmm. Road report said that I25 was closed, and yet this driver drove right through all of it to Casper. At Casper, he got stopped and had to spend the night because I-25 was closed. At 8:20 this morning, the Port of Entry sent them on their way, but yet the Road Reports on the DOT website, and the DM's they send me, still showed I-25 closed at noon, but at noon, that driver was setting up here in Ranchester.
Yes, I fully agree that travel can be hampered in the state of Wyoming, but I keep track of I-90 from SD state line to Montana state line. I also keep track of 14/16 from SD state line to Powell and Cody. 345, 338 and 339 also. Every one of those roads gets an alert or advisory, I get an email and a txt message on my phone. I have had that set up for a few years now. I get a txt messgae for an alert and another one when they open it back up again. Accidents, reduced visibility, drifting snow, closures, no light trailers, no high profile vehicles, black ice, etc.... All come in on my phone.
When we go 4-5 years between roads being closed for a full 24 hours, I call it "seldom". Can it happen? Sure it can, but so can a volcano eruption. To say it is common is being irresponsible. Once every 4 or 5 years is not commong and does not lend itself to letting people know how the travel is up in my area.
You sight a website that shows the cost of significant snow events. I really don't know what it costs and could actually care less because I simply pay attention to how it delays traffic and effects the welfare of people living in the area.
I am not sure why the DOT site showed the roads closed when people were still traveling, and traveling at the advice of the DOT scale personel.
A neighbor of mine had to travel to Minn today. Everything showed that the roads were closed. I told him to call me and I could update him on road closures, or opening and possibly help him pick other routes. This morning, he left anyhow, pulling a trailer behind his pickup. He called this evening, he's in Chamberlin South Dakota. No gates down, no highway patrol with road blocks. Although he did encounter some visibility problems between New Underwood and Cactus Flats and had to slow to about 40 miles per hour. So now I am not sure if I trust the road report of closures, being cleared in a timely manner off the DOT site.
"When we go 4-5 years between roads being closed for a full 24 hours, I call it "seldom". Can it happen? Sure it can, but so can a volcano eruption. To say it is common is being irresponsible. Once every 4 or 5 years is not commong and does not lend itself to letting people know how the travel is up in my area.
You sight a website that shows the cost of significant snow events. I really don't know what it costs and could actually care less because I simply pay attention to how it delays traffic and effects the welfare of people living in the area."
I think it's a stretch to compare a "volcano eruption" frequency potential of a multi millennia time frame to something that happens virtually every year a bit far-fetched.
At that, your comments suggest you haven't read the site/document that I referred to ... because if you had, one of the prominent event cost examined is the major road closures that accompanied these major storm events. To have dismissed this aspect of the financial impact upon Wyoming so casually when it's a big deal in the report is irresponsible, in my view.
As the study catalogues, these major storms impacting travel in Wyoming each year have been more frequent in the last few decades than the earlier years of the 20th century. I went through the listing, and it's noteworthy that most of the storms were recorded in the northern and central portions of Wyoming than here in the SE. Sheridan county itself doesn't show up that frequently with the big storm impacts, but what is documented is that so many of the storms have shut down regionally the NE, Central, and NW areas of the state. So, travel in the immediate area of Sheridan may have been OK for wintertime travel, but you were going to have a problem if you went very far from it in Wyoming.
This study was a factor in Wyoming public safety planning that has lead to the authorities closing the roads due to winter storm conditions at a lower threshold than years previously, and other public safety measures such as the variable speed limits with signage that we now have on some roads.
Previously, the state relied solely upon prudent judgement of the drivers out on the road in inclement conditons to set their own top speed. Unfortunately, not all the drivers out there exercise reasonable judgement of the conditions or their abilities/equipment, and there is also the factor of speed disparity causing accident situations. So the state now sets lowered maximum speeds and posts them according to conditions. The initial installations have been along the I-80 corridor, but the holdup to seeing these installed in other locations is funding. I expect that we'll be seeing these along the I-25 corridor next.
I've seen days when the roads were posted on WYROAD as closed due to conditions and travel was relatively easy for wintertime travel, especially with modern cars and appropriate tires. As well, I've seen days when the roads weren't closed and travel was treacherous in localized areas ... as evidenced by the numerous vehicles with off-road excursions needing assistance. With clients in the towing and salvage business statewide, it's business as usual for them and it's their financial pleasure to be so busy each winter. Unless you're a first responder or an insurance adjuster, you don't see the results of the storms and road conditions as I do because I'm calling on the businesses that make a living from providing service after the accidents. You can drive with little difficulty through an area and see nothing in the way of accidents, giving you a first-hand impression that the roads were OK ... but I'm calling upon the businesses in your area that have towed in the vehicles that you didn't see when the roads weren't in such good condition, which may have been a very short time before you went through the area ... or maybe shortly after your travels. With the rapidity of Wyoming storm fronts, it's all a matter of when/where timing. It's not uncommon for several Wyoming travelers to be a half-hour apart and to experience entirely different localized road conditions ranging from "that wasn't too bad" to "very treacherous". You might put this in an anecdotal perspective; ie, the highway patrolman that went through a stretch of road and determined it was pretty bad conditions and warranted a road closure for public safety may have been followed by a clearing weather condition shortly afterward.
Note, too, that many wintertime road incidents are not reported accidents ... if there's no injuries and only a single disabled/stuck vehicle ... the pro's and friendly neighbors that may assist aren't going to be calling the cops to write a ticket. Personally, I've pulled more than a few dozen stuck or off-road vehicles out in the last few decades. I'll bet that you, too, EH, have rendered similar assistance to folk in your travels around Wyoming ... without thinking that doing so was anything other than just being a good neighbor and wintertime normal activity.
IIRC, your "essential stuff" list for Wyoming winter travels on this forum a few years ago included appropriate emergency gear to include a tow strap, right? sounds to me like everyone being prepared for winter time road emergencies with their vehicles was part of your outlook for prudent winter time driving here. You didn't make an exception for the Sheridan area because it wasn't likely that the need would arise to use this stuff, did you? Fact is, you posted a pretty comprehensive list of wintertime travel emergency items that you deemed appropriate for all to carry when traveling in Wyoming winter conditions. I infer that you at one time determined that it was an appropriate and prudent expense for everybody to do so in Wyoming, to be as prepared for the winter driving conditions here as you have done with your own vehicle. Petard?
Where I'm going with this is what we take for granted stuff that happens as acceptable and we're prepared, willing and ready to render winter time help ... while for many in other areas of the USA, such behavior is not necessarily a common event. And that's where all of this discussion about driving in Wyoming becomes significant on a forum where folk from out of the area want to know what it's like to drive around here in the winter months ... because we see far more frequent intense changes of weather and localized road conditions than most of the USA in a locale where distances between services and assistance are on a scale totally different than in the areas where the folk are coming from. Darn few other places around the USA report vehicles getting blown off the slick roads like isn't uncommon to be reported in Wyoming .... high profile vehicle wind winter advisories here in Wyoming take on a whole different dimension than in most other places.
You're precious Sunsprit. I swear. Yup, there was a thread about packing emergency gear. If you remember, "WE" as in all the users put that list together on what they would deem needful for traveling in Wyoming. I don't carry any of that to "Travel" in Sheridan. I pack it when I am going to travel in other parts of the state. When I hauled railroaders I carried a spare coat and extra gloves and a change of socks in case mine got wet and I had to walk.
Today, the state of Wyoming closes roads when there is more than 6 snowflakes per mile. I saw the highway patrol close a road one day because visibility was down to a half mile. Prudent? I think not. But the fact remains that where I live, last year the roads closed maybe a dozen times, and each time was for a couple hours. Twice, it was for during the night, closing at sundown and open again before 8am. I-80 is a different story, I am sure. If you remember, I listed road closures one year in the weather forum, just to give people an idea of how often and for how long. I80 had 15 closures to each 1 closure on I90. Every quarter I travel to Sturgis. I've driven all the way there and back, on packed snow and ice, and the roads weren't closed. Full trip and I saw 2 vehicles in the ditch. I've driven I80 and in 10 miles I've seen 20 cars in the ditch. Big difference in the two areas. The winds South of Wheatland to the Colorado state line, and from Cheyenne, to about Wamsutter are much more treacherous that anywhere in the state. When is the last time you saw the "Chain Law" put into effect? Hardly ever used, as they go from Low visibility to closed. Or snowing to closed, and yet around here, it usually only during a front rolling through, and not for the duration of a storm.
You go ahead and read your articles, and believe what you will. I'll look out the window and watch the gates on the interstate.
Okay maybe it 's a glitch, but I just checked out this webcam for Bellefouche and got upside-down images..
Froggie, where did you click on those images. BelleFourche is in South Dakota. 59 is through Gillette, isn't it? On the list of the WyoDOT webcams, which line item did you click to get those images? Besides being upside down, something else is amiss. hahaha
Remember, it doesn't snow in Wyoming. It snows in Montana and blows across to Colorado.
Contrary to popular belief, the snow doesn't melt in Wyoming. The wind blows it around til it wears it out.
Froggie, where did you click on those images. BelleFourche is in South Dakota. 59 is through Gillette, isn't it? On the list of the WyoDOT webcams, which line item did you click to get those images? Besides being upside down, something else is amiss. hahaha
Remember, it doesn't snow in Wyoming. It snows in Montana and blows across to Colorado.
Contrary to popular belief, the snow doesn't melt in Wyoming. The wind blows it around til it wears it out.
There is no link that says Wyo59BelleFourche Laramie. There is a wyo59 Belle Fourche, but that is north of Gillette, not anywhere close to Laramie, that I can find. Am I missing something? Hwy 59 runs from Douglas, North thru Gillette and into the Northern Boundary of Wyoming.
There is no link that says Wyo59BelleFourche Laramie. There is a wyo59 Belle Fourche, but that is north of Gillette, not anywhere close to Laramie, that I can find. Am I missing something? Hwy 59 runs from Douglas, North thru Gillette and into the Northern Boundary of Wyoming.
WYO 59 Belle Fourche - mm 87 is the name of the webcam station (position?) but when I linked to it the "Laramie" bit came up automatically.. I didn't do that :P
No idea, but someone was messing with someone thereabouts.
WYO 59 Belle Fourche - mm 87 is the name of the webcam station (position?) but when I linked to it the "Laramie" bit came up automatically.. I didn't do that :P
No idea, but someone was messing with someone thereabouts.
I don't know, I am just not familiar with the Laramie area. I broke out my Gazetteer Atlas and can't find any Belle Fourch identifier nor a Hwy 59 anywhere around there. There is a Hwy 59 in the Northern half if the state and there is a Belle Fourche River, but I can't find where the river crosses 59 (which would probably be a good indicator hahaha), so I am just not sure.
On the DOT website, you can pull up a map and then turn on the cameras. I did that, but none of them are marked that way either.
The good part is, they are back to being right side up, which is a good indicator that the wind died down and it doesn't have the pole bent over any more.
Winter Storm Watch
URGENT - WINTER WEATHER MESSAGE
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE BILLINGS MT
321 PM MDT SAT OCT 12 2013
WYZ099-132130-
/O.NEW.KBYZ.WS.A.0009.131014T0600Z-131015T1800Z/
SHERIDAN FOOTHILLS-
INCLUDING THE LOCATIONS OF...SHERIDAN...DAYTON...RANCHESTER...
BIG HORN...STORY...CLEARMONT
321 PM MDT SAT OCT 12 2013
...WINTER STORM WATCH IN EFFECT FROM LATE SUNDAY NIGHT THROUGH
TUESDAY MORNING...
THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN BILLINGS HAS ISSUED A WINTER
STORM WATCH...WHICH IS IN EFFECT FROM LATE SUNDAY NIGHT THROUGH
TUESDAY MORNING.
* TIMING...SNOW...HEAVY AT TIMES...IS EXPECTED TO DEVELOP LATE
SUNDAY NIGHT AND CONTINUE INTO TUESDAY MORNING.
* SNOW ACCUMULATION...6 TO 10 INCHES POSSIBLE.
* WINDS...NORTH WINDS 10 TO 20 MPH.
* IMPACTS...HEAVY SNOW WILL CAUSE DIFFICULT TRAVEL CONDITIONS ON
AREAS ROADWAYS SUCH AS INTERSTATE 90 THROUGH SHERIDAN COUNTY.
COLD AND WET CONDITIONS WILL BE HAZARDOUS FOR UNPREPARED
HUNTERS.
PRECAUTIONARY/PREPAREDNESS ACTIONS...
A WINTER STORM WATCH IS ISSUED WHEN SEVERE WINTER WEATHER IS
POSSIBLE BUT NOT IMMINENT. AT THIS TIME THERE IS A POTENTIAL FOR
SIGNIFICANT SNOW. FUTURE DRIVING AND WALKING CONDITIONS MAY
BECOME HAZARDOUS SO IT IS IMPORTANT TO MONITOR THE LATEST
FORECASTS.
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Winter Storm Watch, Sheridan County, 10-12-2013
