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Jordan was the greatest in his era. Lebron is the greatest in his. That's all I have. I don't think I can compare the 2 fairly since they played at different times.
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Originally Posted by mangoarrow
Purchased by kids who had never even seen him play because they've been brainwashed by the Nike hype machine. They dont even know that he physically assaulted his teammates, bullied young players, froze out teammates for shooting, kept a mistress for a decade, stiffs waitresses, etc.
Born in the 70's & growing up in a small town across the Illinois border I will say that I hate Jordan. The 80's & 90's were a time when all the NBA playoff games were on regular TV. NBC, ABC, CBS. Most people stayed home & watched & talked about the games. Many of my friends & classmates cheered for Jordan, & I couldn't stand that egotistical prick. lol.
Lebron, on the other hand is extremely likable. I rarely cheer for the big dog, & usually pull for underdogs, but Lebron is that likable of a guy. How do you not like someone who rides (or used to ride) his bicycle to work?
Last edited by everwinter; 05-25-2015 at 09:11 AM..
Jordan was the greatest in his era. Lebron is the greatest in his. That's all I have. I don't think I can compare the 2 fairly since they played at different times.
Born in the 70's & growing up in a small town across the Illinois border I will say that I hate Jordan. The 80's & 90's were a time when all the NBA playoff games were on regular TV. NBC, ABC, CBS. Most people stayed home & watched & talked about the games. Many of my friends & classmates cheered for Jordan, & I couldn't stand that egotistical prick. lol.
Lebron, on the other hand is extremely likable. I rarely cheer for the big dog, & usually pull for underdogs, but Lebron is that likable of a guy. How do you not like someone who rides (or used to ride) his bicycle to work?
Well I agree that Lebron is more open and likable but I think part of Jordan that is not as 'likable' is that competitive do anything to win that led to 6 Rings. Charles Barkley was likable as player similar to Lebron but even more open and humorous and he also was extremely talented but that likable part was manifested in a lack of competitive championship mentality. That's my take.
Well I don't think Lebron has ever developed a couple of moves and floor locations that he couldn't be stopped which is something MJ had down....MJ knew that he could score from a certain spot and would use that in clutch situations. Lebron wants to drive to the basket but will shoot the 3 but without any consistency. The result is that Lebron can be stopped but MJ just could not be stopped. It's going to take a team effort to stop Lebron but it can be done. If Lebron ever develops a shot that can't be stopped, then you would have to put him in the same category with the greats.
Bird was the complete package from outside scorer, post up, clutch shots, outstanding passer, and could rebound and defend...he's top 5 for sure.
Magic developed his scoring as he progressed his NBA career and could certainly score whenever he really wanted to and he also was clutch, could defend, rebound, and of course possibly the best passer in NBA history. So he's definitely top 5 all time.
Lebron is a very very good player but I can't put him in the great category yet although he has a few years left and let's see what he does.
I agree with everything you said (glad to see SOMEBODY finally gets it). But the thing that frustrates me about LeBron is, with 12 years in the league already behind him, when will he finally develop that unstoppable shot, instead of just trying to rely on an inconsistent 3 pointer to bail his team out in clutch situations? What he REALLY needs to do is work on some reliable post moves and add a go to mid range shot to his game. If he had these two things, the outcome of some of the biggest games and series that he has lost would have been COMPLETELY different. He might even have more rings than he currently does now, and nobody would argue whether or not he belongs in the Top 5 or Top 10 with greats such as MJ, Magic, and Larry Bird.
Interesting comments by one of the "bad boys." I've read how some think LeBron would have been wrecked by the bad boy Pistons if he played in Jordan's era. Well, Laimbeer strongly disagrees.
I think he made the greatest argument you can make for Lebron---look at what he's taken to the Finals. He's a better teammate than Jordan was, I don't even know how that's debatable. And I'm not just talking about this season, look what he took to the Final as a 22 year old in 2007. Look how he performed in last year's Finals when the rest of the Heat quit on him. The knock on Lebron is that he doesn't have a clutch shot, and if he loses again all people will talk about is he's 2-4...
I admit, I'm not old enough to have saw Jordan play. But I have a hard time believing that he could do what Lebron has done with the same talent around him. Even on their respective championship teams, Jordan's teams were better! Lebron played with a sometimes hot/often not, past-his-prime Wade, and a Chris Bosh who will be a HOFer but probably isn't quite a top 50 all-time player....
It's a debate that'll last forever, but I truly believe in my heart, when Lebron retires and he's out of the league for good, only then will the general basketball public appreciate the magnitude of what he is, what he's done. He's as good as has ever been in this league, pound for pound, because like Lambeer said, while Jordan had the killer j and killer instinct that Lebron doesn't have, Lebron is a constant triple double threat and ultimate teammate who makes pm regular guys around him look like All-Stars. To that extent, I've only heard Magic with that kind of gift. It really is amazing watching Lebron work. Everyone knows he could average Jordan's scoring numbers if he wanted to. Instead, he's always been team first....
There really will never wlquite be a Lebron-type player again, just like therevqont quite be a Jordan. But what Lebron has brought to the game, his impact/influence, his domination, he is as much a champion as the game has ever seen. And he may lose this Finsls, but just getting here adds to his legend. And if he wins this Finals----people might as well end the debate, he will at worst be Jordan's equal...
Lebron will go down as a top three player ever without question IMO. Will he be considered better than Jordan? He has a shot. At the very least it will always be debatable. I heard talk today, either Mike and Mike or Cowherd about how Jordan is the better scorer. By what metric? Their career FG% are near identical 49.6 to 49.7. Jordan's is dragged down by his Wizard years while Lebron's is dragged down by coming into the league at 19.
Would any other player in the league have an effect on a team like Lebron does? The guy goes to any team in the east and they automatically become the favorite to go to the finals. I know the east is not as strong as the west, but what player in the west do you feel strongly could go to literally any team in the East and make them the favorite to win the conference? Put Lebron on an already decent or good West team and you are probably talking about one of the greatest teams of all time.
Interesting comments by one of the "bad boys." I've read how some think LeBron would have been wrecked by the bad boy Pistons if he played in Jordan's era. Well, Laimbeer strongly disagrees.
With Lebron being so unstoppable, I guess it begs the question - what did teams like the Spurs x 2, Mavs and Celtics do to stop him? Does Lebron sometimes shut himself down mentally? Those were all good teams but head-to-head they were no better than the Pistons at their peak.
Lebron will go down as a top three player ever without question IMO. Will he be considered better than Jordan? He has a shot. At the very least it will always be debatable. I heard talk today, either Mike and Mike or Cowherd about how Jordan is the better scorer. By what metric? Their career FG% are near identical 49.6 to 49.7. Jordan's is dragged down by his Wizard years while Lebron's is dragged down by coming into the league at 19.
Would any other player in the league have an effect on a team like Lebron does? The guy goes to any team in the east and they automatically become the favorite to go to the finals. I know the east is not as strong as the west, but what player in the west do you feel strongly could go to literally any team in the East and make them the favorite to win the conference? Put Lebron on an already decent or good West team and you are probably talking about one of the greatest teams of all time.
Or is it possible that he's been playing in the weakest conference arguably in league history? I mean had any conference been as weak from top to bottom?
Would he be so dominant had he played in the west the last 10 years?
Tim Duncan has
Lebron will go down as a top three player ever without question IMO. Will he be considered better than Jordan? He has a shot. At the very least it will always be debatable. I heard talk today, either Mike and Mike or Cowherd about how Jordan is the better scorer. By what metric? Their career FG% are near identical 49.6 to 49.7. Jordan's is dragged down by his Wizard years while Lebron's is dragged down by coming into the league at 19.
Would any other player in the league have an effect on a team like Lebron does? The guy goes to any team in the east and they automatically become the favorite to go to the finals. I know the east is not as strong as the west, but what player in the west do you feel strongly could go to literally any team in the East and make them the favorite to win the conference? Put Lebron on an already decent or good West team and you are probably talking about one of the greatest teams of all time.
As pointed out - the question is how are Lebron's odds of making the finals boosted by playing in such a weak conference? The Cavs played the East's best team and they didn't put up enough fight to break through a wet paper bag. Meanwhile out west, the same Spurs team that nearly beat the Heat in '13 and slaughtered them in '14 was taken out in the first round this year. Would this year's Cavs team get through say the Spurs, Clippers and Warriors to make the finals? Could they beat the best team in the West with Kyrie not playing as they did with the Hawks? Lebron is 2-3 and a bang-bang play away from being 1-4 against the West in the playoffs.
Would any other player in the league have an effect on a team like Lebron does? The guy goes to any team in the east and they automatically become the favorite to go to the finals. I know the east is not as strong as the west, but what player in the west do you feel strongly could go to literally any team in the East and make them the favorite to win the conference? Put Lebron on an already decent or good West team and you are probably talking about one of the greatest teams of all time.
There is nobody in the league, neither right now or in recent memory (last 5 years; Kobe of the late-00s is possible, but besides him no one since Jordan has retired)---I repeat, NOBODY in the West who could come to the East and turn a team into perennial conference champions. Clearly, neither Harden nor Howard; not Chris Paul; Durant and Curry, at this stage of their careers, are not of the level yet--we saw what Durant looks like without his "Robin" last season.
Duncan in his prime couldn't have done it. I know this is a very unpopular statement. I give Duncan his due as possibly the best 4 of all time, but he is very much a system player. He didn't have to build a reputation as a winner from mediocre management/coaching/teammates the way Lebron has. For that matter, he didn't come in with the amount of hype and pressure Lebron has. Dirk in his prime couldn't have done it, Nash couldn't have, and so on. Only Kobe in his late-00s form, as an individual, is debatable. It isn't comparable, so basically, I agree with you.
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