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Due to current political situations you may be hear so much things about Turkey in these days. Unfortunately, politacally that country is worsening because Islamic ideas are dominating in that area.
But recent studies show that atheism is rising in the Turkey.
That website is belonged the one of the most famous atheist writer in the Turkey:
Thank you. Maybe I'm impatient. It too twenty years before western atheism had any kinds of organized presence. It was a few writers and sites, but those sites wewre the Start. A focus for those who has formerly thought they were the only ones. But the thing about atheism is that out of a hundred fellow believers, you may be surprised to find several of the on the same site before you found out who they were!
Islam really needs atheism. Not to eradicate the religion, much less all those superb artworks, though we do with about 80% less mosques, but to remove it's influence from society, education and politics.
Turkey of course WAS the Islamic empire from the 15th c when Constantinople fell to the conquest of the middle east and Egypt. I will resist the temptation to post the Polish Husarya at Vienna...for a minute or two at any rate,
and then the Muslim Empire was rolled back by France in the Middle east and Britain in India. Ataturk of course was probably why the British assault at Gallipoili failed - without him it could have succeeded. But the fact is that during that war (WWI) the Turkish empire collapsed (cue film music) and was divided between Britain (Iraq and Palestine) and France (Syria and Lebanon). In any case, Ataturk rolled back Islam from society and politics. I won't make a big son and dance about how wonderful he was, but Turkey was part of a surprisingly modern and secular fertile Crescent from Egypt (dealing with Israel after the war) through various rulers and dictators who after all were no worse than the average S American president.
Turks know what they have, and what they stand to lose. It's the same in Egypt and Tunisia. The two things are key - the people and the army. Comunism fell in Europe because the army did not support the CCCP in the end. if the people could work with the armies, they could come out for a secular life in politics, but need the army as if the islamic political dominanance can use the army to put the dissenters down, it will.
I don't think you buggered anything, but if there is anyone at all like me, it is hard to know how to even respond to authoritarian repression in other countries when it's proceeding so rapidly in our own. It's very depressing, and, like in Turkey, it could go either way for freethinkers.
It is of course worse in Turkey. I was there a few years ago (let's see ... 2013, a few months after the Gezi Park / Taksim Square protests). I saw it as an impressive secular democracy in a majority Muslim country, but without enough checks and balances, its institutions steadily eroding in the face of an autocratic administration. We've been around longer, and have stronger institutions with an incompetent, term-limited autocrat, and particularly if Trump is a one-term president we may dodge this particular bullet, maybe even in some scenarios be the stronger for it. But it's dicey. I wish the Turks well, and I hope things turn out better for us both.
On a lighter note, since visiting there, I can't get the lyrics of the old song out of my head, "It's Istanbul, not Constantinople ... why did Constantinople get the works? It's nobody's business but the Turks!"
I don't think you buggered anything, but if there is anyone at all like me, it is hard to know how to even respond to authoritarian repression in other countries when it's proceeding so rapidly in our own. It's very depressing, and, like in Turkey, it could go either way for freethinkers.
It is of course worse in Turkey. I was there a few years ago (let's see ... 2013, a few months after the Gezi Park / Taksim Square protests). I saw it as an impressive secular democracy in a majority Muslim country, but without enough checks and balances, its institutions steadily eroding in the face of an autocratic administration. We've been around longer, and have stronger institutions with an incompetent, term-limited autocrat, and particularly if Trump is a one-term president we may dodge this particular bullet, maybe even in some scenarios be the stronger for it. But it's dicey. I wish the Turks well, and I hope things turn out better for us both.
On a lighter note, since visiting there, I can't get the lyrics of the old song out of my head, "It's Istanbul, not Constantinople ... why did Constantinople get the works? It's nobody's business but the Turks!"
Att. Earworm joke pack.
Ps. I was going to save this for later, but the answer is not the earworm clinic for an extraction, but the Earworm Exchange.
'Good morning, could I exchange "Monday, Monday" for the scherzo of Bruckner's 6th?'
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 09-11-2017 at 09:33 AM..
Thank you. Maybe I'm impatient. It too twenty years before western atheism had any kinds of organized presence. It was a few writers and sites, but those sites wewre the Start. A focus for those who has formerly thought they were the only ones. But the thing about atheism is that out of a hundred fellow believers, you may be surprised to find several of the on the same site before you found out who they were!
Islam really needs atheism. Not to eradicate the religion, much less all those superb artworks, though we do with about 80% less mosques, but to remove it's influence from society, education and politics.
Turkey of course WAS the Islamic empire from the 15th c when Constantinople fell to the conquest of the middle east and Egypt. I will resist the temptation to post the Polish Husarya at Vienna...for a minute or two at any rate,
and then the Muslim Empire was rolled back by France in the Middle east and Britain in India. Ataturk of course was probably why the British assault at Gallipoili failed - without him it could have succeeded. But the fact is that during that war (WWI) the Turkish empire collapsed (cue film music) and was divided between Britain (Iraq and Palestine) and France (Syria and Lebanon). In any case, Ataturk rolled back Islam from society and politics. I won't make a big son and dance about how wonderful he was, but Turkey was part of a surprisingly modern and secular fertile Crescent from Egypt (dealing with Israel after the war) through various rulers and dictators who after all were no worse than the average S American president.
Turks know what they have, and what they stand to lose. It's the same in Egypt and Tunisia. The two things are key - the people and the army. Comunism fell in Europe because the army did not support the CCCP in the end. if the people could work with the armies, they could come out for a secular life in politics, but need the army as if the islamic political dominanance can use the army to put the dissenters down, it will.
Thank you for sharing with us your important views about history of Turkey, sir. Maybe you might think I'm really pessimistic but all I can say to you is, those Anatolian society never liked secular principles.
They still hate secularism, modernity, freedom or even science. These things don't mean anything for them because ignorance leading them since 1950s.
Ataturk and its party tried to educate them but after death of Ataturk (1938) they've failed.. That ignorance has revived with that Democratic Party (in 1950) which is its principles completely based on Islam and anti-republic ideology.. Since then Anatolian society have been living with ignorance.
I don't think you buggered anything, but if there is anyone at all like me, it is hard to know how to even respond to authoritarian repression in other countries when it's proceeding so rapidly in our own. It's very depressing, and, like in Turkey, it could go either way for freethinkers.
It is of course worse in Turkey. I was there a few years ago (let's see ... 2013, a few months after the Gezi Park / Taksim Square protests). I saw it as an impressive secular democracy in a majority Muslim country, but without enough checks and balances, its institutions steadily eroding in the face of an autocratic administration. We've been around longer, and have stronger institutions with an incompetent, term-limited autocrat, and particularly if Trump is a one-term president we may dodge this particular bullet, maybe even in some scenarios be the stronger for it. But it's dicey. I wish the Turks well, and I hope things turn out better for us both.
On a lighter note, since visiting there, I can't get the lyrics of the old song out of my head, "It's Istanbul, not Constantinople ... why did Constantinople get the works? It's nobody's business but the Turks!"
Thank you for sharing with us your important views about history of Turkey, sir. Maybe you might think I'm really pessimistic but all I can say to you is, those Anatolian society never liked secular principles.
They still hate secularism, modernity, freedom or even science. These things don't mean anything for them because ignorance leading them since 1950s.
Ataturk and its party tried to educate them but after death of Ataturk (1938) they've failed.. That ignorance has revived with that Democratic Party (in 1950) which is its principles completely based on Islam and anti-republic ideology.. Since then Anatolian society have been living with ignorance.
Thanks for your input. I hope it isn't as bad as that, but I don't know Turkey at all (other than the airline) so I'm in no position to judge.
Due to current political situations you may be hear so much things about Turkey in these days. Unfortunately, politacally that country is worsening because Islamic ideas are dominating in that area.
But recent studies show that atheism is rising in the Turkey.
That website is belonged the one of the most famous atheist writer in the Turkey:
You're obviously Turkish and I say - gobble, gobble. Ooooh am I going to be on the news?! pfttt
o wait - your name is "WhoCares"? Nevermind now I'm scared
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Looks like I buggered another thread.
Maybe you might think I'm really pessimistic but all I can say to you is, those Anatolian society never liked secular principles. 
pfttt
