Anti-Seize On Wheel Hubs And Studs?

[turkey-head]

Originally Posted by jimmy12345678

My shop teacher in high school always taught us to put anti-seize on wheel hubs and a tiny bit on the studs when putting tires back on so they don't get rusty. But I've had several people sort of freak out when I told them that, basically being like "Oh no don't do that, the lug nuts will come loose!"

Well, I'd say people with that fear are people that don't properly tighten the lug nuts in the first place. They either run them down with the impact or with a 4 way, and that's not the proper way of doing things. IMO, as long as all the lug nuts are torqued to spec properly, there's no danger of a wheel coming loose. Been doing it since I was 15 (almost 23 now, with over 4 years of wrenching professionally) with every vehicle I take the wheels off of and have had ZERO problems with it over the years.

How do you guys feel about this?

P.S. I'm a big believer in anti-seize whenever possible. IMO rust is my enemy, anti-seize is my friend!

I ALWAYS use antiseize on the wheel studs and hubs of my own vehicles. Makes life much easier for obvious reasons. For that matter I use antiseize on most repairs I do on my own vehicles... because I know who's gonna have to loosen those bolts next time And no, antiseize will NOT cause bolts to loosen (assuming they are properly torqued, and the bolted joint is reasonably well designed).

Now there are some legitimate concerns to using antiseize... so it's a bit of a judgement call. Most engineers will tell you NOT to use it- because the torque specs weren't designed for it. But this is mostly about ass-covering... and has little bearing on whether or not the practice actually works. It's very easy to say "do only as the manufacturer says and never deviate". No liability is incurred- no math, research, or testing required. It's an easy answer that will generally yield an acceptable result. That doesn't mean it's the the *best* result... doesn't mean it's some celestial truth handed down from on high.

Torque specs are always designed for either a dry or lightly oiled joint. Antiseize is slicker than either case, and it will cause additional bolt stretch. Just how much is up for debate, although there have been studies on the matter (it changes the "nut factor" of the bolted joint). But anybody who has done any amount of wrenching knows very well that there's a LOT of variation in cleanliness, surface finish, etc. of bolts installed on any given repair. They are rarely going to be exactly the same as new parts installed in the factory- so techs are *already* getting bolt stretch results that are all over the map. For that matter I've seen lots of cases where torque specs don't even take into account the increased diameter of a washer-head bolt... yes bolt head size matters in torque spec calculation, and it's often neglected. Yet the machines still run- because all bolted joints have a significant safety factor designed in. So in my opinion (and yes I am qualified to have this opinion), you can put antiseize on nearly any bolted joint in existence, and if you torque it anywhere between 90-100% of the recommended torque value... it will work just fine.

That said... there are lawyers and angry customers to consider. Bolted joints do fail sometimes- even when perfectly installed. Bad designs, bad parts, unforeseen conditions... it happens. And *if* they find antiseize on the bolts, it may well get the blame for the failure. That may or may not be true (IMO it would rarely if ever be true), but that won't necessarily matter where lawsuits, customer relations, etc. are concerned. Those things can hinge on perception and opinion just as much as any 'facts'. So when I worked as a mechanic (16 years), I usually followed manufacturers recommendations just out of liability concerns. That usually means a light amount of oil on the threads. Sure I'd put antiseize on exhaust bolts and the like... but never on wheels. Not because it isn't a good practice. But because I'm not keen to take on unnecessary liabilities.

[turf3]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

I have broken the studs, but never broke a 4 way.

Not a 4 way, but the lug wrench that came with the car. It's hard to put a 6 foot piece of pipe on a 4 way as a cheater bar, hence the OE lug wrench.


I haven't broken a stud, but that doesn't mean it wouldn't eventually happen if I hadn't started using anti-seize on the threads and the center pilot.


As far as "most engineers", most mechanical engineers I have known (in a 35 year career as a mechanical engineer, working with many other MEs) really don't have a good understanding and background in the design of bolted joints. There are a lot of misconceptions out there, even among MEs.