State GOP group adopts anti-Common Core resolution (public school, live)

[aries4118]

Originally Posted by lastminutemom

I am beyond skeptical that we can stave off the flat-earthers in GA. I also believe, among some of those pushing back, that there is some fear that having national standards will show even further how behind many GA students are. (In fact, I believe that the original folks in GA that were against common core were against it for this reason.)

I am not arguing that CC is all that. And I agree that we need to professionalize educators.

And I think we need to address the issues surrounding the education of impoverished childrenm

But I believe that CC brings higher standards to GA and for at least some children that is a good thing (and therein lies the struggle I have)

Yes, it is scary (the flat-earthers).

I don't know--it's just misguided to implement Common Core just because we need to "do something."

Like I said above, it's snake in the grass.

Think about it (how it's being sold)...who wouldn't want to raise standards and make sure all U.S. students have similar, rich learning experiences?

But this is similar to how NCLB was sold...who wouldn't want to analyze and make sure all students are learning--and make sure schools/educators are doing their jobs and "help" them if they are struggling with their objectives?
(run-on, I know.)

And look what happened...

[AcidSnake]

Thank private capital for that.

Anytime someone mentions "reform" to me in this country, I usually think of three bullet points:


1. Crapping on the poor, lower middle class, working class, and anyone else not considered the "traditional American"

2. Getting rid of worker protections & rights

3. Finding a way to gain a profit at all costs, even to the point of worsening the problem that "privatization" was supposed to solve in the first place


- When the prison system was going through its "reform" situation, who benefitted? Companies like Corrections Corporation of America.

- When the parole/probation system was going through its "reform" period, who benefitted? Large Private Probation companies like Sentinel.

- When the U.S. Department of Defense wanted to find more "efficiencies" in how war was conducted, who did they turn to? Companies like Brown & Root and the controversial Blackwater/Xe/Academi(now THAT'S a mouthful).

- And now we have our Education System who as someone else pointed out, has been under fire since the Reagan era…and apparently, is now in some dire need of "reform". Who are the benefactors of this insanity in Georgia?

Such distinguished luminaries as K-12 Inc, co-founded by William "kill every black baby to lower crime" Bennett and…All Children Matter which is a 501(c) front group for hardcore conservatives like Alice Walton of Wal-Mart…who never saw a worker's rights policy that she actually liked.


Don't get me wrong, I am all for privatization where it does no harm to the regular American citizen, regardless of class and background. The Europeans do a pretty fine job of it in a lot of areas.

But America is like the "Bizarro Superman" of the western industrial world. Our country and especially the southern & red-state regions, always have a tendency to fumble the ball badly when it comes to privatization of taxpayer-funded services.

Sad part is, too many of us are brainwashed into thinking that we are number#1 because of our unique approach to privatization of formerly public services.

'Murica..gotta love it.

Originally Posted by aries4118

Yes, it is scary (the flat-earthers).

I don't know--it's just misguided to implement Common Core just because we need to "do something."

Like I said above, it's snake in the grass.

Think about it (how it's being sold)...who wouldn't want to raise standards and make sure all U.S. students have similar, rich learning experiences?

But this is similar to how NCLB was sold...who wouldn't want to analyze and make sure all students are learning--and make sure schools/educators are doing their jobs and "help" them if they are struggling with their objectives?
(run-on, I know.)

And look what happened...

[aries4118]

Originally Posted by LovelySummer

Look. I've got a guy who has been in the classroom with elementary school students every school day for almost 20 years I think he knows what he is talking about. He is not someone just studying policy or a talkinghead or a researcher. He is actually a teacher. One of the ones doing all the heavy lifting to try to carry out all of this stuff ppl think are good ideas...

No, you look. I think your supposed public school husband needs to step it up on his pedagogical knowledge--especially if he is erroneously educating his wife on what really matters in the classroom and moving students forward.

Originally Posted by LovelySummer

... Have you checked where we are ranking? Do you understand how we are faring internationally? How are you determining that we are doing fine?

...

Rankings? Really? Again--I am more than happy to give a professional development workshop on "rankings," "educational number-crunching," and other sensational lists for you and your husband. And for the record--I can truly assess international comparisons, not only due to the ability to dissect the "rankings," but also because I have extensive teaching/educational experience internationally and in two very different U.S. states. I completely understand how we are faring internationally--and I have the street cred and experience to back it up.

Originally Posted by LovelySummer

...

The only thing that I do not like about Common Core is that I think the math presumes that ppl need to understand math in an in-depth way and so it takes a deeper approach of trying to break everything down to give more understanding but most ppl are just not that smart so it will just confuse alot of kids (this from someone who has multiple engineering degrees). From someone who has actually worked as an engineer, I can tell you that most ppl will never need to have an in-depth understanding of math and rote learning to get the answer will work perfectly fine for them. Further, it is hard to really go deep into understanding math and I think this is y alot of kids are confused under CC.
...

What?!? Wow. Just wow. And you are incorrect. You need to leave this to the experts and professionals.

Originally Posted by LovelySummer

...CC is focused on the latter, not the former. It tries to at least move the country forward with more rigorous work. At least it tries...

And that is the problem/danger--
We should not implement the CC because "at least it tries." That is a weak reason and a weak argument. We've been there, done that--NCLB is a perfect example of how this viewpoint is totally misguided.

And "rigor" is a peculiar word. It's thrown around a lot now--interestingly. Anyway--there are better ways to challenge our students and move them forward than implementing the CC.

[toll_booth]

Now this is a legitimate reason to oppose Common Core--as well as other means of pushing more high-stakes testing in our classrooms.

[Cameron H]

Originally Posted by toll_booth

Now this is a legitimate reason to oppose Common Core--as well as other means of pushing more high-stakes testing in our classrooms.

Can you clarify? What is the legitimate reason identified in the article? It's clear that some teachers, teachers' organizations, and public school systems resist increased accountability and responsibility for measured educational performance. I also think these teachers often have legitimate gripes, though "opting out" of standardized testing doesn't strike me as a particularly promising approach. I don't think our children will be able to "opt out" of global competition once they're handed their diplomas.

[toll_booth]

Originally Posted by Cameron H

Can you clarify? What is the legitimate reason identified in the article? It's clear that some teachers, teachers' organizations, and public school systems resist increased accountability and responsibility for measured educational performance. I also think these teachers often have legitimate gripes, though "opting out" of standardized testing doesn't strike me as a particularly promising approach. I don't think our children will be able to "opt out" of global competition once they're handed their diplomas.

The problem with high-stakes testing starts from the fact that a multiple-choice test can only test so much. Combine that with the fact that you have companies investing millions of dollars into this for the sole purpose of boosting their bottom lines, and you have a problem.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by toll_booth

The Marietta Daily Journal - State GOP group adopts anti Common Core resolution

If someone could come up with a sensible argument for this opposition, I'm all ears. Because I didn't find one in there.

Georgia has always marched to the beat of its own drum.

[LovelySummer]

Aries, we will have to agree to disagree. I have presented our reasons for being pro-CC but I have not found anything in your posts to me but a bunch of piping about this vague mentions of "experience" that you have and how reform is bad (e.g., NCLB). That coupled with a bunch of boogey monster talk, anti-standards talk, and vague talk about there being a better way. None of that provides any basis for being against CC. With all due respect, your post below offers absolutely nothing of substance to the exchange. It is one thing to argue against points someone else raises but ot is something altogether different to lay bare your OWN proposal and let IT be subject to criticism. This is the same problem President Obama has with detractors. Since you know so much more than everybody else here who disagrees with you and more than the ppl who have put together CC, let's hear YOUR proposal. Lay it bare and let us evaluate it. Step forward. I'm all ears.

Originally Posted by aries4118

No, you look. I think your supposed public school husband needs to step it up on his pedagogical knowledge--especially if he is erroneously educating his wife on what really matters in the classroom and moving students forward.




Rankings? Really? Again--I am more than happy to give a professional development workshop on "rankings," "educational number-crunching," and other sensational lists for you and your husband. And for the record--I can truly assess international comparisons, not only due to the ability to dissect the "rankings," but also because I have extensive teaching/educational experience internationally and in two very different U.S. states. I completely understand how we are faring internationally--and I have the street cred and experience to back it up.




What?!? Wow. Just wow. And you are incorrect. You need to leave this to the experts and professionals.




And that is the problem/danger--
We should not implement the CC because "at least it tries." That is a weak reason and a weak argument. We've been there, done that--NCLB is a perfect example of how this viewpoint is totally misguided.

And "rigor" is a peculiar word. It's thrown around a lot now--interestingly. Anyway--there are better ways to challenge our students and move them forward than implementing the CC.

[aries4118]

Originally Posted by LovelySummer

Aries, we will have to agree to disagree. I have presented our reasons for being pro-CC but I have not found anything in your posts to me but a bunch of piping about this vague mentions of "experience" that you have and how reform is bad (e.g., NCLB). That coupled with a bunch of boogey monster talk, anti-standards talk, and vague talk about there being a better way. None of that provides any basis for being against CC. With all due respect, your post below offers absolutely nothing of substance to the exchange. It is one thing to argue against points someone else raises but ot is something altogether different to lay bare your OWN proposal and let IT be subject to criticism. This is the same problem President Obama has with detractors. Since you know so much more than everybody else here who disagrees with you and more than the ppl who have put together CC, let's hear YOUR proposal. Lay it bare and let us evaluate it. Step forward. I'm all ears.

Please don't personally attack.

And this is not about "agreeing or disagreeing"...because I'm not debating. I'm here to inform.

And for the record, I have stated my reasons fairly well starting at around page 4...and post #47 (along with post #51) outlines a proposal--based on experience and expertise.


Feel free to go back and review at your leisure.

[arjay57]

I don't disagree with the idea that all (or nearly all) students need some basic competencies in reading, math, science, literature, history, etc.

Whether this Common Core is the best way to get there I don't know.