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I worked at Busch Gardens long in the past - and nearby was a large Budweiser facility. August Busch II was the CEO at the time. Every so often, his son AB III would come to the area with all of the pomp and circumstance. He was treated as if he owned the company. Did he? No. AB II was in charge. When AB III visited, it was clearly treated as though AB II was there.
There was one owner - not two. The same relational principle applies to God.
Wow. I must say that's the first time I've ever seen someone in the booze business used to illustrate something about God.
It seems to me that the problem is the attempt to apply physical limitations to spiritual perceptions. "Trinity" is a mystical concept, and if it doesn't work for you, it is not a requirement to receive the love of God through His Son, regardless of what hard line orthodoxy proponents say.
Exactly. Put the racks and the iron maidens away! And all the other torture devices. Heavens to Betsy!
God is limitless and unchanging not Jesus a mere man.
Jesus said, "Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, 'I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.'" - If Jesus is God then why must he go to his father, why would he have a God if he where God? My response, it's because he is not God he is just Gods begotten child.
Good post - but as with everything within and outside of the scriptures, we could go round and round in circles for eons arguing and never "decide". It's the same with all the big dogmas. And I suppose we could spend our time in worse ways. But probably better ways as well. Just wondering out loud if the truth is that people mostly just enjoy arguing.
With regards to Christianity claim of being a monotheism religion, I have always wondered how that is possibly true given the fact of the existence of trinity - God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit?
Again most Christians though are followers of Jesus Christ to the core. Jesus is an active part and God and Holy Spirit are treated passively. To me this speaks of a preference of one god against all the others.
That aside, in most writings in the Gospels, Jesus failed to assign himself the role of being God or a god and instead of that maintained that he was "The Son of Man ......"; an assertion that is found in nearly all of the Gospel.
His God status proliferated mostly in other latter books after Gospel. Nearly most of the Christians you meet talk mostly about Christ and less of God and that too is not helped by the fact that most books that have been written in modern days strive to tell us more of Jesus and God on periphery. When he resurrected, he talked about ushering in a new helper (not the holy spirit until the day of Pentecost).
Can those that are enlightened elaborate for us so that we can tell where to to truly file Christianity. Monotheism or Polytheism given the fact that we must if we maintain Christianity as it is today emerge with picture of monotheism that does not ignore the other two Gods?
Those same Christians talk about God the Son because in him all religion in it's earthly existence take shape, man's redemption is through Christ as well as his many blessings. Trinity is a deep understanding of God, it attempts to unfold how ALL 3 can be referred to as god often time's as the same 3 are spoken of a distinct individual(God the Father sendsgod the Son, Christ refers to the Holy spirit as he and countless verses make no distinction of him less than GOD). Gen1:26"Let US make Man in OUR Image, after OUR likeness'...Christianity professes a God that loves, how could he from the beginning be a loving God without someone to love?.
These are the issues a Non Trinitarian deals with. The only way to deny them is the outright denial of Scripture(Old and New Testament) and the Jews and those of Islam utilize this tactic because there is no other way.
Trinities are found in almost all pagan religions down through history. It is yet another foreign concept that trickled into Christianity when Jerusalem was taken over by Rome.
A few posters listed many good verses, many of which Jesus spoke himself, saying that the Father is the only true God.
It's said that the Holy Spirit came upon Mary and begot Jesus. But the scriptures say that the Father is Jesus's father. So who is it? The Holy Spirit or the Father?
The Holy Spirit is a spirit, so says Trinitarianism. But the scriptures teach the Father is a spirit, and is also not a man. Trinitarianism teaches there are two distinct spirits, and then one man, but they are all somehow one God? No, the "holy spirit" is God's ruach. It is not a person. It is his working power, his breath, "wind" (God's breath moved upon the waters, etc). There are only two in Heaven at this time. God the Father, and his son Jesus Christ. The Revelation even shows this with Jesus sitting at the right hand of the Father. The Holy Spirit is never mentioned.
The clearest, easiest explanation is almost always true. There is one spirit: The Father. He is God. His only begotten son was Jesus the Christ, who he has given authority and power too. The easiest metaphor for this I have heard is that of the Sun and it's rays. God is the Sun. Jesus is the sunbeam. You see the sunbeam and say it is the sun, but it is not really the sun. It is a reflection of the sun's power. It's image. Just as the scriptures teach Jesus is the image of God.
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