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The Soviet union, If I remember correctly, about 20 or 30 years ago, decided to institute a 10 day work week, beings they did not believe in Hawyaw, the Sabbath did not apply to them, or so they thought, and the results were that there was a significant increase in violence, murders and even the work animals were attacking their masters and each other...Therefore, proving that no matter whether they believed in Hawyaw or not, their violation of His commandment brought dire consequences and proving that the Sabbath was made for the man, not man for the Sabbath...So, when asked whether to observe the Sabbath or not, one man holds one day above another, let each be convinced in his own mind...IOW, it is the intention of Hawyaw for man to work 6 days and rest the 7th...It does not matter which day, but, one must rest every 7 days...
Bolded by Verna.
The gospel according to Richard...this ^^^ is a lie from the pit of hell Richard.
I will not even ask you to prove this in Scripture because you cannot prove this lie with Scripture...no...you're just another one who twists every passage he can get his hands onto...I believe you just type to hear the keys tap.
Keep believing that lie...oh...and by the way...keep teaching others that lie too...see where it gets you on Judgement Day....when you stand before the King...our Righteous Judge...it will not go well !
You really have no isea what I know about linguistisa...I've been involved in linguistics since the age of 8, delving into every nook and crany, I am now 46...Reading what you have written here, I have seen and read about before...It matters not what you think you know regarding my academic status...However, regarding yours, I know all to well, for I have studied these things with an open mind searching for Truth of Hawyaw...You seem relatively new to JW...
LOL! Crowing about your credentials and demeaning mine is just tilting at windmills. However, it is wise of you to not actually post anymore of your "academic" views on John 1:1c. "I read it and it says...." just does not satisfy all of us as it does you, no matter how much you crow.
καὶ θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος
kai theos en ho logos
and a god was the word
This is the ACCURATE interlinear!
All authoritative references agree that theos, without the difinitive article ho, is lexically translated as "a god". Even the theological references have to acknowledge this fact although they keep the admission subdued because their customers are trinitarians, as are their authors. No one would buy their materials if they did not provide support for THEIR beliefs.
Strong’s Concordance theos: God, a god
Original Word: θεός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine; Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: theos
Phonetic Spelling: (theh'-os)
Short Definition: God, a god
Definition: (a) God, (b) a god, generally.
Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance
the supreme Divinity, God, godly. Of uncertain affinity; a deity, especially (with ho) the supreme Divinity; figuratively, a magistrate; by Hebraism, very -- X exceeding, God, god(-ly, -ward).
see GREEK ho
Vine's Expository Dictionary
<1,,2316,theos>
(1) in the polytheism of the Greeks, denoted "a god or deity,"....
Theologians do not make this information obvious; they place their trinitarian bias in the foreground and unexplained. However, they are still required to include the lexically accurate information to maintain a semblance of academic integrity. If you look to any credible academic Koine Greek lexicon you will find no reference to theos (without definate article ho) lexically identified with the personal pronoun God.
As is readily obvious to any one with eyes, John excluded the ho (the definite article) before theos in John 1:1c.
Anytime we see this translated as “God” in an interlinear we know to question their credibility: they have not produced an lexically accurate interlinear, but have already interjected their trinitarian interpretation.
Once this FACT about the lexically accurate John 1:1c is acknowledged there is much to discuss about the work of translation. However, as long as people deny what John has actually written, there is no basis for an academic discussion of it's accurate translation.
Last edited by BWW1962; 12-29-2011 at 11:33 AM..
Reason: format
Christianity is the belief in Jesus and that he's the only way to Heaven. There is no Christian "church" that guides our thoughts, beliefs, etc. Christians read the Bible and do what it says (or at least, they should).
On the other hand, the JW church is controlled by the Watchtower. An organization that tells them what to believe, how to act, what they must do to please God, etc.
There are offshoots of Christianity that have organizations leading the way, but true Christianity is a personal relationship between Jesus as my savior and I. Period. No organization telling me what I need to know or translating the Bible for me. No organization constantly changing the beliefs of the church (VERY common in the JW church).
It's the difference between religion and Faith. Christians have a personal relationship with Jesus and can read the Bible on their own. JW members have a personal relationship with the watchtower, who tells them what to believe.
I opt for speaking directly to the head honcho myself. Not someone claiming they know better than I what Jesus wants for my life.
Bolded by Verna.
The gospel according to Richard...this ^^^ is a lie from the pit of hell Richard.
I will not even ask you to prove this in Scripture because you cannot prove this lie with Scripture...no...you're just another one who twists every passage he can get his hands onto...I believe you just type to hear the keys tap.
Keep believing that lie...oh...and by the way...keep teaching others that lie too...see where it gets you on Judgement Day....when you stand before the King...our Righteous Judge...it will not go well !
Don't even bother answering this.
Why don't you tell me what the Sabbath means to you...That would be nice...
For six days you may perform melachah, but the seventh day is a complete Sabbath, holy to the L-RD ... it is an eternal sign that in six days, the L-RD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested and was refreshed. -Exodus 31:15-17
LOL! Crowing about your credentials and demeaning mine is just tilting at windmills. However, it is wise of you to not actually post anymore of your "academic" views on John 1:1c. "I read it and it says...." just does not satisfy all of us as it does you, no matter how much you crow.
καὶ θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος
kai theos en ho logos
and a god was the word
This is the ACCURATE interlinear!
All authoritative references agree that theos, without the difinitive article ho, is lexically translated as "a god". Even the theological references have to acknowledge this fact although they keep the admission subdued because their customers are trinitarians, as are their authors. No one would buy their materials if they did not provide support for THEIR beliefs.
Strong’s Concordance theos: God, a god
Original Word: θεός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine; Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: theos
Phonetic Spelling: (theh'-os)
Short Definition: God, a god
Definition: (a) God, (b) a god, generally.
Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance
the supreme Divinity, God, godly. Of uncertain affinity; a deity, especially (with ho) the supreme Divinity; figuratively, a magistrate; by Hebraism, very -- X exceeding, God, god(-ly, -ward).
see GREEK ho
Vine's Expository Dictionary
<1,,2316,theos>
(1) in the polytheism of the Greeks, denoted "a god or deity,"....
Theologians do not make this information obvious; they place their trinitarian bias in the foreground and unexplained. However, they are still required to include the lexically accurate information to maintain a semblance of academic integrity. If you look to any credible academic Koine Greek lexicon you will find no reference to theos (without definate article ho) lexically identified with the personal pronoun God.
As is readily obvious to any one with eyes, John excluded the ho (the definite article) before theos in John 1:1c.
Anytime we see this translated as “God†in an interlinear we know to question their credibility: they have not produced an lexically accurate interlinear, but have already interjected their trinitarian interpretation.
Once this FACT about the lexically accurate John 1:1c is acknowledged there is much to discuss about the work of translation. However, as long as people deny what John has actually written, there is no basis for an academic discussion of it's accurate translation.
θεός
theos
theh'-os
Of uncertain affinity; a deity, especially (with G3588) the supreme Divinity; figuratively a magistrate; by Hebraism very: - X exceeding, God, god [-ly, -ward].
G3588
ο, η, τό
ho hē to
ho, hay, to
The masculine, feminine (second) and neuter (third) forms, in all their inflections; the definite article; the (sometimes to be supplied, at others omitted, in English idiom): - the, this, that, one, he, she, it, etc.
Joh 1:18 θεον ουδεις εωρακεν πωποτε TSBο μονογενης Aθεος TSBυιος ο ων εις τον κολπον του πατρος εκεινος εξηγησατο
One sees theon and theos in this verse, It is well known who it is speaking of, so where are the definite articles...Neither has them...How long have you been a witness?....
Christianity is the belief in Jesus and that he's the only way to Heaven. There is no Christian "church" that guides our thoughts, beliefs, etc. Christians read the Bible and do what it says (or at least, they should).
On the other hand, the JW church is controlled by the Watchtower. An organization that tells them what to believe, how to act, what they must do to please God, etc.
There are offshoots of Christianity that have organizations leading the way, but true Christianity is a personal relationship between Jesus as my savior and I. Period. No organization telling me what I need to know or translating the Bible for me. No organization constantly changing the beliefs of the church (VERY common in the JW church).
It's the difference between religion and Faith. Christians have a personal relationship with Jesus and can read the Bible on their own. JW members have a personal relationship with the watchtower, who tells them what to believe.
I opt for speaking directly to the head honcho myself. Not someone claiming they know better than I what Jesus wants for my life.
And let us not forget the fact that Charles Taze Russel, the founder of the Russellites, was a Mason...Which the JWs are vehemently against...funny...
Why don't you tell me what the Sabbath means to you...That would be nice...
For six days you may perform melachah, but the seventh day is a complete Sabbath, holy to the L-RD ... it is an eternal sign that in six days, the L-RD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested and was refreshed. -Exodus 31:15-17
Don't play with me......I know you have to be smarter than this...
Richard, Pay attention... ...focus... ...o.k, are you listening ? ...shhhh ! ...listen... good boy ... now...
......grab your dictionary, now...go to the S's...now, look for Sa...very good...now, look for Sab...then find Sabb...now, find Sabba...next, find Sabbat...finally, find Sabbath...put your glasses on SO YOU CAN READ IT ! ...now read with me......ready !...begin......
Sabbath n. Abbr S., Sab. 1.The SEVENTH DAY OF THE WEEK, SATURDAY, named in the TEN COMMANDMENTS as the day OF REST and WORSHIP and observed by the Jews and some Christian sects.
The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language.
Did you get that Richard ? Sabbath, by its very definition, means SATURDAY !
...and now, lets look together what the word Sabbath means ... ready ?...
4521 sabaton; of Hebrew; the Sabbath (i.e. Shabbath), or DAY OF WEEKLY REPOSE FROM SECULAR AVOCATIONS (also the OBSERVANCE or institution itself); by extens. a se'nnight, i.e. the interval between two Sabbaths; likewise the plur. in all the above applications; -sabbath (day), week.
STRONG'S EXHAUSTIVE (I'll say !) CONCORDANCE of the Bible.
God Bless you Richard...and may he bless you with spiritual "EYESIGHT" and understanding...and the wisdom to live it ! ! !
Don't play with me......I know you have to be smarter than this...
Richard, Pay attention... ...focus... ...o.k, are you listening ? ...shhhh ! ...listen... good boy ... now...
......grab your dictionary, now...go to the S's...now, look for Sa...very good...now, look for Sab...then find Sabb...now, find Sabba...next, find Sabbat...finally, find Sabbath...put your glasses on SO YOU CAN READ IT ! ...now read with me......ready !...begin......
Sabbath n. Abbr S., Sab. 1.The SEVENTH DAY OF THE WEEK, SATURDAY, named in the TEN COMMANDMENTS as the day OF REST and WORSHIP and observed by the Jews and some Christian sects.
The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language.
Did you get that Richard ? Sabbath, by its very definition, means SATURDAY !
...and now, lets look together what the word Sabbath means ... ready ?...
4521 sabaton; of Hebrew; the Sabbath (i.e. Shabbath), or DAY OF WEEKLY REPOSE FROM SECULAR AVOCATIONS (also the OBSERVANCE or institution itself); by extens. a se'nnight, i.e. the interval between two Sabbaths; likewise the plur. in all the above applications; -sabbath (day), week.
STRONG'S EXHAUSTIVE (I'll say !) CONCORDANCE of the Bible.
God Bless you Richard...and may he bless you with spiritual "EYESIGHT" and understanding...and the wisdom to live it ! ! !
In Christ,
Verna.
A gentle answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger. (Proverbs 15:1)
I've heard most groups of Christianity make this claim at some time or another, especially Conservatives. They essentially believe if you don't accept things exactly as they do you're not a "True Christian".
JWs aren't exactly the only ones who use that absurd fallacy.
Best and most direct answer I've read in this thread to the Originally stated question! Every time I see this thread pop up again, I expect it to be about the Jehovah's Witness church - but it goes way off from that into all sorts of highways and bi-ways.
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answering this. 
...focus... 
...shhhh ! ...listen... good boy ... now...
...
say !) CONCORDANCE of the Bible.
