News, Heaven Is Real: A Doctor’s Experience With the Afterlife. (hell, testimonies)

[JD59]

As a neurosurgeon, I did not believe in the phenomenon of near-death experiences. I grew up in a scientific world, the son of a neurosurgeon. I followed my father’s path and became an academic neurosurgeon, teaching at Harvard Medical School and other universities. I understand what happens to the brain when people are near death, and I had always believed there were good scientific explanations for the heavenly out-of-body journeys described by those who narrowly escaped death.

Proof of Heaven: A Doctor

[MysticPhD]

Originally Posted by John1960

As a neurosurgeon, I did not believe in the phenomenon of near-death experiences. I grew up in a scientific world, the son of a neurosurgeon. I followed my father’s path and became an academic neurosurgeon, teaching at Harvard Medical School and other universities. I understand what happens to the brain when people are near death, and I had always believed there were good scientific explanations for the heavenly out-of-body journeys described by those who narrowly escaped death.

Proof of Heaven: A Doctor

This doctor's experience over 7 days mirrors my experiences in deep meditation over 40+ years but for much shorter durations. His experiences were far more visual than mine (I have always lacked the ability to visualize). I cannot therefore confirm his visual descriptions of anything. The multiple personalities/entities (what I experience as a multitude or crowd) all unified in a oneness captures my sense of it as well. It has always been very difficult for me to verbalize or characterize the experiences . . . because as he eloquently describes it . . . it is not through language or thought as we know it . . . but through "knowing" in a much more direct and intimate way. His description of the communication process (equivalent to questions and answers) is again direct . . . not involving the normal processes we are familiar with. But everything . . . including the questions/answers . . . are unequivocal and unmistakable with a "knowing" and certainty unobtainable in our daily life here. I do not know him nor do I have any way to confirm his story or credentials. But his descriptions track so closely to my experiences, I am confident that he genuinely experienced them.

[SeekerSA]

Narrowly escaped death = not dead. There are only these visions with a living brain.

Mods move this to the general forum please.

[11thHour]

Ah, NDE's, that some people take as proof of an afterlife. Well here's the thing. What supposedly entered the heavenly realm upon their 'near death?' Their soul, correct? But their brain, ie their memory, did no such thing. So tell me, how would a person, upon coming back from the brink, remember what their soul experienced? Their bodies memory is a purely physical phenomenon. We all agree that is it a function of our brain, right? I no way whatsoever did their brain accompany their soul on this journey, nor see what their soul supposedly saw, but somehow is able to recall what their soul saw? Huh? This to me is just more evidence that all these NDE's are purely a result of the process of the brain dying, thus why their brain is able to remember these visions, as it actually experienced the chemical processes that caused them.

[.sparrow.]

Originally Posted by 11thHour

Ah, NDE's, that some people take as proof of an afterlife. Well here's the thing. What supposedly entered the heavenly realm upon their 'near death?' Their soul, correct? But their brain, ie their memory, did no such thing. So tell me, how would a person, upon coming back from the brink, remember what their soul experienced? Their bodies memory is a purely physical phenomenon. We all agree that is it a function of our brain, right? I no way whatsoever did their brain accompany their soul on this journey, nor see what their soul supposedly saw, but somehow is able to recall what their soul saw? Huh? This to me is just more evidence that all these NDE's are purely a result of the process of the brain dying, thus why their brain is able to remember these visions, as it actually experienced the chemical processes that caused them.

How do you explain all of the accounts of people watching what happened to their bodies and giving specific details etc.?

Also, you bring up a good question about the brain/spirit. You said that the bodies memory is a purely physical phenomenon. But who is to say that the spirit does not retain memory? This is a stupid analogy, but I'm rushed for time, it's almost as if the body/brain is an old fashioned telephone and the spirit is a cell phone. The spirit does not need to be wired into the body, just as a cell phone does not need to be wired into the wall in order to function. Perhaps our spirits are who we REALLY are and this body/brain is just a necessary clunky old vehicle that we must ride around in until it becomes "obsolete" when we die and our spirits are set free.

While the brain is unbelievably complex and intricate, maybe it cannot even compare to the complexity of our spirit? Of course, we can't measure the spirit, we can't take it out and look at it and study it. (And I know some/many will say "we don't even know if the spirit even exists!!" I know.. I get that argument, trust me. lol. I'm just putting some ideas out there.)

Another thing that makes me wonder, is with some supernatural experiences, perhaps it is not our physical brain experiencing but rather our spirit. Some have seen "angels" (or spirit beings or whatever you want to call them) on occasion, for instance. Perhaps it was their spirit that was overriding their brain in that moment in time that saw the "angel". hmmmmm. Well, just pondering here..

[thrillobyte]

.sparrow beat me to the punch.

I could dismiss every single NDE as pure trash were it not for "scientifically verified" evidence that thousands of these people were able to recount exact details of what went on and who said what in the operating room when they were hooked up to every monitoring device imaginable showing their pulse (zero) heartbeat (zero) brainwave (flat) blood oxygenation (non-existent)--in other words "deader than a doornail". If atheist doctors are convinced by these events that something is going on beyond the realm of our physical world that's good enough for me and for millions of others.

Feeble retorts like, "It was their brain producing these visions" is even more ridiculous than what the skeptics claim is ridiculous.

If you get impatient with the video below just jump to minute 7:00. That's where it really gets interesting.


Famous Cardiac Surgeon's Stories of Near Death Experiences in Surgery - YouTube

[jghorton]

NDE's are indeed fascinating, but, how is it that a doctor's assurance of heaven is required to persuade some people.... but, God's Word is not sufficient??

If so, where then does one's 'faith' lie? .... in human wisdom -- or in God?

[thrillobyte]

Originally Posted by jghorton

NDE's are indeed fascinating, but, how is it that a doctor's assurance of heaven is required to persuade some people.... but, God's Word is not sufficient??

If so, where then does one's 'faith' lie? .... in human wisdom -- or in God?

Quite simply because God's Word is so abstract that most ordinary people cannot relate to it, but they CAN relate to a physician's objective description of a supernatural event without any BS religious personal convictions bleeding into the description of events.

Maurice Rawlings was a perfect example of a Dr. who tried to use his position of power to push his own personal religious agenda of eternal torment. Consequently, nearly all of the stories in his books have been discredited as fabrications or pure hokum. He was on a mission to save people from the horrible fate he believed waits for sinners beyond this life and thought that lies justified the end, namely saving people from eternal hellfire.

[Zero 7]

These are all recent snippets from http://www.nderf.org/NDERF/NDE_Archives/NDERF_NDEs.htm

Gwen J NDE.....

"couldn't initially understand why I had to come back to this physical body. What I remembered was

that I had completely merged again with God.

It was a void, darkness, but unconditional love.

I was no longer a separate being. I was where I belonged, where I came from.

It was perfect. When it was time to return I had to again differentiate from God and become a separate

soul again.

Yet I was still a part of God. Then I was back on Earth in this physical body."

Chantal L NDE.....

"I found myself floating, like in a cloud. There were no buildings, no structures, just light and love.

I was so wonderfully well!

All of my pain and worries just melted away. I was being bathed in love. All of a sudden, I noticed

movement to my left.

It was a light coming towards me. As I looked at it, I noticed that this light was a being, a Being of

Light!..."

Anna W NDE.....

"She said it wasn't my time to come with them, but that they were here to help me with my pain. So

they 'pulled' me out of my body and I floated straight upward a short distance,

where I stopped and remained hovering there. As soon as I left my body, everything was tranquil and I

felt no more pain.

My mother-in-law pointed to a whitish translucent cord attached at one end to the floating "me," and at

the other end, to my body on the bed. She instructed me to be careful not to break that cord,

as I was going to need it to get back into my body. From above, I could clearly see my husband and the

doctors and nurses gathered around my bed. The room was filled with a beautiful bright white light.

Looking through this white light, I could see vivid colors, as well as the ordinary objects in the room. I

remained floating serenely above my body until I was taken to the operating theater. Once there,

my mother-in-law and grandmother vanished. In their place, beside my bed, appeared my late

grandfather, clad in a white coat. (He had been a general practitioner/ doctor during his life. However,

I had never met him, as he had died when I was seven years old!) He spoke to me about the details of

my medical issues and pointed out in terms of

centimeters exactly where in my abdomen the three main internal infections were located.

He specified this medical information in Latin (I don't speak Latin, but I understood him) and then he,

too, disappeared.

I immediately re-entered my body, and so I was able to repeat everything my grandfather had just told

me, while the surgeon wrote down detailed notes and my husband listened.

A couple of days after the (successful) surgery, I talked with the surgeon.

He said he had never spoken to anyone in my condition, (CRP327 – i.e. in such a lot of pain), who had

been able to talk so clearly.

Also he had never had access before a surgery to such accurate information on where to find the main

infected areas.

He said that my grandfather's directions, had told him to move certain internal organs aside to get to

the third infected location. Without my grandfather's information, he could easily have missed it,

especially since at admission, they had diagnosed me with only two internal infections, not three. It was

exactly as my grandfather had described it.

He had said that there was an area of infected fluid in a "hidden" part of my pelvis and had described,

in terms of centimeters, exactly where to drain this infected fluid.

It was beneath a bleeding point."

Kathi S NDE .....

"I then left my body, and 'floated' to the ceiling, at the opposite side of the room. I remember the very

large clock - white with black numbers and hands. I have since forgotten the time, but for years, I

could remember the exact second hand placement.

I sat next to the clock (not on anything, just floating).

I was enveloped in a warm happy wonderful glow. Unconditional love. total peace. I felt the glow of

the light surrounding me, and could see a pinpoint of light off to my side (as if this is where the source

was). I felt it more than anything, knowing it was a glow of love and acceptance more than anything

else."

Hard to imagine, especially after reading hundreds if not thousands of testimonies, these are made up, of the devil or the mind playing tricks.

Personally, I have no fear of death. I'm also beginning to believe just being in a physical body is akin to being in a prison cell. My 2 cents.

[FaceInTheCrowd]

Personal experience will do more than a million 'doctor's studies'.
There is something more...what it is...I do not know.