The Coming Ponce De Leon Traffic Disaster. (Atlanta, Moreland: apartment, buses)

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by Atlwarrior

I wouldn't call it hype. I generally go the Whole Foods after work around 3:30 pm , and traffic is generally very heavy on Ponce around that time. I just wonder when Ponce City Market open how much worst it will be.

But more lanes for cars are not the answer. More transportation options that are better for denser areas are.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by jsvh

We need to get away from modifying residents behavior where we are doing things like using billions of tax dollars to build free super highways with a dozen+ lanes and requiring every property owner in the metro area to use their land and money to build parking spaces.

In all fairness, though, it seems like almost every part of the world is suburbanizing. People want their elbow room.

[Gulch]

Originally Posted by jsvh

You sure about that?

Yes.

Freedom Parkway in the late 80s

Not a freeway

GA400 I-85 to I-285 in early 90's

Built as a tollway

Ronald Reagan Parkway in mid 90's

Not in the City of Atlanta

GA316 is being actively converted to a freeway
GDOT working on plans to connect 675 and 400 under East Atlanta

The former isn't a new road (and is only adding interchanges in a few locations, the full-freeway conversion was dropped many years ago), the latter isn't even a serious plan and even if it was, it wouldn't happen for another 20+ years.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by Gulch

Yes.
Not a freeway
Built as a tollway
Not in the City of Atlanta
The former isn't a new road (and is only adding interchanges in a few locations, the full-freeway conversion was dropped many years ago), the latter isn't even a serious plan and even if it was, it wouldn't happen for another 20+ years.

free·way
ˈfrēˌwā
noun
1. an express highway, esp. one with controlled access.

Does any of this change the point?

[Gulch]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Does any of this change the point?

If your assertion is:

Originally Posted by jsvh

We need to get away from modifying residents behavior where we are doing things like using billions of tax dollars to build free super highways with a dozen+ lanes

Yes. I'm not a fan of that type of construction, but none of those highways you listed fall under the bolded criteria.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by arjay57

In all fairness, though, it seems like almost every part of the world is suburbanizing. People want their elbow room.

Perhaps. But it was not always that way. The original expressways were private and as a share of the economy, private highways were a bigger effort than our current interstate system. But now we are much worse than the rest of the world in collecting user fees on roads. Almost every expressway in China is tolled. Places that are ranked as the best logistics hubs around the world such as Singapore and London charge user fees just to get on their roads. Most of Sweden's roads are run by private associations.

The US needs to shift away from its radical freeway policy. And hopefully that is starting to happen with more HOT lanes and toll roads coming.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Perhaps. But it was not always that way. The original expressways were private and as a share of the economy, private highways were a bigger effort than our current interstate system. But now we are much worse than the rest of the world in collecting user fees on roads. Almost every expressway in China is tolled. Places that are ranked as the best logistics hubs around the world such as Singapore and London charge user fees just to get on their roads. Most of Sweden's roads are run by private associations.

The US needs to shift away from its radical freeway policy. And hopefully that is starting to happen with more HOT lanes and toll roads coming.

Your point is well taken and my apologies for not reading your post more carefully.

Yes, I strongly agree that we should move in the direction of more tolls. Let the user pay!

[OneTrickNet]

Originally Posted by jsvh

But more lanes for cars are not the answer. More transportation options that are better for denser areas are.

No one is even arguing for more lanes. This situation is where the city took lanes away that are desperately needed. And for what? A dozen bike riders? I don't think a small handful of people should warrant drastically changing existing roads. This is not going to make traffic better, but worse.

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by OneTrickNet

No one is even arguing for more lanes. This situation is where the city took lanes away that are desperately needed. And for what? A dozen bike riders? I don't think a small handful of people should warrant drastically changing existing roads. This is not going to make traffic better, but worse.

It should be noted that it's not just the City of Atlanta taking travel lanes away from cars on Ponce but it is also the State of Georgia as Ponce is officially a state-maintained and state-controlled route (signed with US Highways 29, 78 and 278, and Georgia Highways 8 and 10).

The City of Atlanta could not have taken away the travel lanes without the approval of the State of Georgia (the Georgia Department of Transportation).

But as has been noted before, the conversion of automobile travel lanes to bicycle lanes/tracks, wider sidewalks, multi-purpose lanes, trails and the like is not just a trend that is going on in Atlanta, but is a trend that is going on (and gaining stream) is large urban cities all over the nation.

[GeorgiaLakeSearch]

Originally Posted by OneTrickNet

No one is even arguing for more lanes. This situation is where the city took lanes away that are desperately needed. And for what? A dozen bike riders? I don't think a small handful of people should warrant drastically changing existing roads. This is not going to make traffic better, but worse.

I agree. This is for young hipsters/urban pioneers who want to have created some kind of "change." This is ideology based on emotion.