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Jesus said this to the sinner on the cross next to him. Do you think he might have been talking about the time before he would die? Personally I think that the other thief probably experienced the same thing and would repent before he died.
Job said something similar: "I will see my redeemer in the land of the living". Or it may have been in the Psalms or both.
It depends upon where you put the comma. In a properly translated Bible it is like this:
"I say to you today, you will be with me in paradise."
Paradise is when Christ comes in His kingdom to start His millennial reign.
Jesus and the thief both died that day and went to the grave. The thief is still in the grave awaiting his resurrection. Jesus of course already resurrected.
I think the man repented when he said "Remember me...", and went to Heaven when he died. It's really that simple.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber
They were nailed on the cross waiting to die. Not exactly a paradise setting. Jesus was referring to the time after their death.
How about this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej
I think the man repented when he said "Remember me...",.
and as Jesus said many times before (eternal life \ heaven \kingdom of heaven \ Paradise) is a present tense ownership:
John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son haseternallife,
John 5:24
“Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me haseternallife
John 6:47
Very truly I tell you, the one who believes haseternallife.
John 6:54
Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood haseternallife, ..... so much for the Lord's Supper being some "ritual"
Matthew 13:11
He replied, “Because the knowledge of the secrets of the kingdomofheaven has been given to you, but not to them."
Matthew 16:19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”
Matthew 19:14
Jesus said, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.”
so when Jesus assured the man "Today" ... he meant it and yet at the same time was going to fully experience it after he died.
It's like this a Christmas gift that is still unopened:
the gift of God
is eternal life.
Your name is on ... it's currently your gift.
....... you don't fully know what's inside 1 Corinthians 13:12
........ we do know is that anything we can compare it to pales in comparison
........ and yet it isn't fully realized until death opens it for only those who believed prior to death.
Last edited by twin.spin; 05-30-2014 at 02:49 PM..
Jesus said this to the sinner on the cross next to him. Do you think he might have been talking about the time before he would die? Personally I think that the other thief probably experienced the same thing and would repent before he died.
Job said something similar: "I will see my redeemer in the land of the living". Or it may have been in the Psalms or both.
No, Jesus meant exactly what he said. That thief went to Heaven with him THAT day. That's what alot of people Christians and non-Christians alike don't understand. It takes that little to be saved. The faith of a mustard seed.
I believe that Jesus was speaking of Paradise, which is where the repentent thief would await his own resurrection. When Mary first saw the resurrected Christ near the garden tomb on that first Easter morning, He told her not to touch Him since He hadn't yet ascended to His Father who was "in Heaven." So if He told the thief that He'd see Him that day "in Paradise," then Paradise must be a very beautiful and peaceful place, but somewhere different from Heaven. I definitely don't think Christ was referring to the time before they died, as their condition on the cross could hardly be described as Paradise, no matter how you want to fudge on the meaning of the word.
It depends upon where you put the comma. In a properly translated Bible it is like this:
"I say to you today, you will be with me in paradise."
And what makes you so sure that in a "properly translated" Bible, the comma would go after the word "today," instead of after the word, "you"? I mean, it sounds like you are just putting the comma where you believe it should be, based on what you believe Jesus was saying. The only way anyone could know for sure would to have heard Jesus make the statement, in which case His voice inflection would have been the indicating factor.
Quote:
Jesus and the thief both died that day and went to the grave. The thief is still in the grave awaiting his resurrection. Jesus of course already resurrected.
Well, the thief's physical body is clearly still in the grave. He spirit, at least according to the Bible, returned to God when he died.
No. They both died that day. Both their spirits went to heaven. See Luke 23:46.
That spirit is life from God, not a conscious entity at all. Jesus and the thief were dead for 3 days. Jesus had the spirit returned to HIM and was resurrected.
It depends upon where you put the comma. In a properly translated Bible it is like this:
"I say to you today, you will be with me in paradise."
Paradise is when Christ comes in His kingdom to start His millennial reign.
Jesus and the thief both died that day and went to the grave. The thief is still in the grave awaiting his resurrection. Jesus of course already resurrected.
Many miss that because they wanted the resurrection to start then and keep going. It didn't.
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is eternal life.
